Look,, if WDW is this crowded.. the OPEN A FIFTH PARK...

[JMcMahonEsq]

Plenty? I will have to disagree on this one.
Contemporary - deluxe
Boardwalk/BC/YC - deluxe and to the 2nd maybe 3rd tier park
It's a stretch for many to say Poly/GF, but they are also deluxe.
Swan/Dolphin - sort of, ish, but also deluxe-ish

Most people will never stay or even consider those locations. This board isn't most people.

How many hotels do you need to be immediately abutting the parks? The whole concept of WDW over DL was that Walt wanted the space to build out an experience that DIDN"T have everything crammed into as small an area as possible.

MK has 3 hotels that are walkable and have views to the Park.

EPCOT/HS have 6 (BW/BC/YC, Swan/Dolphin/Swan Reserve)

AK is a separate beast as you don't want massive hotels with all the guests and noise ect disturbing animals

As to them being deluxe hotels.....well of course they are. They offer things that other hotels don't. Close proximity to the parks allowing walking back and forth, and some amazing view. Watching the fire works from your balcony or your bed at the Contemporary might be one of the most amazing experiences you can have if you are a WDW fan. People are going to pay a premium for those features. WDW is not going to have economy priced rooms with views of the park and within walking distance.

This of course leaves off the problem of explaining where you are getting all the extra people to actually work at the new park and the new hotels.

 

[Andrew25]

How many hotels do you need to be immediately abutting the parks? The whole concept of WDW over DL was that Walt wanted the space to build out an experience that DIDN"T have everything crammed into as small an area as possible.

MK has 3 hotels that are walkable and have views to the Park.

EPCOT/HS have 6 (BW/BC/YC, Swan/Dolphin/Swan Reserve)

AK is a separate beast as you don't want massive hotels with all the guests and noise ect disturbing animals

As to them being deluxe hotels.....well of course they are. They offer things that other hotels don't. Close proximity to the parks allowing walking back and forth, and some amazing view. Watching the fire works from your balcony or your bed at the Contemporary might be one of the most amazing experiences you can have if you are a WDW fan. People are going to pay a premium for those features. WDW is not going to have economy priced rooms with views of the park and within walking distance.

This of course leaves off the problem of explaining where you are getting all the extra people to actually work at the new park and the new hotels.

Walt didn't buy so much land to spread things out... it was for the city of Epcot. If you see the original concept of WDW, the theme park resort area was small.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

Walt didn't buy so much land to spread things out... it was for the city of Epcot. If you see the original concept of WDW, the theme park resort area was small.

If you read the Project Future book, which goes into the history behind the selection of Orlando as the location for the second Disney Park, and the land acquisition process that they undertook to get it, one of the key deciding factors was the ability to space out the parks. To not allow the parks to be surrounded by buildings/hotels/restaurants, right up to the park limits. He regretted not having a buffer in California between the parks and the outside world.

 

[Andrew25]

If you read the Project Future book, which goes into the history behind the selection of Orlando as the location for the second Disney Park, and the land acquisition process that they undertook to get it, one of the key deciding factors was the ability to space out the parks. To not allow the parks to be surrounded by buildings/hotels/restaurants, right up to the park limits. He regretted not having a buffer in California between the parks and the outside world.

The buffer/berm aspect is correct... but they never intended on building more than 1 theme park. The focus was the city of Epcot.

 

[scottieRoss]

The buffer/berm aspect is correct... but they never intended on building more than 1 theme park. The focus was the city

The buffer/berm aspect is correct... but they never intended on building more than 1 theme park. The focus was the city of Epcot.

That is all debatable. The original plans were to create the Vacation Kingdom of the World.
Magic Kingdom surrounded by about 8 hotels. Then the Magic Kingdom itself, along with the 'World Showcase' area. Along with the Swamp Ride to the west, multiple golf courses, 16 more motels, 2 campgrounds and a trailer park. All that was beyond EPCOT. And do not forget, when it opened it was advertised mostly to adults, most (not all, but most) promotional shots featured adults enjoying the food, cocktails, water sports, more cocktails and an occassional time spent in the Magic Kingdom before it closed, at 6pm.

 

[Big T 1963]

My take is when Epic Universe opens in a few years down the road on I-4 Disney will seriously need to consider opening a fifth gate

 

[Disstevefan1]

Instead of fifth gate, add more attractions (expand) the existing parks.

