Looking at DVC---what can you experts tell me ?

[xdan0920]

Not sure I agree. The rack rates at WDW have risen pretty inexorably since then too. As long as you’re buying for the right reasons, and would otherwise stay in the deluxe resorts, you do still save once you’ve broken even.

Once upon a time, DVC was a really excellent value proposition. In fact, if you were just the type or guest who went every 18 months or so and stayed moderate, you still could come out ahead in fairly short order. Now with the price points being so laughably high, and the amount of points needed for a reasonable stay escalating, the only way you can make some sort of value argument is by using rack rates on deluxe accommodations at peak times.

The math has all changed. Buying direct DVC now is bananas.

 

[DisneyOutsider]

Once upon a time, DVC was a really excellent value proposition. In fact, if you were just the type or guest who went every 18 months or so and stayed moderate, you still could come out ahead in fairly short order. Now with the price points being so laughably high, and the amount of points needed for a reasonable stay escalating, the only way you can make some sort of value argument is by using rack rates on deluxe accommodations at peak times.

The math has all changed. Buying direct DVC now is bananas.

There's still value to be had in resale contracts, but you're right that buying direct wipes that value out clean. I think you'd be much better off renting points for DVC stays every year versus buying direct.

 

[YorkshireT]

The total overall points at a resort cannot change, but they can reallocate them. They were planning on doing a big reallocation for 2020 but pulled it at the last minute to reevaluate it. The yearly maintenance fees do increase each year but I guess it depends on what you consider to be drastic. Just a heads up-early December is probably the busiest time of the year for DVC. I'm going early December and I had to be on my computer the second bookings opened for Copper Creek to be able to get a room. Disney off-season and DVC off-season are basically opposite times of the year.

This is what most of us thought, but is not correct, which we found out to our great shock late last year.
The points were always sold as never been able to increase overall , it even says this on promotional material.
But on this last points reallocation, which was abandoned on threat of legal action and member uproar (albeit they claim it was because members were unhappy and what they were doing was legal and they are reviewing it again) they utilised what is called lockoff premium to create points out of thin air. This had the effect of anyone booking most types of rooms including usually last to book 1 beds, to have to be paying more points more of the time.
I won’t go into the ins and out as there’s a huge thread on another board about this, but needless to say with these shenanigans and the latest restrictions on Riviera, some members no longer think it is the product it was, or trust the management.
The price has also gone up a lot. Do not buy Riviera as you will likely take a big wash if you come to sell, I’d buy one of the original resorts resale, as prices have maybe gone down slightly recently and you can use all 14 original resorts.

 

[Indy_UK]

I have also been looking into DVC, and put a spreadsheet together with cost to buy and dues over the life of membership, so general question for those giving advice to OP:

Is there anything to keep the dues from escalating completely out of control? I know it's based on operating costs, but it looks to be increasing on average about twice the amount of inflation. With about a 4% annual increase, even the cheapest dues will be in double digits per point in a few years.

Hey, sorry to ask almost 6 months on but did you do a spreadsheet which made sense for you? Is it something you would mind sharing?

We are currently saving towards buying 160 points resale for AKL and I'm looking for a template to work out all of my numbers with annual due increases etc

 

[Andrew M]

Hey, sorry to ask almost 6 months on but did you do a spreadsheet which made sense for you? Is it something you would mind sharing?

We are currently saving towards buying 160 points resale for AKL and I'm looking for a template to work out all of my numbers with annual due increases etc

Yeah, no problem sharing. It's on my computer at home, so shoot me an message with your email and I'll send it over.

In the long run, buying direct only made sense if we assumed we could get the AP discount for the life of the contract, which is no guarantee.

Buying resale was definitely a better buy, but compared to the cost of renting points, it only made sense if you went every single year/or got a good price renting your points.

In the end, between having to buy 5 R/T plane tickets from NY every time we go, limited availability less than 7 months out, and the general flexibility of taking your vacations to places other than WDW, it didn't make sense for us.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

I think the number one thing is to buy in the resort you primarily want to stay at as the 7 month booking windows have become very difficult to secure. I was also recommend buying the smallest contract available direct from Disney (i think its 50 points?) and the balance in the resale market. So if you were thinking of buying 160, 50 from Disney and trying to find closest to 110 in resale. Start with resale market to see what size contracts come for sale as the size varies (for eg. could buy 2 separate 50 point contracts in resale and then 60 from Disney). This gives you all the perks and other things that come along with buying direct while also saving money via resale. Just remember you need to purchase the same use year. I would not finance (i did and regret it, have since paid it off)

Just an FYI, the minimum direct buy in varies by resort. New customers can direct buy in for 50 points at SSR and OKW. 75 points for HHI and VB. It is 100 points minimum for all other DVC resorts.

 

[seascape]

I thought they upped the minimum of direct points for benefits to 75 points.

 

[nickys]

I thought they upped the minimum of direct points for benefits to 75 points.

They did. But that doesn’t mean you have to buy that many points minimum. They allow fewer than that at some. But obviously you then don’t get the perks.

 

[mfortis]

My timeshare advice is the same for any timeshare or property for that matter Location, location, location!
Make sure the location you purchase the timeshare is a location you want to go year after year (after year). Don't buy at a place with the hopes of trading it for another. Even within DVC! If you like and want to stay at the Wilderness Lodge, buy your points at Wilderness Lodge, don't buy them at Vero Beach or Hilton Head.

