Manifest Destiny: A Lifetime Walt Disney World Fan's First Trip To Disneyland

[tirian]

Found that out after my trip. It's quite the conundrum.

That's why I go to both resorts and don't compare them the whole time.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

DL's Fantasyland may be the best land in any Disney park overall. I have a lot of issues with WDW's NFL. Everything is apparently geared towards little girls, the new attractions are all underwhelming aside from certain elements and the old FL really suffered from the removal of yet another dark ride (I don't consider the mine train a fair trade, or, I should say a necessary trade) and moving Dumbo in the corner of the park out of the FL midway. I also understand that it increased capacity, but I think the double Dumbos looks stupid. It does look awesome though, for the most part. There is a lot more space, but the attractions themselves can't stand up to DL's for me. A lot of what remains of the old FL really needs the DL 80s NFL treatment.

I would say I enjoy Indy and CTX kind of equally, but I admit they are both guilty pleasures that put more emphasis on thrills than the richly-detailed environments and AAs that you can take in on the slower moving dark rides which I prefer. Indy ain't perfect--it's loaded with corny underwhelming effects, it seems like they ran out of money between the main chamber and boulder and the portrayal of Indy himself is kind of awful. It somehow balances out between Indy's queue experience and main chamber Disney-gasm (which they perfectly milked by having the transport slow down/stop twice) and CTX's wacky Dr. Seeker and overall terror of being jostled around in the dark with massive dino AAs screaming loudly in your face. I like that CTX is kind of terrifying.

 

[tirian]

By the way, @Mike S, I'm glad to see you made it to California! Every Disney fan needs to visit Walt's original, and it looks like you had a great time!

 

[SpaceMountain75]

That's why I go to both resorts and don't compare them the whole time.

I respect that. For me it's very hard for me not to compare them the whole time, since they're so similar! It's like that Seinfeld episode with Bizarro Jerry. The two parks feel like Bizarro Magic Kingdoms!

 

[Californian Elitist]

Well now I'm beginning to wonder if DCA and Disneyland are worth even going to with most of the people here saying they are not even as good as Disney World parks. Ranking DCA below DHS doesn't seem very encouraging to me and Disneyland below Magic Kingdom (though I love both parks).

Why don't you go and see for yourself? If I based my choice of going to WDW on the comments I see here, I'd never go.

 

[SoccerLover100]

Why don't you go and see for yourself? If I based my choice of going to WDW on the comments I see here, I'd never go.

Haha that is true. I guess there is only one way to find out.

 

[Sage of Time]

Fantasyland alone could have a thread for comparisons. For everything I prefer in California, there's something I prefer in Florida.

However, I cannot overlook the losses of Toad and SWSA in Florida.

Edit: NFL is pretty but it suffers from very bad—almost amateurish—forced perspective. And of course it doesn't contribute much to the MK's capacity problem, so much as closing some attractions to open others. Still, the placemaking from NFL and the Tangled Toilets really help FL feel substantial.

A lot of what makes a theme park, for me, is how the land looks and feels, and immerses you. With that, DL FL wins outright. It might be the most immersive land in DL, outside of the alleyways of NOS.

(I can't count Frontierland or Adventureland as immersive, even though they surround you. they're basically courtyards. There's nothing to them! They're tiny! And I love them, still!)

NFL has the worst forced perspective. Eric's Castle is built at our level... but has tiny little features. ?

 

[Sage of Time]

I respect that. For me it's very hard for me not to compare them the whole time, since they're so similar! It's like that Seinfeld episode with Bizarro Jerry. The two parks feel like Bizarro Magic Kingdoms!

I hate to say it, but ever since I went to DL I can't go to MK and think about where I'd be in DL and how MK isn't the "true" version of a castle park. It's so weird.

 

[tirian]

A lot of what makes a theme park, for me, is how the land looks and feels, and immerses you. With that, DL FL wins outright. It might be the most immersive land in DL, outside of the alleyways of NOS.

(I can't count Frontierland or Adventureland as immersive, even though they surround you. they're basically courtyards. There's nothing to them! They're tiny! And I love them, still!)

NFL has the worst forced perspective. Eric's Castle is built at our level... but has tiny little features. ***?

I hate to say it, but ever since I went to DL I can't go to MK and think about where I'd be in DL and how MK isn't the "true" version of a castle park. It's so weird.

