Principal Author of Anaheim’s Living Wage Law Says Disney’s Not Exempt - OC Weekly

Old Mouseketeer

Well-Known Member
These are political enticements for the companies to not move their business operations to locations to more attractive locations such as Anaheim once was in comparison to Burbank where the Studios were located in 1955. Assuming that an established company is a captive audience that you can continue to impose additional local regulation and taxation without consequences (such as them investing elsewhere) is foolish.

Your first point is not a valid comparison. Burbank would have had zero reason to try to keep Walt's folly in their city. It was an unproven idea at that time. The factors that led to the choice of Anaheim were demographic and geographic. I've never heard that local regulation or incentives were even on the radar. Walt simply needed more land for his dream park and wanted to locate it in a growing area.

Your second point misrepresents the reality in Anaheim. The point isn't to squeeze Disney dry and force them to take development out of Anaheim--it's to restore some balance. IMHO, Disney has overplayed their hand on a couple of fronts: they depressed wages too far over the past 30+years and they muscled their way into sweetheart deals with Anaheim with their Long Beach flim flam and a compliant city council. Now that the spotlight has been focused on these situations, Disney is adjusting their behavior.

Finally, I think the whole idea of government entities giving incentives for private development and profit has gotten entirely out of hand (and control). I'm sick of the practice of socializing the risk and privatizing the profits.
 
D

Deleted member 107043

Your second point misrepresents the reality in Anaheim. The point isn't to squeeze Disney dry and force them to take development out of Anaheim--it's to restore some balance. IMHO, Disney has overplayed their hand on a couple of fronts: they depressed wages too far over the past 30+years and they muscled their way into sweetheart deals with Anaheim with their Long Beach flim flam and a compliant city council. Now that the spotlight has been focused on these situations, Disney is adjusting their behavior.


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TP2000

Well-Known Member
And again I say.... Eisner's stupid parking structure deal from 1996! :eek:

Disney just needs to cut a check for the $100 Million the parking structure cost to build in 1998, plus admin costs and interest for the past 20 years, and buy the structure from Anaheim outright. The check dated December 1, 2018 would probably be around $200 Million, but that trendy 1990's parking structure deal would be settled and buried six feet under for good.

And if Disneyland really is making $35 Million per year in parking fees from that structure, buying it outright now for $200 Million is not really that bad of a business case.

The 20 year old parking structure deal seems to be the only thing left that political opponents hold up as a "tax deal" or "city subsidy" for Disneyland's business model with Anaheim. If there was something else out there we'd already know about it. Buy the parking structure outright, put the 1990's into the history books for good, and just move forward.
 
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Disney Irish

Premium Member
And again I say.... Eisner's stupid parking structure deal from 1996! :eek:

Disney just needs to cut a check for the $100 Million the parking structure cost in 1998, plus admin costs and interest for the past 20 years, and buy the structure from Anaheim outright. The check dated December 1, 2018 would probably be around $200 Million, but that trendy 1990's parking structure deal would be settled and buried six feet under for good.

And if Disneyland really is making $35 Million per year in parking fees from that structure, buying it outright now for $200 Million is not really that bad of a business case.

The 20 year old parking structure deal seems to be the only thing left that political opponents hold up as a "tax deal" or "city subsidy" for Disneyland's business model with Anaheim. If there was something else out there we'd already know about it. Buy the parking structure outright, put the 1990's into the history books for good, and just move forward.

Send this nice gem of an idea with the nice neighbor lady to take back to Josh....
 

Darkbeer1

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
And again I say.... Eisner's stupid parking structure deal from 1996! :eek:

Disney just needs to cut a check for the $100 Million the parking structure cost to build in 1998, plus admin costs and interest for the past 20 years, and buy the structure from Anaheim outright. The check dated December 1, 2018 would probably be around $200 Million, but that trendy 1990's parking structure deal would be settled and buried six feet under for good.

And if Disneyland really is making $35 Million per year in parking fees from that structure, buying it outright now for $200 Million is not really that bad of a business case.

The 20 year old parking structure deal seems to be the only thing left that political opponents hold up as a "tax deal" or "city subsidy" for Disneyland's business model with Anaheim. If there was something else out there we'd already know about it. Buy the parking structure outright, put the 1990's into the history books for good, and just move forward.

But Anaheim doesn't own the structure, they were just the administrator of multiple government grants specifically designed to pay for and build the structure. Disney can't just buy it. The basic language says if Disney defaults on the payment and use of the structure, then the city is allowed to be the administrator and find a way to use it for other things, such as for the company that replaces Disney who has stopped using it, or for the Convention Center. Basically, the Parking Structure is owned by the Parking Structure..... Once it ends its useful life (40 years), then Disney gets the Parking Structure out right.

