Len Testa - “Disney positions itself as the all-American vacation. The irony is that most Americans can’t afford it.”

[Sir_Cliff]

Interesting article Has Disney reach its price ceiling?

"Disney attendance plunges to all-time low for 2025 as visitors report 'ghost towns' at parks​

September is forecast to be Disney World's slowest month as some people call it 'a tomb''​

Strange that Fox News would run a negative story about Disney, but I guess they must have compelling evidence.

'On TikTok, some visitors described the parks as "ghost towns."

"I'm at Magic Kingdom right now, and this place is a tomb," one user said.

"There is literally nobody here. There is no wait time for anything. Space Mountain — walk on. Haunted Mansion — walk on. Pirates of the Caribbean — walk on. The longest I have even seen a wait time for … 30 minutes."

That said, they did acknowledge:

Financially, Disney paints a different picture. The company has reported mostly unchanged attendance, while its recent earnings show revenue growth.

Disney attendance plunges to all-time low for 2025 as visitors report 'ghost towns' at parks

Average wait times at Walt Disney World drop to 24 minutes in September, the shortest three-week stretch of the year, according to crowd tracking data.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Miss Bella]

I fear we have spent a lot on hotels

We stayed at the Hyatt house in Tokyo and that was about 400 a night, but I was able to book the Hyatt place in Kyoto with points. 8k points a night. We made that our base for Osaka and Kyoto. The Hyatt house in Tokyo has a washer and dryer in the room. That really reduced the amount of luggage we had to bring and was worth the high cost. We stayed at the Hilton in in Hiroshima for about 100 a night with executive lounge access. That was by far the best Hilton I've ever stayed at and the best executive lounge I've encountered.
Enjoy your trip.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

If WDW vacations do transition into being something that only older wealthier people can afford, similar to the river cruises you mentioned, the question has to be asked: do older, wealthier people want to vacation at WDW? Would it be a sustainable business model for Disney to target these kind of people as their main customer base? If it gets to the point where WDW is a luxury vacation based on the cost, is that a vacation choice that the people who can afford it, will want to make? Lower class families have been priced out for a long time, middle class families are on the verge of that, which only leaves the upper class that would be able to afford Disney theme park trips.

It’s not sustainable at all

For 10 years…a certain segment of uber fans have given this air as if it’s a viable “strategy”. It’s nothing of the sort.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Strange that Fox News would run a negative story about Disney, but I guess they must have compelling evidence.

So if a lion tells you that eating meat provides the protein needed for animals to survive…you disregard it as biased?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I think part of the issue is the whole pre-planning every second of your vacation that also makes a WDW vacation just a huge pain in the a__. We used to go to WDW multiple times a year....we now only really go once... River Cruises are expensive but what you get to see and experience is far outweighing the nickel-and-diming of a Disney trip. We literally just got home last night from a European river cruise and had an amazing time...and it all felt less stressful than a long weekend at WDW. Maybe I have just grown past that age where I enjoy all the crowds and planning.... that is possible....

My amateur opinion is that this is the biggest drag on the business…other than the price

And #3 is lighting lane…which feeds into the beasts at #1 and #2


“How could Disney predict that?”
They didn’t have to…their research knows. Which leads us to bad management

All roads lead back to the coliseum

 

[Sir_Cliff]

So if a lion tells you that eating meat provides the protein needed for animals to survive…you disregard it as biased?

Did you read the article? Look at the evidence they give for the headline and then all the alternative explanations that come toward the end.

The headline may say what many want to believe, and I honestly would also be fine with consumers switching off Disney for being too expensive. You don't need particularly developed critical reading skills, though, to see they have a sensationalist headline that isn't actually supported by much evidence. It is also, in part, the worst, laziest kind of journalism of the "some people online are saying" variety. You could just as easily write an article about people complaining about crowds or Disney being as magical as ever if you quoted different people on TikTok, Reddit, here, or wherever.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Did you read the article? Look at the evidence they give for the headline and then all the alternative explanations that come toward the end.

The headline may say what many want to believe, and I honestly would also be fine with consumers switching off Disney for being too expensive. You don't need particularly developed critical reading skills, though, to see they have a sensationalist headline that isn't actually supported by much evidence. It is also, in part, the worst, laziest kind of journalism of the "some people online are saying" variety. You could just as easily write an article about people complaining about crowds or Disney being as magical as ever if you quoted different people on TikTok, Reddit, here, or wherever.

So not possible huh?

Cause HUGE likes to say “bookings are strong”…which is as ambiguous as the color grey

 

[HauntedPirate]

Did you read the article? Look at the evidence they give for the headline and then all the alternative explanations that come toward the end.

