Quality Continues to Drop

CRO-Magnum

Active Member
Original Poster
I returned from WDW this past Thursday (2/26) and found my trip disappointing. Guests were among the most friendly in recent history, cast members were decent (no sniping) and even funny in some cases, but maintenance is poor. I counted 6 major maintenance items on Splash Mountain alone in one ride that detract from the show including the leapfrog fountains which haven't been operating since last year. Big Thunder no longer has the two road wheels, one set being removed for "safety issues" which I read as lowered maintenance costs after operating safely for 20+ years. Test Track's ABS proving ground used to have fake orange cones you would drive over out of control and they would pop back up for the next car - now they just lie flat on their backs so you have no idea you weren't supposed to go that way until you see the video. Massive paint chips, broken sidewalks, exposed electrical wiring, everything I expect from Six Flags, not Disney.

It's hard to engage people's imagination when they can see it isn't magic, but hard work that makes things happen. Reality sets in and makes a statement as to how guests are valued when that hard work is no longer seen as worth the effort.
 

Sir Hiss527

New Member
Welcome to WDWMAGIC

First of all, Splash Mountain is kind of going through a rehab at the moment, with the ride still open, and operating. I'm not sure about Big Thunder Mountain. I'm sorry you didn't have such a magical trip...Sorry!
 

ISTCrew20

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by CRO-Magnum
I returned from WDW this past Thursday (2/26) and found my trip disappointing. Guests were among the most friendly in recent history, cast members were decent (no sniping) and even funny in some cases, but maintenance is poor. I counted 6 major maintenance items on Splash Mountain alone in one ride that detract from the show including the leapfrog fountains which haven't been operating since last year. Big Thunder no longer has the two road wheels, one set being removed for "safety issues" which I read as lowered maintenance costs after operating safely for 20+ years. Test Track's ABS proving ground used to have fake orange cones you would drive over out of control and they would pop back up for the next car - now they just lie flat on their backs so you have no idea you weren't supposed to go that way until you see the video. Massive paint chips, broken sidewalks, exposed electrical wiring, everything I expect from Six Flags, not Disney.

It's hard to engage people's imagination when they can see it isn't magic, but hard work that makes things happen. Reality sets in and makes a statement as to how guests are valued when that hard work is no longer seen as worth the effort.


And some broken fountains, and 2 cones ruined your vacation? wow:hammer: ...


Actually, those fountains were operating 3 months ago, but they were shut down again. A normal guest wouldn't even know they were there anyways. IMO, You are being way to critical.
 

mkt

When a paradise is lost go straight to Disney™
Premium Member
Originally posted by CRO-Magnum
I returned from WDW this past Thursday (2/26) and found my trip disappointing. Guests were among the most friendly in recent history, cast members were decent (no sniping) and even funny in some cases, but maintenance is poor. I counted 6 major maintenance items on Splash Mountain alone in one ride that detract from the show including the leapfrog fountains which haven't been operating since last year. Big Thunder no longer has the two road wheels, one set being removed for "safety issues" which I read as lowered maintenance costs after operating safely for 20+ years. Test Track's ABS proving ground used to have fake orange cones you would drive over out of control and they would pop back up for the next car - now they just lie flat on their backs so you have no idea you weren't supposed to go that way until you see the video. Massive paint chips, broken sidewalks, exposed electrical wiring, everything I expect from Six Flags, not Disney.

It's hard to engage people's imagination when they can see it isn't magic, but hard work that makes things happen. Reality sets in and makes a statement as to how guests are valued when that hard work is no longer seen as worth the effort.

2 things wrong and you're complaining? Maybe I'm used to is since I'm at the parks several times a week... but I don't see those things are detrimental to the magic.
 

Disney2002

New Member
In terms of writing off safety changes as being lazy, cost saving measures... think of how painfully safe disney has to make everything.

With every jerk filing lawsuits because they're too dumb not to do this and that, Disney is forced to cover their butts in every way possible. Once people take responsibility for their own actions (yes, you eat at McDonalds every day, then you made yourself fat), perhaps such precautions won't be required.
 

Michael72688

New Member
Re: Re: Quality Continues to Drop

Originally posted by ISTCrew20
And some broken fountains, and 2 cones ruined your vacation? wow:hammer: ...


Actually, those fountains were operating 3 months ago, but they were shut down again. A normal guest wouldn't even know they were there anyways. IMO, You are being way to critical.