The Structure's mission statement is to keep vehicles off of city roadways and improve traffic in the area, that is why the Federal Government, The State of California and the County of Orange provided the funds to build it and the Ball Street Overpass (aka bridge).

Think of it like an Interstate Freeway. The state just can't close it and sell the land. Yes, the state, as part of the agreement is responsible for its upkeep and maintenance, but the Federal government mandates how it is to be used.
 

Old Mouseketeer

Well-Known Member
But Anaheim doesn't own the structure, they were just the administrator of multiple government grants specifically designed to pay for and build the structure. Disney can't just buy it. The basic language says if Disney defaults on the payment and use of the structure, then the city is allowed to be the administrator and find a way to use it for other things, such as for the company that replaces Disney who has stopped using it, or for the Convention Center. Basically, the Parking Structure is owned by the Parking Structure..... Once it ends its useful life (40 years), then Disney gets the Parking Structure out right.

The Structure's mission statement is to keep vehicles off of city roadways and improve traffic in the area, that is why the Federal Government, The State of California and the County of Orange provided the funds to build it and the Ball Street Overpass (aka bridge).

Think of it like an Interstate Freeway. The state just can't close it and sell the land. Yes, the state, as part of the agreement is responsible for its upkeep and maintenance, but the Federal government mandates how it is to be used.

Yeah, you dirty hippies--Parking structures are people, too! Now get off my lawn!!!
 
D

Deleted member 107043

Think of it like an Interstate Freeway. The state just can't close it and sell the land. Yes, the state, as part of the agreement is responsible for its upkeep and maintenance, but the Federal government mandates how it is to be used.

Federal dollars paid for that thing? 🙄 What an absolutely absurd deal.
 

Darkbeer1

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Federal dollars paid for that thing? 🙄 What an absolutely absurd deal.


The effort to get the Federal government to pay for the parking structures failed. The request was for $223 million but the Federal contribution was limited to $17.5 million. The state of California tossed in $60 million and Orange County paid $36 million.

The Federal Government basically paid for the Ball Road Overpass, something the residents of Anaheim are grateful for every time they drive down Ball Road.
 

Disney Irish

Premium Member
Federal dollars paid for that thing? 🙄 What an absolutely absurd deal.

A majority of transportation projects in the US get some type of federal funding. This is what that little federal gas tax is for when you fill up at the pump. It goes to help build and maintain the US road system that we use mostly for free (minus some local municipal tolls).
 
D

Deleted member 107043

A majority of transportation projects in the US get some type of federal funding. This is what that little federal gas tax is for when you fill up at the pump. It goes to help build and maintain the US road system that we use mostly for free (minus some local municipal tolls).

Combative as usual.

This project was framed as a public transportation project, but in reality it was a replacement for Disneyland's parking lot, which of course was set to become DCA.

How does the Kool-Aid taste? Is it sweet enough for you?
 

networkpro

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
Your first point is not a valid comparison. Burbank would have had zero reason to try to keep Walt's folly in their city. It was an unproven idea at that time. The factors that led to the choice of Anaheim were demographic and geographic. I've never heard that local regulation or incentives were even on the radar. Walt simply needed more land for his dream park and wanted to locate it in a growing area s.

You don't know your park history, that's obvious. Burbank turned down Disney's application for appropriate zoning.

Your rebuttal to the second point is ludicrous. Disney provides jobs with a known wage and no one is forced to work there. You also see the effects of what extractive legislation does for the company's expenditure plans.. the new luxury hotel iproject is gone and Downtown Disney is reverting to what it was before the expansion was announced.

The Kim Jung-Un applause is appropriate : government command economy
 

Disney Irish

Premium Member
Combative as usual.

This project was framed as a public transportation project, but in reality it was a replacement for Disneyland's parking lot, which of course was set to become DCA.

How does the Kool-Aid taste? Is it sweet enough for you?

But it was more than a parking structure that the funds were used for. This is what everyone who paints Disney as greedy seems to forget. It was improvements for the whole Resort District that Anaheim wanted in order to push more business to their Convention Center.

So everyone benefited in this deal.

Could Disney have built M&F on their own without the bond, absolutely. But they couldn't redo the entire Resort District, which is what Anaheim wanted. It was a combined public/private deal that benefited everyone involved.
 

Practical Pig

Well-Known Member
But it was more than a parking structure that the funds were used for. This is what everyone who paints Disney as greedy seems to forget. It was improvements for the whole Resort District that Anaheim wanted in order to push more business to their Convention Center.