The headline may say what many want to believe, and I honestly would also be fine with consumers switching off Disney for being too expensive. You don't need particularly developed critical reading skills, though, to see they have a sensationalist headline that isn't actually supported by much evidence. It is also, in part, the worst, laziest kind of journalism of the "some people online are saying" variety. You could just as easily write an article about people complaining about crowds or Disney being as magical as ever if you quoted different people on TikTok, Reddit, here, or wherever.

So those who have been to the parks in the past few months and have reported low wait times, a general lack of crowding, easy dinner reservations, etc. is just "what they want to believe"?

 

[Sir_Cliff]

So not possible huh?

Cause HUGE likes to say “bookings are strong”…which is as ambiguous as the color grey

Sure, it's possible. Not sure what the second sentence means.

My point is that the article itself doesn't actually provide credible evidence to support the headline, other than the part about how "some people are saying" certain things. The source is also relevant given its recent history with Disney. So, what does that article really end up proving?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

So those who have been to the parks in the past few months and have reported low wait times, a general lack of crowding, easy dinner reservations, etc. is just "what they want to believe"?

That’s just based on experience…

It’s not nearly as solid as Business execs that are told in every private conversation by the power brokers of the planet “you need to make us money on the markets every day…or else.”

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Sure, it's possible. Not sure what the second sentence means.

My point is that the article itself doesn't actually provide credible evidence to support the headline, other than the part about how "some people are saying" certain things. The source is also relevant given its recent history with Disney. So, what does that article really end up proving?

I’m not gonna live in the glass house…I’m sure I’ve shot the messengers when they’ve made me grumpy many times as well.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

So those who have been to the parks in the past few months and have reported low wait times, a general lack of crowding, easy dinner reservations, etc. is just "what they want to believe"?

I don't mean to be rude, but how long have you been on these online Disney forums?

I have been around long enough to have been through multiple rounds over the years of people reporting empty parks and surveying empty hotel parking lots only to have the quarterly results come out and show attendance was either steady or up. There are so many things that can affect a guest's experience of crowds that subjective experience is not a reliable indicator of objective attendance.

This is not an argument that Disney is great value and everyone should be vacationing there. I personally don't find WDW great value right now and have no trips planned anytime soon. However, I am more interested in what is going on with pricing and crowds than finding information that suggests everyone thinks the same way I do.

 

[LittleBuford]

Sure, it's possible. Not sure what the second sentence means.

My point is that the article itself doesn't actually provide credible evidence to support the headline, other than the part about how "some people are saying" certain things. The source is also relevant given its recent history with Disney. So, what does that article really end up proving?

The opening, which discusses wait-time data, offers the most convincing evidence, though the article is, as you say, rather speculative overall.

I'll add my own personal observations to those quoted in the article: wait times were indeed low when I visited in September, but the parks nonetheless felt quite crowded, including during the Halloween party. The comparison to a tomb is more than a little farfetched!

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't mean to be rude, but how long have you been on these online Disney forums?

I have been around long enough to have been through multiple rounds over the years of people reporting empty parks and surveying empty hotel parking lots only to have the quarterly results come out and show attendance was either steady or up. There are so many things that can affect a guest's experience of crowds that subjective experience is not a reliable indicator of objective attendance.

This is not an argument that Disney is great value and everyone should be vacationing there. I personally don't find WDW great value right now and have no trips planned anytime soon. However, I am more interested in what is going on with pricing and crowds than finding information that suggests everyone thinks the same way I do.

If you’re gonna go this route…why not just say “screw off” like one of the 20 something vlog/keyboard warriors around here?

 

[Agent H]

If you’re gonna go this route…why not just say “screw off” like one of the 20 something vlog/keyboard warriors around here?

What route are they going?

 

[LittleBuford]

If you’re gonna go this route…why not just say “screw off” like one of the 20 something vlog/keyboard warriors around here?

@Sir_Cliff is a classy poster. Angry insults aren't his style.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The opening, which discusses wait-time data, offers the most convincing evidence, though the article is, as you say, rather speculative overall.

I'll add my own personal observations to those quoted in the article: wait times were indeed low when I visited in September, but the parks nonetheless felt quite crowded, including during the Halloween party. The comparison to a tomb is more than a little farfetched!

I don’t think there’s a doubt that there is a “tilt” to this…but we should all be old ending and wise enough to realize this is gonna apply to most things. Whether they be “pro” or “con”

However…rejection without consideration is very low rent. When you drain the bath tub…it’s a good idea to take the baby out first…not claim it’s not a baby and shove it down the drain with a plunger

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

@Sir_Cliff is a classy poster. Angry insults aren't his style.

Drifting into the neutral zone a bit here…Watch out for the Klingons

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

What route are they going?

…we’ll cover that later in the class

 

[LittleBuford]

Drifting into the neutral zone a bit here…Watch out for the Klingons

I honestly have no idea what this means!