Returned From World-Wide FOUR Park Tour: The Deets

Last October I was in Orlando for the Food Festival. In April, I spent three days at the Grand Californian. In May I managed to drop into Disneyland Paris during a Euro trip. And, interestingly, I've found myself now living in Japan and had a chance to visit the parks here. What these experiences have given me is an extraordinary opportunity to understand the disney magic from many different perspectives. The fact that there are four "disneylands", each different, each continuously evolving, means that some of these topics we debate over and over can be approached simply by comparing what is to what in fact has already been done. I will do this now, but mostly I will geek out over all these differences. My focus will be, primarily, the "Magic Kingdom" parks, but I will note the others when applicable. Also, I haven't yet been to HKDL, and obviously not Shanghai, but likely will in the coming year or two. HKDL seems to be a small, meager clone. Well, it was, but now with Mystic Manor and Grizzly Mountain it should be worth visiting.


WDW Orlando - I love WDW. It's my "home resort". I've been there at least 15 times, at least, including a period of DVC membership. My first visits were in the River Country days of the early 90s.

WDW is incomparable. The many resorts - which you can visit (and take horse carriage rides in) even if you aren't staying there - as well as the very well developed 'extras' create an experience unlike any other. The best Disney vacation, in my opinion, is a 10-day-er, with a couple days off, a full day at a water park (with cabana rental), a couple days in Orlando, and at least one A-class extra like Cirque Du Soleil. Okay, that's hard to achieve, and once-in-a-lifetime if you do. But the sense of WDW as a world, with varied experience, magic throughout, and so forth is without compare. I'm saddened by the decline and stagnation of two parks in particular, and the price increases (happening in spite of the stagnation) bother me. But, there's nothing like the World - and you can't compare anything to it. Electric Water Pageant - doesn't exist elsewhere.

As for Magic Kingdom, let me get to the nitty gritty of it. Magic Kingdom, Orlando, is characterized by one thing primarily: space. It takes time to walk from one end to the other. It's characterized by meandering paths, and hidden secrets. I recall eating at the Pecos Bill cafe, discovering a barrel next to the condiment counter which had a hand-drawn map of Pecos Bill's mythical travels in the "wilderness". Amazing. Then you walk and get lost in what was once an extensive Mexican cantina and taco restaurant. What has happened to these places? Do people have fewer sit-down meals? Maybe the food prices have driven people to the "afternoon nap" lunch break at the hotel? Why has the Golden Horseshoe been shut down so long? Regardless.

MK used to have this concept of "transition areas". It used to have comfortable tree shading in the castle plaza. You used to be able to ride the skyway and get a preview of fantasy land and its weird combination of submarines and fantasy architecture from above.

Okay, so why am I focused on nostalgia? Because MK-that-was defines what it is better than what it has become. MK is this: a Disneyland clone, made with more space. That space, plus the isolation of the park which required a long drive through a forest, and a crossing of a large lagoon to arriver there, is what defined it as different. The climate helps too, the South Florida forests perfectly capture both the excitement of a jungle adventure, the mystique of the old south and frontier, and the exotic darkness of magical fairylands. The trees at the periphery of the rivers of America match the theme. The whole place gives you this feel of having delved deep into a mysterious, magical world. Disneyland simply does not capture this, which I'll explain in a bit.

But first, the rides. I feel that there is a general rule for Orlando/Anaheim comparisons: whichever place had a ride first, has the better one. I don't need to mention Pirates, which is clearly better, if not just factually more elaborate, at Anaheim. The key ride to take into consideration here is Haunted Mansion. HM at Florida is considered better, and I'll agree, but disagree. WDW HM has upgrades: the stairs, the queue, the hitchhikers. I even get a kick out of the New England theme. However, the Anaheim version is just more appropriate. The way the queue works, with the mansion itself, the elevator, and the way the doombuggy loading zone represents this having-entered-the-spirit-realm theme just works. It's clear this is an original thought. WDW, in comparison, does seem like a transplant, an effort to replicate something and force its theming. It's not terrible, not as obvious as pirates, and more than compensated for by the upgrades, but it's there. It's the same for all of MK. Transplants, reproductions. And in an era - 1970s - when imagineering technology wasn't going to add anything special to the original. Plus the way rides are spread across the World - the conspicuous absence of Star Tours from Tomorrowland, no Matterhorn, no Indiana Jones... MK is really a different beast than the other "Disneylands". And the best way I can describe it is how I have: space, isolation, magic. This is why I'm sort of disdainful of the plaza expansion and that sort of thing. MK shouldn't be commodified like that, it's not special enough. It doesn't have the flavor and proper attention to original theming. Make it too much about fad-of-the-week meet-and-greets and big fireworks and merch and it loses what makes it special. On the other hand, for most people, MK is their Disneyland, and so it's special because it's the one near them. Remember this when I get to Tokyo Disneyland.