So everyone benefited in this deal.

Could Disney have built M&F on their own without the bond, absolutely. But they couldn't redo the entire Resort District, which is what Anaheim wanted. It was a combined public/private deal that benefited everyone involved.

Time has demonstrated that the benefit to Disney was a double-edged blade, given the disastrous backlash backslash.
 

Darkbeer1

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Let's look at the 1996 deal...

http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-16/news/mn-24723_1_disney-theme-park

>>Seeking to allay worries about an extra burden on Anaheim taxpayers, the Walt Disney Co. and city officials on Monday said hotel bed taxes, sales taxes and state and federal grants would fully finance the $550 million needed to improve streets, landscaping and utilities for an expanded Anaheim Convention Center and a second Disney theme park.<<

So we have a $550 million package, $150 million funded by various grants. Those grants are the $110 million for the parking structure and Ball Road Overpass, plus a large grant the city got for improving air quality in setting up the ART transportation system, both from the Federal Government and State Government. Also Transportation grants for road improvements in the entire Resort area, plus a few others.

>>Anaheim plans to issue nearly $400 million in bonds to finance the improvements and provide $150 million to expand the convention center.

Hotel and sales taxes as well as tourist revenue would pay the interest on the bonds, according to city officials.

In case of a shortfall, Disney would guarantee about $200 million of the debt, agreeing to step in and pay investors if the city can't.

At an afternoon briefing, City Manager James Ruth portrayed the financing approach as a "partnership" and an "unprecedented collaboration between the public and private sector that minimizes municipal risk."

Officials estimate the Disneyland Resort expansion, expected to be unveiled in full this week, will generate annually an additional $25 million for the city of Anaheim, $10 million for Orange County and $35 million for California through various sales and property taxes within the resort area.<<

So out of the $550 million, about $100 million for the parking structure, and $150 million for a large expansion for the city owned convention center. leaving the rest for the general "to improve streets, landscaping and utilities" plus buy the ART fleet and other general items.

That $150 million built a large expansion for the Convention Center (other funds came from profits made in prior years from the center). This expansion brought a lot of new business to the city, in fact, with the failure of DCA in the early years, a lot of the Hotel and Restaurant Growth came from the convention business. Heck, Ruth Chris's and Morton's didn't come for Disneyland, but for the business expenses accounts. Another large expansion just finished, paid for by the profits made from the 1996 expansion. It creates a lot of jobs and tax revenue.

When the City brokered the deal with Disney, the city got everything it wanted, and thought it was a win-win, and it has created more tax revenues than expected, money that goes directly to the city's General Fund, basically half of the cities revenue comes from the resort district.

If you see what has done to the city residents, well, increased government spending, improvements in the city's parks, the addition of many more police officers, a department that trains many other cities in how to do things, aka a gold standard. And remember that Disney directly pays for the 10 officers that work on property, plus all the hours needed for traffic control on city streets in regards to parking control. Low costs from the city's public utilities, same with the building department. How many jobs are due to the resort. how much sales taxes, how about property tax revenue.

If there are issues with the residents, one big one is jealousy, I hear it all the time, why does the Resort area have better roads, landscaping, police presence, etc. They don't realize that doesn't come from the general fund, but for a part of the TOT tax and convention center profits earmarked to provide the upkeep. (A small percentage does come from the general, the amount that is spent on the rest of the city. For example, if the city spends $1 per foot of roads, the resort area also gets allocated the same amount. But the resort area spends $4 per foot. Well the other $3 comes from the resort district funds from the TOT surcharge, and Convention Center profits. The city cannot shortchange the district of the general fund dollars due to legal rulings.

The other big problem was the "Disney is Evil" campaign that the ACLU, UNITE HERE and others came up with years ago, about the time there was a legal push to convert at-large council members to district elections. This is straight out of the Left's playbook in demonizing corporations and trying to gain more control for Democrat in Anaheim and Orange County.

It wasn't an issue, maybe some complaints about fireworks, but that was it.

So the campaigning that was picked up by Mayor Tait, Dr. Moreno and others, continuing the "Disney is Evil" theme in its campaigns, and comments from the council chambers.

Has Disney gotten special treatment from the city, of course yes, but they, along with the convention center and resort area pays the city's bills and allows a lot better level of services than other nearby cities, many of which have tax increases on the ballot in their city, or just passed one (Station is one example). Now the city is $7 million short in the upcoming budget due to the expected income from the 4th Hotel project. (Loss of the Construction jobs and related revenue). Looks like the city will cut planned items as a short term fix.
 

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