While we're on the topic, my favorite two attractions in DL's Fantasyland are Alice and the Casey Junior Circus Train because they make me feel like I did when I watched Disney cartoons and movies as a kid. That's what Fantasyland is supposed to do. (The Casey Jr. train has incredible views and shouldn't be underrated.)

 

[Disneysea05]

I hate to say it, but ever since I went to DL I can't go to MK and think about where I'd be in DL and how MK isn't the "true" version of a castle park. It's so weird.

Same here. I think because at the end of the day it is the original, the only park that is truly Walt's and it defined what a magic kingdom is. And as an added bonus it has more attractions and entertainment than any other magic kingdom in the world.

I love Tokyo Disneyland, Disneyland Paris and the Magic Kingdom. When I come back to the original Disneyland after visiting those parks, I appreciate it so much more.

 

[Disneysea05]

Fr.L: the entrance fort in DL is really cool because you feel like you're in a TV western from the 50s, and the ROA is a pleasant theme park stream; but the MK's FrL feels like an actual outpost on a real river. The MK Splash is much, much better than the dinky version in Critter Country.

I always feel like Frontierland got shortchanged in Florida in Favor of Liberty Square. It doesn't even feel like it has a proper entrance like at Disneyland or Tokyo, or Paris. Perhaps them counting on Western River Expedition to anchor the land would explain it.

The RoA is a little lifeless there compared to the other magic kingdoms. At Disneyland, it feels like a big busy river, you have the Mark Twain Riverboats, Sailing Ship Columbia, explorer canoes, and Tom Sawyar Island Rafts bringing that whole area to life with constant kinetic energy. A busy river, as Walt said.

I love Splash Mountain in Florida, but it doesn't belong in a Frontierland. That's been bugging me lately. The presence of the Country Bears in Frontierland from Day 1 could justify the presence of more critters but I think Tokyo got it right: Splash Mountain belongs in a Critter Country bayou setting, so you go ahead and build a Critter Country...with the best Splash Mountain to top it off.

 

[Californian Elitist]

For someone who grew up going to WDW where everything in the MK, EC, and DAK feels like a *place*, Paradise Pier rips you out of the Disney bubble you've come to expect.

The sound stages in DHS do the same thing.

This "Disney bubble" I always hear from people is kind of ridiculous to me.

Paradise Pier fits the theme and feels like a place to me. It's probably because I grew up going to the Santa Monica Pier.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

I always feel like Frontierland got shortchanged in Florida in Favor of Liberty Square. It doesn't even feel like it has a proper entrance like at Disneyland or Tokyo, or Paris. Perhaps them counting on Western River Expedition to anchor the land would explain it.

Frontierland at MK was designed with a single row of buildings facing the river, which feels weirdly incomplete or just kinda poorly laid out. At Disneyland, you pass through the stockade and have buildings on either side, which is much better, at least to me.

 

[Sage of Time]

While we're on the topic, my favorite two attractions in DL's Fantasyland are Alice and the Casey Junior Circus Train because they make me feel like I did when I watched Disney cartoons and movies as a kid. That's what Fantasyland is supposed to do. (The Casey Jr. train has incredible views and shouldn't be underrated.)

Casey Jr. blew me away. No, really. Such an innocent, classic, and wonderful attraction that adds so much atmosphere. That back wall of FL with Casey and Storybookland is wonderful.

Same here. I think because at the end of the day it is the original, the only park that is truly Walt's and it defined what a magic kingdom is. And as an added bonus it has more attractions and entertainment than any other magic kingdom in the world.

I love Tokyo Disneyland, Disneyland Paris and the Magic Kingdom. When I come back to the original Disneyland after visiting those parks, I appreciate it so much more.

Yup. And although the place is TINY, it just feels so much more fleshed out. There's not a lot of dead space in Disneyland. MK, though I love it, as lots of space between things. Granted, that design might be a bit more sophisticated, as it allows for bigger aesthetic statements, but Disneyland is just constant STUFF. Everywhere you look, there's something.

I always feel like Frontierland got shortchanged in Florida in Favor of Liberty Square. It doesn't even feel like it has a proper entrance like at Disneyland or Tokyo, or Paris. Perhaps them counting on Western River Expedition to anchor the land would explain it.

The RoA is a little lifeless there compared to the other magic kingdoms. At Disneyland, it feels like a big busy river, you have the Mark Twain Riverboats, Sailing Ship Columbia, explorer canoes, and Tom Sawyar Island Rafts bringing that whole area to life with constant kinetic energy. A busy river, as Walt said.