Anaheim

I had the privilege of staying at Grand Californian for three days. Sure, it had great pools, a fantastic lobby, amazing details and decorations (just above and beyond what compares, say the Wilderness Lodge). The proximity to Downtown Disney was pretty cool. I'd say the only disadvantage to this lies in the fact that it's so expensive there that you'd never just stay a night after a "day off" with some time and a movie at Downtown Disney (whereas, you might do that if staying somewhere like Coronado Springs). That's the general rule with DL Anaheim, it's big enough to stay for more than a day, but small enough that you'd not make a long vacation of it. And if you wanted to couple a trip out there with a visit to SoCal in general, well, I'd recommend somewhere cheaper than the DL resorts. DL is a contradiction in that sense in that it's big enough to be a multi-day vacation of its own, but not enough to justify a week, nor "extra" activities - for a resort stay alone. I think this might be why many WDW old-timers have trouble making it out there.

Anyway, Disneyland is great! It makes me, an Orlando veteran, sort of depressed. The Main Street vehicles seem to be always running, the penny arcade has actual penny shows. Everything has great upkeep and is taken very seriously. There's a ragtime piano, a jazz band (though sadly they've sacked the full time marching band). When you pass by a building, it's important and historic because it was created - probably by Walt - for the first time as the solution to a problem that began as a dream. It's pure imagineering. The rides are well-conceived, and even the clones are better designed. For example, Buzz Lightyear is somehow better here, even though it's a clone (one example: the ray guns detach). It's the same as MK, but with more. Finding Nemo submarines, Matterhorn, Indiana Jones. Pirates is better, Autopia is much better. Fantasyland is incredible! The DL staples - kiddy rides like the storybook boats - are duplicated elsewhere, but not in MK. All the old dark rides, which have been plucked from WDW, are there. And they're wonderful! Pinnochio! Toad! Alice! Snow White, which is still there!

The castle is sort of puny, no doubt. And in fact, this puniness is reflected elsewhere - a smaller scaled Main Street, an awkwardly arranged, packed Adventureland. This reflects how DL created a phenomenon somewhat bigger than itself.

This is what I mean about MK - it's not "Disneyland Orlando" - it's the "Magic Kingdom" of "Walt Disney World". There is no Casey Jr. Train ride. And so why I keep speaking of MK as being something other than an Eastern DL clone. No, it's the essence of DL, but is it's own beast. And, my interpretation of what makes it special has already been written.

DL in the end, for the day or two you can spend there, is much more fantastic and fun than Magic Kingdom. Though, understandably, not perhaps as amazing as WDW as a whole. The disadvantage of DL is that it has a packed and cramped feel. And the two edge sword of being a local park vs. a vacation park like WDW. Locals go to DL on the weekend. So it has to constantly please them with new things. This keeps things fresh, but it also means less of an emphasis on enduring nostalgia. For example, one thing I love about MK is the awful animatronic piano man at Cosmic Ray's. I'll rage if they get rid of him. He's magic, he's Orlando, he defines my memory of the Orlando experience.

As for California Adventure, it's become quite the park. I won't go into depth on these extra parks, but CA is wonderful for food, if not packed, and it has enough rides to last at least over a half-day. It's still not perfect, but it's probably doing better then Animal Kingdom (though I love Animal Kingdom immensely and can easily forgive it's half-day reputation, because it's a great half-day).

A final note on Grand Californian: I totally wore my bathing suit to Grizzly Peak, rode three times, then walked, soaked, about five minutes back to my room to change. It was basically worth the money for that alone.