Adding to an existing parks eliminates the need to build a lot of infrastructure compared to a new gate

Problem is, unless it’s a DVC resort, they take forever to do anything.

If a baby was born the day they announced TRON for MK, they would be tall enough to ride the day it opened.

 

[Lilofan]

How many hotels do you need to be immediately abutting the parks? The whole concept of WDW over DL was that Walt wanted the space to build out an experience that DIDN"T have everything crammed into as small an area as possible.

MK has 3 hotels that are walkable and have views to the Park.

EPCOT/HS have 6 (BW/BC/YC, Swan/Dolphin/Swan Reserve)

AK is a separate beast as you don't want massive hotels with all the guests and noise ect disturbing animals

As to them being deluxe hotels.....well of course they are. They offer things that other hotels don't. Close proximity to the parks allowing walking back and forth, and some amazing view. Watching the fire works from your balcony or your bed at the Contemporary might be one of the most amazing experiences you can have if you are a WDW fan. People are going to pay a premium for those features. WDW is not going to have economy priced rooms with views of the park and within walking distance.

This of course leaves off the problem of explaining where you are getting all the extra people to actually work at the new park and the new hotels.

Once and never again. AK had midnight fireworks show NYE 1999. All guests had to view fireworks standing in guest parking lot. The explosion booms drove the animals crazy.

 

[Big T 1963]

DVC seems to take priority over anything

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

DVC seems to take priority over anything

It does…but only in the initials sales for Disney

Ask around about how impressive they’re been to dvc owners during the “crisis”

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Has anyone bothered to explain why a 5th park makes no sense yet on this thread?
It’s a formality…but always true

 

[Big T 1963]

Ok Ok maybe not a 5th park in say but let's speed up the process on adding new attractions to the Disney World Parks we have today... like what's taking so long to do something with Dino Land in AK that area needed an upgrade like yesterday

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Ok Ok maybe not a 5th park in say but let's speed up the process on adding new attractions to the Disney World Parks we have today... like what's taking so long to do something with Dino Land in AK that area needed an upgrade like yesterday

…”this is the way”

You are correct. As to why they don’t do things/move? The ugly truth is Iger and his low talent lts have Manipulated capacity for along time to spin upsells…and somehow convinced defenders on forums such as this to believe it’s “good for the customer”. Which has allowed them to micromanage costs and actually reduced customer services.
Good scam if you can pull it off.

Don’t believe a crank like me…believe whoever right now is talking about “experiencing” after hours at mk or studios

You know that you’re “experiencing”? The same rides you would after 7 pm as you would during 2 pm. But they resell it at 7 pm instead of extending the hours from 9-7 to 8-12 like the crowd level dictates and they always did.

Forced demand.

Not adding more ride capacity is part of the same scheme.

“Buy lightning cause we didn’t build enough”


It is quite brilliant.

 

[BlakeW39]

Has anyone bothered to explain why a 5th park makes no sense yet on this thread?
It’s a formality…but always true

No, but do tell

 

[Goofyernmost]

we are all complaining about the disney Greedy and Bob Cheapskate.. and ol' Bob says.. hey if you are gonna come then you are gonna pay for it.. Well if you want to relieve OVER CROWDING. OPEN ANOTHER PARK.. if you start today.. it can be open in a year.. IF YOU WANT TO DO IT.. Epcot was built in just over a year.. Magic Kingdom, in a year.. in the past.. it was we can't build it, its a recession.. we couldn't build it last year. it was covid.. well guess what.. no recession and covid has cut way back, and you have more money then GOD...and they are bringing more in ..in dump trucks each and every day.. BUILD ANOTHER PARK.. No excuse now..

If it hasn't been mentioned EPCOT took 3+ years to build. Mk Disneyland was a year, but let's compare apple to apples. MK, initially, was a lot more privative then the public would go for now. All that technology isn't found by digging a hole in the ground and finding it all there. Those days were pretty much gone just a decade after DL was opened. It doesn't take very long to make a dusty trail and a couple of stage coaches and you have Frontierland anymore.

They have a lot of space left to add things in the current parks. Another gate would just spread the staff and maintenance out even thinner than it is now. Sometimes what seems to be the simplest solutions aren't all that simple or that effective.

 

[No Name]

Magic. Epcot. Hollywood. Animal. Long ago, the four theme parks lived together in harmony. Then everything changed when the fifth gate was built.