I love Splash Mountain in Florida, but it doesn't belong in a Frontierland. That's been bugging me lately. The presence of the Country Bears in Frontierland from Day 1 could justify the presence of more critters but I think Tokyo got it right: Splash Mountain belongs in a Critter Country bayou setting, so you go ahead and build a Critter Country...with the best Splash Mountain to top it off.

Frontierland at MK was designed with a single row of buildings facing the river, which feels weirdly incomplete or just kinda poorly laid out. At Disneyland, you pass through the stockade and have buildings on either side, which is much better, at least to me.

I don't agree with these viewpoints on FrL at all. FrL in DL felt very constrained and had very little content. I don't feel like it interacted with the Rivers of America in any real way... New Orleans Square feels like it dominates ROA more. Instead, DL FrL just feels like a courtyard with BTMR beyond it.

WDW, though, without NOS, feels more organically placed next to ROA. It might just be one street of buildings, but it behaves more like a river outpost or town that's on a body of water.

 

[Californian Elitist]

^^^ Disneyland's Frontierland has the same amount of attractions as Magic Kingdom's, in terms of content. In terms of its use of RoA, three of DL's attractions make use of the river. Don't really understand what you're talking about.

 

[Sage of Time]

^^^ Disneyland's Frontierland has the same amount of attractions as Magic Kingdom's, in terms of content. In terms of its use of RoA, three of DL's attractions make use of the river. Don't really understand what you're talking about.

Disneyland has......? Big Thunder? I guess you're counting all the boat rides separately. I don't see them as being grounded in Frontierland and I think they interact with NOS more.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Disneyland has......? Big Thunder? I guess you're counting all the boat rides separately. I don't see them as being grounded in Frontierland and I think they interact with NOS more.

Frontierland has Big Thunder Ranch, Mark Twain, Sailing Ship Columbia, Pirate's Lair, Big Thunder and the Shootin' Exposition (don't really see how that's an attraction, but apparently it is). The Mark Twain and the Columbia are Frontierland attractions, they don't interact with NOS at all and have nothing to do with the land's theme.

 

[SpaceMountain75]

As far as major attractions go, WDW takes the cake for Frontierland IMO. They have Splash, Big Thunder, and to a much lesser extent, Country Bears. DL's wins easily for shops, however. Pioneer Mercantile has to be my favorite shop in the park.

 

[Sage of Time]

Frontierland has Big Thunder Ranch, Mark Twain, Sailing Ship Columbia, Pirate's Lair, Big Thunder and the Shootin' Exposition (don't really see how that's an attraction, but apparently it is). The Mark Twain and the Columbia are Frontierland attractions, they don't interact with NOS at all and have nothing to do with the land's theme.

I'm sorry, I just feel like half of the things you mentioned don't really feel like they're in Frontierland. They might have the listing for them, but the ROA and Tom Sawyer's Island feels so separate from the Big Thunder/Stockage area. They feel more closely tied to NOS, as do the ships that make their way around the ROA. That's not bad... it's just a different perception. FrL is weaker for NOS's strengths in my view.

 

[Californian Elitist]

I'm sorry, I just feel like half of the things you mentioned don't really feel like they're in Frontierland. They might have the listing for them, but the ROA and Tom Sawyer's Island feels so separate from the Big Thunder/Stockage area. They feel more closely tied to NOS, as do the ships that make their way around the ROA. That's not bad... it's just a different perception. FrL is weaker for NOS's strengths in my view.

I can't...

It's not an opinion, it's a fact. All of the attractions I listed are Frontierland attractions, whether you like it or not. The only attraction that's a little far from everything else is the Columbia. Big Thunder Ranch is a few feet from Thunder Mountain (one can literally hear the train and people screaming from the zoo), the Mark Twain is docked RIGHT IN FRONT of Thunder Mountain, the Shootin' Exposition is to the righ of Frontierland's entrance, and Pirate's Lair is actually on the Rivers of America. There isn't a single show/ride at Disneyland that takes place on the Rivers of America that's considered a New Orleans Square attraction. And I really don't see how a trip around the River, where there are animatronics of critters and Native Americans, screams New Orleans Square. Those themes are so different, I really don't understand how one can become confused with the other.

It is obvious you haven't spent enough time in Disneyland's Frontierland, based on what you're saying. And you're attempting to call a fact an opinion. I've seen you do this before, therefore I'm done going back and forth with you. Byyyeeee.