You may notice I haven't gone into much detail about the parks, because I assume "you've" been to them or are familiar. Instead I've given my opinion of it. For the next two, I'll share more details.

Paris

When I went to DL Paris I did not go to the Studios park. It seems like a poor Hollywood studios clone - a Tower of Terror, a couple of movie themed shows (one of which is actually supposedly pretty good), etc. The park is split into "Animation land" and "Film land". They've added a Toy Story land, but this is the cheap carnival-rides-with-Toy-Story-faces thing from HKDL that they are threatening to bring to DHS. The Crush Coaster and Ratatouille rides are well-reviewed, but have perennial long lines. I skipped.

Downtown Disney is a clone. It was very surreal. Rainforest Cafe, "King Ludwig's" a fantasy themed restaurant, a "Western" BBQ restaurant. A disney store, etc. No movies to buy. They even have the hot air balloon. Their movie theatre didn't seem to be interested in featuring English language with subtitle movies while I was there. All full French dub over American actors, which I thought was odd. I wonder how their business is doing. The whole place is pretty kitsch. Most buildings are built like big concrete cubes with distractingly over-compensatory paint jobs. The rainforest cafe is a perfect example, with only the doors being more than flat concrete. I don't know if this was to save money, or if France just doesn't have good building materials, whatever.

The hot air balloon was on the lagoon that was surrounded by the disney hotels. These hotels seem okay, sort of comparable to the WDW value resorts in how they look and seem. The prices were like $600 per night, sadly. I don't know what the deal is with this place, but on to the park.

Disneyland Paris is actually sort of fantastic, in terms of what it reveals about the possibilities of modern imagineering. The entrance actually forces you under the DL hotel which is a pinkified version of Grand Floridian, though much smaller. It's more like a concierge level, park view only hotel. Passing under the hotel you face Main Street Railroad station. This, and Main Street Square, are pretty comparable to Orlando, with elements from Anaheim. What distinguishes Paris Main Street are the indoor side arcades.

I wonder if these arcades are for winter time cold weather, but they are essentially parallel avenues to Main Street, completely indoors. Many of the shops and concessions have windows and doors facing these arcades. One is themed after the statue of liberty, the other, on the "Tomorrowland" side features a Jules Verne theme.

The Jules Verne arcade is amazing. There are posters of a Vernesque, Victorian themed "future". One was labeled: "Los Angeles 2000" etc. There are displays containing famous inventions. It was completely wonderful, the thought and detail of imagineering.

The Castle is superb, Sleeping Beauty, with a much bigger and more beautiful "living stone carved like a tree" sort of mezzanine gallery with the SB story. Under the castle is the "dragon's lair", which is a fantastic animatronic dragon that breathes smoke at guests. This is another one of those fantastic imagineering details that isn't a ride, but just part of the park.

Paris DL has a great Tomorrowland theme, a sort of Jules Verne future they call "discovery land". I like the effort, but I feel like they didn't do enough with it. I would have imagined crystal palace arcade, eiffel steel work buildings and pathways. The whole place is just sort of too open and bland.

I like the reimagining of Space Mountain as a Moon cannon, but I understand they've moved past it for "Mission 2" and besides it was closed while I was there. Here we see that good imagineering can fail if it isn't followed through on. Compared to the Volcano at DisneySea, we can see that this really could have been better.

Oddly, Paris DL has frontier land on the "bottom" and adventure land "above" it, if you know what I mean.

Frontier land is what you'd expect, though a bit cramped and oddly mapped out. The "Phantom Manor" is a great re-imagining of Haunted Mansion, with a more Western Theme and even a sort of dramatic arc. My only complaint about this wonderful re-do is that they kept too much of the old Haunted Mansion. It felt like someone was doing a six-flags resurface of the old ride. But it was built fresh! They should have just completely redone it with the new theme and not kept so many of the old motifs (hat box ghost looking portraits etc.). The worst is the dining hall, which is a near clone of the others, but with a spooky Phantom story. This is grating, considering the whimsy of this scene in its original vision. In the end, though, the Phantom Manor is a positive addition.