I know, thats what I thought
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by CRO-Magnum
Test Track's ABS proving ground used to have fake orange cones you would drive over out of control and they would pop back up for the next car - now they just lie flat on their backs so you have no idea you weren't supposed to go that way until you see the video.

Test track goes down for a few days of rehab next week. Since the attractions you complained about are E-tickets, which is worse? To be constanhtly taking them down for rehab or to have a few elements not worek and be able to make thousands of peoples happy?
 

CTXRover

Well-Known Member
Re: Re: Quality Continues to Drop

Originally posted by PhotoDave219
Test track goes down for a few days of rehab next week. Since the attractions you complained about are E-tickets, which is worse? To be constanhtly taking them down for rehab or to have a few elements not worek and be able to make thousands of peoples happy?

That is actually kind of ironic. From one thread to another there are complaints that some attractions are not in 100% pristine condition but then there are others which have complaints that they shouldn't be closing attractions down for a month or more to do full rehabs on them. What gives? I don't know what to think :lol:

Sorry CRO-Magnum to hear your trip wasn't 100%. Hopefully in the future it will be better. But you can't blame Disney for rude guests. I actually think as a society people have just become less caring about other people and their surroundings. But I'm glad to hear you didn't have any CM problems. As for Splash...its actually undergoing a major rehab right now while keeping the attraction open. Hopefully whatever wasn't working 100% will be fixed during this process. The Big Thunder wheels WERE removed for safety and not for cost-cutting (why is it that everything is blamed on cost-cutting :rolleyes: ). It was believed that these decorative wheel coverings might have somehow contributed to the unfortunate accident at Disneyland's Thunder. Since they served no purpose beyond decoration...I believe they were removed from all BTMRR trains, FOR SAFETY. And I would expect the Test Track cones to be fixed during next week's rehab of TT.
 

ClemsonTigger

Naturally Grumpy
Second Wheel on Thunder Mountain

Sorry, but your conclusion is wrong about cutting corners on maintenance and the ride being safe for 20 years. The reason that the cosmetic wheel has been removed is that it was the cause of the accident that killed the young man in Disneyland. Yes, with perfect maintenance this wouldn't have happened, but as it is cosmetic, why bother.
 

AndyMagic

Well-Known Member
Re: Second Wheel on Thunder Mountain

Originally posted by ClemsonTigger
Sorry, but your conclusion is wrong about cutting corners on maintenance and the ride being safe for 20 years. The reason that the cosmetic wheel has been removed is that it was the cause of the accident that killed the young man in Disneyland. Yes, with perfect maintenance this wouldn't have happened, but as it is cosmetic, why bother.
Every report that I have read on the matter says nothing about the cosmetic wheel causing the accident. The accident accured because the device that holds one of the wheels to the track (I believe it was the "upstop wheel") broke and the train derailed. The accident was caused by both the maintenance department not recognizing the faulty wheel and the CM's who didn't stop the train when they heard the noise. That is what it says in the report. Why is everyone pretending it was this cosmetic wheel?
 

AndyMagic

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Disney2002
Where and when was this official accident report made public?
The final official report was released about 2 months ago and was announced on nearly every major news channel and website. Do a search on this site and you'll find a thread about it.
 

AndyMagic

Well-Known Member
Here... I saved you time:

http://forums.wdwmagic.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=31142&highlight=Accident+Report

Here's the text from Reuters...

------------------------------------------------------------------

Disneyland fatal accident linked to maintenance
Wednesday November 26, 1:10 pm ET


LOS ANGELES, Nov 26 (Reuters) - Faulty maintenance on a Disneyland roller coaster led to the September accident which killed a man on the ride, Walt Disney Co. said on Wednesday.

The admission by the Burbank, California-based media giant that owns the Walt Disney World theme park in Florida and Disneyland in Southern California, has raised further questions about the company's liability in the mishap.

"Our own analysis found that the accident was caused by incorrectly performed maintenance tasks required by Disneyland policy and procedures that resulted in a mechanical failure," spokeswoman Leslie Goodman said in a statement.

"At no time have we ever done anything which we believe would compromise the level of safety required for the safe operation of our attraction," the statement said.

The Big Thunder Railroad roller coaster, which barrels along a track like a runaway mine train, partially derailed on Sept. 5, killing one rider, 22-year-old Marcelo Torres.

Wylie Aitken, the lawyer for the Torres family, said the train had derailed because a piece intended to keep it on the track, called an upstop wheel, fell off the locomotive at the front of the roller coaster.

As a result, the locomotive had jumped the track, causing the accident, Aitken said.