 

[BlakeW39]

Magic. Epcot. Hollywood. Animal. Long ago, the four theme parks lived together in harmony. Then everything changed when the fifth gate was built.

Magic. Epcot. Hollywood. Animal. Long ago, the four theme parks lived together in harmony. Then everything changed when the fifth gate was built Bobs attacked.

FTFY

 

[thomas998]

we are all complaining about the disney Greedy and Bob Cheapskate.. and ol' Bob says.. hey if you are gonna come then you are gonna pay for it.. Well if you want to relieve OVER CROWDING. OPEN ANOTHER PARK.. if you start today.. it can be open in a year.. IF YOU WANT TO DO IT.. Epcot was built in just over a year.. Magic Kingdom, in a year.. in the past.. it was we can't build it, its a recession.. we couldn't build it last year. it was covid.. well guess what.. no recession and covid has cut way back, and you have more money then GOD...and they are bringing more in ..in dump trucks each and every day.. BUILD ANOTHER PARK.. No excuse now..

Took my neighbor nearly 6 months to get their home built. That was one house, didn't require any earthwork or infrastructure it was simply they bought a lot in an existing development and then had a builder start working based on a house design that was purchased.... So much less involved than any theme park.... But the their are limit to how quickly something can be built when you factor in pesky little things like a building inspector that has to sign off on certain steps before the builder can move on to the next step. Do you think those inspectors are going to just show up when Disney wants them to? Hardly. That is always one of the big problems with building something, you spend a lot of time waiting for an inspector to show up and if they find anything wrong they leave, you address the problem and then have to get them scheduled to return and re-inspect. You couldn't build a single ride in a year let alone a full park. Tron was expected to take 4 years when they started it and they didn't get that one done on time.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Took my neighbor nearly 6 months to get their home built. That was one house, didn't require any earthwork or infrastructure it was simply they bought a lot in an existing development and then had a builder start working based on a house design that was purchased.... So much less involved than any theme park.... But the their are limit to how quickly something can be built when you factor in pesky little things like a building inspector that has to sign off on certain steps before the builder can move on to the next step. Do you think those inspectors are going to just show up when Disney wants them to? Hardly. That is always one of the big problems with building something, you spend a lot of time waiting for an inspector to show up and if they find anything wrong they leave, you address the problem and then have to get them scheduled to return and re-inspect. You couldn't build a single ride in a year let alone a full park. Tron was expected to take 4 years when they started it and they didn't get that one done on time.

Weather enters in to it as well. But primarily with something like building a highly technical theme park attraction it is a lot more than wiring up an electrical outlet or a ceiling light. If people would just stop and think about what has to happen for an attraction like Rise of the Resistance to come into existance we might all appreciate them a lot more. The complexity of the technology in that attraction is mind blowing. To make all those things work in the proper sequence time after time, day after day, etc. must be a nightmare. However, it certainly explains why a new attraction like that has many issues early on and a whole lot of fine tuning is required to get it were all of us would like to see it. It just takes time.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

Has anyone bothered to explain why a 5th park makes no sense yet on this thread?
It’s a formality…but always true

For Disney they'll say its money. Their shareholders might not like it right now either, who knows. There certainly is the space for another park. Plenty I would think. But what is the theme? I like the idea of a 5th park but the truth is I am not even sure if I have heard a great idea for a 5th park's theme even on this board. Disney isn't exactly brimming with original ideas anymore.

My take is when Epic Universe opens in a few years down the road on I-4 Disney will seriously need to consider opening a fifth gate

You very well might be correct. In 1989 when DHS opened it is largely thought that with Universal opening in 1990 that this was the reason for it Disney adding a 3rd park.

It could take them years to open it though. I would say 5 years is a best case scenario. Here is the funny thing, in 1956 Walt was on the "What's my line" TV show where guests try and guess the famous person's voice. When they took the blindfold off it was Walt and he was talking about Disneyland. He mentioned how they are building attractions right now that will be opening next year (not sure what that was, Alice in Wonderland opened in 1958, could be something else though). So it just got me thinking how quick they used to do things. Disneyland had ground broken in what, early 1954? Or was it mid 1954? Either way, in July of 1955 the park was open. Walt dies in 1966 and WDW takes 5 years to open after that. Give Roy credit for stepping up of course, but I think it just goes to show you that the man behind the prompt work environment was always Walt and it is missing today.