One sad thing about frontier land is the rivers of America. This area is 1/3 themed, the rest looking like - well - a french riverside. It's pretty grating and the least the could do is make their geysers function in the geyser area. It is sort of cool how instead of Tom Sawyer island they have BTMRR, with some sort of underwater tunnel for the train to get there.

Adventure land is what's most unique about Paris DL. There's no Jungle Cruise. Instead, this park's version of Tom Sawyer Island is a combination of trails and tunnels themed after Swiss Family Robinson and Captain Hook's pirates. These tunnels are very elaborate and easy to get lost in. I appreciate the abundance of walking activities, especially for a Disney park, but I didn't feel there was an equal measure of sitting places convenient to the tunnels. The parks have never been very good at sitting places.

Pirates at DL Paris is a revelation. It's not easy to describe the differences in just a few words. The theme is like Florida - a Caribbean Spanish fort. However, the place features an indoor restaurant like the Blue Bayou. This one they call the Blue Lagoon. The queue area is like Florida's, but with more palm trees, wider areas, and a better "outside at night" feel. The boat takes you past the diners, and the "Blue Lagoon" feels like a Caribbean beach-side bar.

The boat then goes up a ramp - a genius solution to the problem Florida faces with down - the first thing you see is a flaming wreck of a boat with sounds of battle and swashbuckling. There are shadows behind a tattered sail of sword fighting, and then an animatronic swings by on a rope. It's amazing! Then you meet the jailbirds wooing the dog. Then you drop a little, into the town.

Oddly, after the town you face the cave of the skeletons, followed by the piles of gold. This inversion of narrative is very weird, but certainly something to mix it up a little.

Fantasyland is similar to Anaheim, but with some great (again) imagineering - Alice in Wonderland maze - and my favorite: the "Old Mill" as a slushy stand.

Annoyingly, you can't get to Discoveryland from fantasyland, you have to back to the plaza.

DL Paris isn't perfect, but it's hardly the disaster people describe. It has enough unique "modern" imagineering to make the trip worth it. Seriously, if you're in Paris for a few days, spend one at Disney (40 minutes by convenient train from Paris center, pick up by opera house). I had some problems with rides closing at the same time as many food stands, at peak hours. It was also a big holiday and the crowd was unbearable - I mean just walking through fantasyland, queue times notwithstanding. I assume it's better on less crowded days. Finally, this is the only disney park where you can experience snow!! (well, maybe you can in Tokyo, but we wouldn't know, more on that in a sec) On the castle!! How's that for a disney Christmas.

Tokyo

First of all, as much as Paris is a cheap clone, Tokyo is an expensive one. The park is owned, not by disney, but by Tokyo land company. This company licenses disney's brand and enlists their help, but their whole operation is run by them for their benefit. It shows.

The whole park is about 25 minutes by train from deep downtown Tokyo, and is located on the Bay. What's remarkable about it is how it sparkles. On the train coming in, you can see it and it's bright and beautiful, more so that WDW, well, like WDW when you ride the monorail in on an exciting summer day, except this is just local transit.

The train drops off at a mall area that is very un-disney. It's very high-end and well done. It's like a magic mediterranean multi leveled village.

You can walk to the "disney transport system" which is their monorail. It's more of a train, set up sort of like the Tokyo trains on the inside by with funky curved benches to give a more relaxed feel. The subway handles are Mickey-Mouse shaped, as are the windows. Because this is more of a train, it's a tall monorail, with a weird wall like appearance as it travels along. Also, you have to pay to ride this monorail, which is weird. It has four stops: the mall, DL, third-party hotels, and disneySea.

The third party hotels, like Hilton, look out on the bay and seem quite nice. The disney hotels are 3: a blue colored Disneyland hotel with that sort of del Coronado theme, a 50's themed "ambassador" hotel (like a 50's steamer or train line or something) which rests between the parks, and hotel that looks directly over DisneySea.

DisneySea is as fantastic as you've heard. Please look it up. I'd almost come to Tokyo just to visit DisneySea. That's all I'll say about that.

Tokyo Disneyland has one predominant feature: room for crowds. The whole design, and it's big differences, come from this feature. Another feature of the park is that it's meant for Japanese. This is not "Disney in Japan" this is "Disney for Japan". You are very much a foreigner and a guest there. The biggest place you'll see this is in the food, which is 100% oriented towards local palettes. Though, they seem to "sugar-up" their meals, making curries and dumplings taste much more theme-parky. There is a cool popcorn system with a souvenir bucket you can refill, and popcorn stands listed specially on the map. The flavors are: salt, curry, caramel, honey, and others.