 

[macefamily]

We did it. We’re not in it for the long term booking. We’d rather use points to try different resorts. We usually schedule our Disney vacations when our family schedules line up and airfare is cheap. So it’s usually a one to two month window. We bought 150 points at OKW. Going to bank them and have 300 by February. Looking forward to 38 yrs of many Disney adventures.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

We did it. We’re not in it for the long term booking. We’d rather use points to try different resorts. We usually schedule our Disney vacations when our family schedules line up and airfare is cheap. So it’s usually a one to two month window. We bought 150 points at OKW. Going to bank them and have 300 by February. Looking forward to 38 yrs of many Disney adventures.

First - welcome home! So are you saying that you will only be booking 1-2 months in advance?

 

[correcaminos]

We did it. We’re not in it for the long term booking. We’d rather use points to try different resorts. We usually schedule our Disney vacations when our family schedules line up and airfare is cheap. So it’s usually a one to two month window. We bought 150 points at OKW. Going to bank them and have 300 by February. Looking forward to 38 yrs of many Disney adventures.

Welcome home!

I took wonder if you really mean only a couple months in advance. That's not great for DVC planning... I've done it but it isn't easy to do.

 

[macefamily]

First - welcome home! So are you saying that you will only be booking 1-2 months in advance?

Yes. We’ll be looking at the ‘quick getaway’ options mostly. However we plan to book a deluxe resort at some time in the future. Can I combine my DVC points with points I buy on the open market to enhance my stay ?

 

[LuvtheGoof]

Yes. We’ll be looking at the ‘quick getaway’ options mostly. However we plan to book a deluxe resort at some time in the future. Can I combine my DVC points with points I buy on the open market to enhance my stay ?

Well, first, DVC is not usually conducive to quick getaways. At certain times of the year, there will not be any availability even 3 months out at any resort. If you are only booking 1-2 months in advance, you will pretty much be limited to slower times, and visits to OKW, SSR, or AKL. Getting anything else on that short notice will be next to impossible at any time of the year.

For example, if you wanted to book a trip now for the first week of December - 3 1/2 months away, there is absolutely NO availability at any DVC resort for studios, 1 bedrooms, or 2 bedrooms. Not even the Poly Bungalows are available.

What is the size of the party that you will normally be traveling with?

Not sure what you mean by "points you buy on the open market". Are you talking points bought via resale? If so, then those are still "DVC" points, and as long as the points are available to use, then you can combine them for a stay. If you buy resale, it is much easier to keep track of your points availability if you have the same use year for all of your points. That way, they are all able to be used for stays at the same time.

 

[nickys]

Just to add, you can only combine points at different resorts at the 7 month mark. But that won’t be an issue for you though, if you’ll be booking last minute.

 

[DisneyDayDreamin]

We just did the DVC tour/presentation a few days ago. They were really doing a hard sell on Riveria and stressing that the price per point for it could go up at any moment so buy now. I was a little put off by that because I had always heard that DVC wasn't a pressure sale. Regardless, we are thinking about it. I asked a lot of questions about the resale restrictions for Riveria and that was a concern for us purchasing there.
Question for you seasoned DVC folks: if my intent is to not sell, do the restrictions matter? I know I can't guarantee that something won't come up and we will need to sell but we certainly aren't going into this thinking we will sell in 10 years to make a profit. So, if that is out of the equation, are there still concerns with buying in at Riveria?
If you buy resale, do you still get the AP discount, or is that only a benefit if you buy direct?

 

[correcaminos]

We just did the DVC tour/presentation a few days ago. They were really doing a hard sell on Riveria and stressing that the price per point for it could go up at any moment so buy now. I was a little put off by that because I had always heard that DVC wasn't a pressure sale. Regardless, we are thinking about it. I asked a lot of questions about the resale restrictions for Riveria and that was a concern for us purchasing there.
Question for you seasoned DVC folks: if my intent is to not sell, do the restrictions matter? I know I can't guarantee that something won't come up and we will need to sell but we certainly aren't going into this thinking we will sell in 10 years to make a profit. So, if that is out of the equation, are there still concerns with buying in at Riveria?
If you buy resale, do you still get the AP discount, or is that only a benefit if you buy direct?

Sorry for your experience with the guide. Some are great and others not so much. I've heard there is more turn around lately than usual for them. My guide didn't even pressure me to buy even when I was on a waitlist for a specific resort.

As for your question, no, if you never plan to sell restrictions don't mean a thing. As you said you don't go into this thinking you will or try to turn a profit (bad idea no matter what IMO) then if Riviera is where you want, buy in. Do not buy in for perks though - at least that's my feelings.

If you buy resale you are a white card holder so you only get to use TOWL, Pool hopping, and DVD rental for free (IIRC). Parking of course is free for any DVC point stay. You get no discounts for APs, food, or purchases. No ability to get the Moonlight Magic or the like either.

 

[nickys]

I guess my only concern @DisneyDayDreamin would be what if, for any reason, you decided you didn’t want or couldn’t hold onto your membership for 50 years. Although I think it’s unlikely that you couldn’t sell it at any price, some people are asking whether that could happen. And the truthful answer is “maybe”. So it could be that you end up having to hold onto it and just renting out your points perhaps to pay the dues. I wouldn’t want a big number of points at Riviera for that reason.

Remember you can buy direct at any resort, even those technically sold out. And if you did that you could use those points at any resort at 7 months, including Riviera.