"We found out what happened. now the question is going to by why it happened," Aitken told Reuters, referring to his own investigation and adding that the accident could be a sign of wider, systematic problems at the park.

Goodman denied the notion of further problems with maintenance, but did not give details about the procedures that were incorrectly performed.

"We believe that our maintenance system incorporates the best modern management practices and safety procedures. We constantly evaluate and explore new ways to improve our operations," she said.

"Our long-standing commitment to safety remains the same. Anyone who suggests otherwise is simply wrong."

State safety investigators at the California Division of Occupational Safety and Health separately are in the final stage of a probe into the accident and due to release their report on Wednesday.

END ARTICLE


Just like I said. It was the upstop wheel and poor maintenance. So please, let's not make up our own theories about cosmetic wheels on the front of the train causing the accident. Because it clearly isn't true. Lastly, here is the link to the official accident report:
http://www.mpimages.net/dlr/compres...derAccident/thundermountainaccidentreport.pdf
 

CTXRover

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by AndyMagic


Just like I said. It was the upstop wheel and poor maintenance. So please, let's not make up our own theories about cosmetic wheels on the front of the train causing the accident. Because it clearly isn't true. [

I am NOT making stuff up. The wheels coverings were removed PRIOR to this official report on the cause of the accident. I am almost 100% certain that at the time the wheel coverings were removed it was stated (or at least was reported by someone) that Walt Disney World removed them because they believed (at least at that time) those wheel coverings may have been involved in some way. Obviously a much larger and serious reason was found, but I am not making up my own theories on why they removed them to try and deceive anyone. The fact that someone else here also heard that may mean something. I will try and find that article...but it has been a while.
 

AndyMagic

Well-Known Member
How would a fake wheel that never touches the track in the first place be a cause for anything? :hammer: And why would Disney announce anything until the official report was released. I seem to remember that Disney refused to release information regarding the incident until the report was released. Not to metion, even early speculation was that it was the fault of the upstop wheel. I'm not saying you are lieing, I am just saying perhaps you were misinformed? Anywho... the point is, in the end, the cosmetic wheels weren't at fault so there is no reason they should still be off.
 

CTXRover

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by AndyMagic
How would a fake wheel that never touches the track in the first place be a cause for anything? :hammer: And why would Disney announce anything until the official report was released. I seem to remember that Disney refused to release information regarding the incident until the report was released. Not to metion, even early speculation was that it was the fault of the upstop wheel. I'm not saying you are lieing, I am just saying perhaps you were misinformed? Anywho... the point is, in the end, the cosmetic wheels weren't at fault so there is no reason they should still be off.

Perhaps I was misinformed..and I apologize if I am. I rarely ever post anything unless I am pretty confident it is right...I never meant to deceive anyone. Since I can't find where I read this, I obviously can not back it up. I do remember that upon hearing the wheel coverings were being removed that this was the reason and it has stuck in my head...for the same reasons you are questioning it....what did they really have to do with the accident? (My guess....perhaps at one time it was believed they could have fallen off and got underneath the wheels of the cars) But for some reason, I remember hearing this. If anyone else did, please let me know that I'm not completely mistaken on this...again, I aplogize if I am.
 

Defend10

Member
The man at DL died not just because a train derailed, but because he was struck in the chest by a large object coming from the locomotive. When the train derailed, this forced a large section of the back half of the locomotive up, it struck the ceiling of the tunnel they were in, and came down on him.

I believe, from what I've been able to compile, that this was a portion of the wheel base. This could very easily account forthe removal of the decorative wheels. Should they have another problem, any object could become a projectile as happened at DL. If they weren't the root of the problem, this could easily have been done simply as preventative, for if the same problem occured, it would simply have less mass to throw at the passengers.

This is all judging from what I read as and after the incident occured, so it's possible I could be missing the mark. My memory of the incident does seem pretty clear though.
 

Disney2002

New Member
Originally posted by CTXRover
I am NOT making stuff up. The wheels coverings were removed PRIOR to this official report on the cause of the accident. I am almost 100% certain that at the time the wheel coverings were removed it was stated (or at least was reported by someone) that Walt Disney World removed them because they believed (at least at that time) those wheel coverings may have been involved in some way. Obviously a much larger and serious reason was found, but I am not making up my own theories on why they removed them to try and deceive anyone. The fact that someone else here also heard that may mean something. I will try and find that article...but it has been a while.

I buy it. What was posted above was not an accident report, as stated, but rather a press release. VERY different pieces of information.
 

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