Anyway, the entry has NO railroad station. It's just a big brick wall. It's supposed to be some sort of "crystal palace" expo hall, it's called "world bazaar". But, it looks rather a lot like Main Street U.S.A. (with US themes, Casey's hot dogs, etc.), except with a big glass roof. Maybe this is for rain? One thing this does, however, is break up the long avenue that points you strait at the castle.

The glass roof sort of breaks up the view of the castle, making it feel less necessary to have to go there. Next, there is a left and right way to go that are as wide as the strait way. I think this is to try and get crowds to spread out. Of course, there is no plaza or square.

Now, imagine that 1/3 of the crowd goes left, and 1/3 right, and 1/3 strait. The whole park is basically a circle. The path left goes to Adventureland, but since it originates at Main Street and not the castle it forms a hoop instead of hub-and-spokes. All the major avenues in the park are along this circle.

The castle plaza itself is enormous and puts the MK hub re-devlopment to shame in terms of a wide, open space for crowds. The Walt and Mickey statue is forward of the plaza center. The plaza center itself is just a manicured crowd swallower.

This really gives perspective. If you want to handle crowds, you do this. I think we need to start chilling out about MK. MK is not Disneyland, it shouldn't be so darn crowded. It should be shared between the other WDW parks. It should be hub-and-spokes and isolated and magical. But, if we want to just all watch fireworks all the time and have big crowds then we should just tear down MK and build it after Tokyo's model. My point is that I'd like to see MK as less of a keystone of WDW and more of just another park among many there. They should have spent the hub plaza and fantasyland money on Epcot.

Adventureland - pirates - this ride is more like Anaheim, complete with a Blue Bayou restaurant. I'm pretty sure there are a couple scenes in here that were in Paris but not anywhere else (meaning Paris copied Tokyo a little), but actually I think Anaheim has those scenes (the pistol fight in the gunpowder room), and I'm just used to Orlando's pathetic pirates. Sadly, Johnny Depp found his way to Tokyo (not Paris!)

This pirates ride comes with an attached mini-New Orleans area, but this isn't big enough to get its own designation on the map.

The Jungle Cruise entrance, on top, is the train. The train goes around the jungle cruise, and the rivers of America, through a "primeval world" clone, then back. It doesn't take you anywhere, it's truly a ride. Very weird, but more honest in a way.

Adventure land and "western land" are themed nicely, clean, fun, and total clones. There's no original imagineering here, just really well done copies.

Haunted Mansion is an Orlando clone. Fantasy land has Anaheim staples, and even the Alice maze! There's a toon town copy, which is interesting since that place is unique to Anaheim.

The castle is Cinderella, a little bigger than Orlando's but much the same. There's no restaurant inside, but instead an elaborate retelling of Cinderella's story with beautiful and varied art dioramas, followed by a throne room with glass slipper perfect for picture taking (complete with full dressed teenage girls taking pictures very very seriously).

Tomorrowland is like Orlando's. Star Tours is the new "adventures continue" (didn't catch if Paris Star Tours was the original). They have a Monsters Inc. dark ride, but it was closed so I didn't catch it. Is it the same as the DCA?

Well, you get the point.


Conclusion

So, that's that. You have all those elements we talk about: next-level imagineering, different categories of clones, parks built for crowds, the difference details make, the difference money makes.

Bringing it all back, I'll reiterate: Magic Kingdom is not Disneyland Orlando. It shouldn't be thought of as the heart of WDW. It should be less crowded, and take advantage of its space and isolation to create a magical feel. Wonder should be felt at Epcot, etc. Magic at Magic Kingdom.

It's hard to better describe what I mean. But I will say this: I hate the hub redevelopment. For all those that herald it, I say: let's cut back on the fireworks. Let's stop worrying about the parades. Let's stop treating MK like a must-do. It's just another part of a larger resort, that's how it came to be.

