Snow White and the Seven Dwarves Mountain Mine Moving Car Coaster

JenniferS

JenniferS

When you're the leader, you don't have to follow.
englanddg said:
That's because Dwarfs is an acceptable, and in many ways tradition, plural for dwarf. Common usage of dwarves (and later acceptance of it) didn't come until recent years.

Go to an astronomy site, for example. They'll say "white dwarfs" not "white dwarves".

Tolkein is credited for the increased popularity of what is now the second official plural, according to Merriam Webster. He wrote in his LOTR appedix (and yes, I had to google this part):

"It may be observed that in this book as in The Hobbit the form dwarves is used, although the dictionaries tell us that the plural of dwarf is dwarfs. It should be dwarrows (or dwerrows), if singular and plural had each gone its own way down the years, as have man and men, or goose and geese. But we no longer speak of a dwarf as often as we do of a man, or even of a goose, and memories have not been fresh enough among Men to keep hold of a special plural for a race now abandoned to folk-tales, where at least a shadow of truth is preserved, or at last to nonsense-stories in which they have become mere figures of fun. But in the Third Age something of their old character and power is still glimpsed, if already a little dimmed: these are the descendants of the Naugrim of the Elder Days, in whose hearts still burns the ancient fire of Aule the Smith, and the embers smoulder of their long grudge against the Elves; in in whose hands still lives the skill in works of stone that none have surpassed.

It is to mark this that I have ventured to use the form dwarves, and so remove them a little, perhaps, from the sillier tales of these latter days.Dwarrows would have been better; but I have used that form only in the name Dwarrowdelf, to represent the name of Moria in the Common Speech:Phurunargian. For that meant 'Dwarf-delving', and yet was already a word of antique form. But Moria is an Elvish name, and given without love..."
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I'm going to give you a "like" for effort; but truthfully, you lost me after the first paragraph.
I'm okay with that.
 
George

George

Liker of Things
Premium Member
englanddg said:
That's because Dwarfs is an acceptable, and in many ways tradition, plural for dwarf. Common usage of dwarves (and later acceptance of it) didn't come until recent years.

Go to an astronomy site, for example. They'll say "white dwarfs" not "white dwarves".

Tolkein is credited for the increased popularity of what is now the second official plural, according to Merriam Webster. He wrote in his LOTR appedix (and yes, I had to google this part):

"It may be observed that in this book as in The Hobbit the form dwarves is used, although the dictionaries tell us that the plural of dwarf is dwarfs. It should be dwarrows (or dwerrows), if singular and plural had each gone its own way down the years, as have man and men, or goose and geese. But we no longer speak of a dwarf as often as we do of a man, or even of a goose, and memories have not been fresh enough among Men to keep hold of a special plural for a race now abandoned to folk-tales, where at least a shadow of truth is preserved, or at last to nonsense-stories in which they have become mere figures of fun. But in the Third Age something of their old character and power is still glimpsed, if already a little dimmed: these are the descendants of the Naugrim of the Elder Days, in whose hearts still burns the ancient fire of Aule the Smith, and the embers smoulder of their long grudge against the Elves; in in whose hands still lives the skill in works of stone that none have surpassed.

It is to mark this that I have ventured to use the form dwarves, and so remove them a little, perhaps, from the sillier tales of these latter days.Dwarrows would have been better; but I have used that form only in the name Dwarrowdelf, to represent the name of Moria in the Common Speech:Phurunargian. For that meant 'Dwarf-delving', and yet was already a word of antique form. But Moria is an Elvish name, and given without love..."
Click to expand...

Here are some more LoTR/Hobbit anecdotes. Did you know that the whole dwarfs/dwarves thing grew out of a misunderstanding that involved scarfs/scarves (both of which are also acceptable). In the original draft Tolkien had all the dwarfs wearing haughty scarves. The editors told him that it looked weird and the plurals had to match. Of course, later on, it was decided that the earthy dwarves probably wouldn't be wearing brilliantly colored designer scarves. The initial draft of FoTR was so fraught with typos that the original title seen only by a few was - "Lord of the Sings: Fellowship of the Sing". This mistake is credited for the rise in popularity of karaoke and ultimately the American Idol Experience which has given the Tolkien estate ample legal ammo in their suit against Disney. However, Tolkien clearly stole the names of the dwarfs in The Hobbit from Disney. Gimli = Grumpy, Balin = Dopey, Bofur = Happy, etc., so it cuts both way.
 
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jdmdisney99

jdmdisney99

Well-Known Member
englanddg said:
That's because Dwarfs is an acceptable, and in many ways tradition, plural for dwarf. Common usage of dwarves (and later acceptance of it) didn't come until recent years.

Go to an astronomy site, for example. They'll say "white dwarfs" not "white dwarves".

Tolkein is credited for the increased popularity of what is now the second official plural, according to Merriam Webster. He wrote in his LOTR appedix (and yes, I had to google this part):

"It may be observed that in this book as in The Hobbit the form dwarves is used, although the dictionaries tell us that the plural of dwarf is dwarfs. It should be dwarrows (or dwerrows), if singular and plural had each gone its own way down the years, as have man and men, or goose and geese. But we no longer speak of a dwarf as often as we do of a man, or even of a goose, and memories have not been fresh enough among Men to keep hold of a special plural for a race now abandoned to folk-tales, where at least a shadow of truth is preserved, or at last to nonsense-stories in which they have become mere figures of fun. But in the Third Age something of their old character and power is still glimpsed, if already a little dimmed: these are the descendants of the Naugrim of the Elder Days, in whose hearts still burns the ancient fire of Aule the Smith, and the embers smoulder of their long grudge against the Elves; in in whose hands still lives the skill in works of stone that none have surpassed.

It is to mark this that I have ventured to use the form dwarves, and so remove them a little, perhaps, from the sillier tales of these latter days.Dwarrows would have been better; but I have used that form only in the name Dwarrowdelf, to represent the name of Moria in the Common Speech:Phurunargian. For that meant 'Dwarf-delving', and yet was already a word of antique form. But Moria is an Elvish name, and given without love..."
Click to expand...
Why thank you for the insight.
 
sshindel

sshindel

The Epcot Manifesto
JenniferS said:
Not a Tolkien fan, so I had to Google this.

An image of said Balrog popped up. Looked just like Chernabog to me.

Is it just me?
Click to expand...

You... Shall... NOT... PASS!

Merlin_vs_Chernabog.jpg
 
PeterMarcus

PeterMarcus

Active Member
englanddg said:
Go to an astronomy site, for example. They'll say "white dwarfs" not "white dwarves".
Click to expand...

Several years ago, I wrote an article for a website about different types of dwarf stars like our sun. I wrote about the populations of yellow dwarves and red dwarves in the galaxy, and an astrophysicist wrote a huge ranting email to me about "dwarfs not dwarves and that jerk Tolkein ruined grammar for the masses"
 

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