I'm excited about Shanghai disney. I'm sure it will have Paris's imagineering, and I'm curious about the Chinese cultural accommodations. I'm sure the food will be incredible. I'm curious about HKDL. I don't think it can add more to what I've already experienced, but I have to make it out there.

And, hopefully you guys can make it out to the other places.
 

marni1971

Park History nut
Premium Member
A very good read thank you! Lots of interesting and valid comments. However, I must defend DLP where needed with some additional insight...

Paris

When I went to DL Paris I did not go to the Studios park. It seems like a poor Hollywood studios clone - a Tower of Terror, a couple of movie themed shows (one of which is actually supposedly pretty good), etc. The park is split into "Animation land" and "Film land".

The Stuios had a bad reputation, and deservedly so. However since 2008 huge changes for the better have been made to begin to address the problems, from placemaking to additional attractions. A superior RnRC, unique Cinemagique and Armegeddon, and the excellent Crush (now with single riders) and well received Rat ride have further improved it. Over the next few years when the park footprint is extended again the park should be worthy of a full day. No argument about Playland though.


The rainforest cafe is a perfect example, with only the doors being more than flat concrete. I don't know if this was to save money, or if France just doesn't have good building materials, whatever.
Blame Eisner. He rejected a New Orleans theme for DTD and went for an industrial storyline and look. They've begun to try to move away from the original feel of the village but there's a lot to do yet.

The prices were like $600 per night, sadly. I don't know what the deal is with this place, but on to the park.
Where did you see that? Even booking through the official website, for peak times, rooms at the mods are around $100-150 a night with breakfast and park hoppers.


It's pretty grating and the least the could do is make their geysers function in the geyser area.
Again, a long time coming, but they should be rebuilt and fully working again sometime next year.

It's no secret DLP has been saddled with poor planning, huge debt and sheer bad luck. Thankfully these things are being relegated to the past with each passing year.
 

tman2000

Member
Original Poster
The Stuios had a bad reputation, and deservedly so. However since 2008 huge changes for the better have been made to begin to address the problems, from placemaking to additional attractions. A superior RnRC, unique Cinemagique and Armegeddon, and the excellent Crush (now with single riders) and well received Rat ride have further improved it. Over the next few years when the park footprint is extended again the park should be worthy of a full day. No argument about Playland though.

I skipped it, but I did say that it seemed to be getting better.

And, like I said, DLP is a must for Disney fans who make it to France. Absolutely has to be experienced. I'm glad to hear it's getting better.

I don't know why I was seeing $600 per night prices for hotels (5 months out). Although, now I remember it was Pentecost weekend, so maybe that's why.. I didn't know at the time, that's when we happened to be in the area.
 

Jon81uk

Well-Known Member
DLP doesn't currently have Star Tours The Adventure Continues or the Jack Sparrow animatronic but these are expected to come.

Disney have realised Paris is falling apart, although the original rides are good maiantance had been poor, in part due to the debt issues. It is expected everything will be fixed for the 25th anniversary in 2017, hence Space being closed when you were there and Thunder is going down soon too. Hopefully when Star Tours is updated and the other fixes done DLP will be back to opening day glory for its 25th and then they can continue improving on Eisners cheap-skating at the Studios.
 

FlaggNL

Well-Known Member
Thanks for this great report. As a long time DLP lover (for quite some years the only Disney park we visited) I think you describe it well. Although you absolutely can find rooms cheaper than $600, depending on which resort you wanna stay. But I have to admit that since we have been to WDW we will not be as much in DLP as before. Of course it is not easy for us to go to WDW and it is expensive, but we already booked 2 trips to WDW, October 2015 and October 2016. The other Disney parks in the world are on the wishlist for someday in the future :)

Btw I found a cheap DLP trip even for Disneyland Hotel. € 250 per person for a 3 day and 2 night stay :) Considering for booking it!
 

HolleBolleGijs

Well-Known Member
Fun fact, you can get to Discoveryland from Fantasyland, just not all of the time. There's a nice wooded path directly to the right of IASW that's kinda sorta back stage. It's closed most of the day, because the parade floats use that area as an entrance and exit. Took me a while to find!

I always love hearing what people think about DLP. It definitely has it's problems, but there's a lot that makes it special. Tokyo is on my bucket list! Someday...
 

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