Jungle Cruise Re-Imagining

[donaldtoo]

I always considered Orville's "No privacy at all around here!" as ageist. Not to mention Billy's amazement at how Grandma can possibly be any good at a video game...

And the whole exploding turkey thing is clearly anti-Dadism at its worst.

More like...

 

[Bocabear]

They could turn Imagination into an Imagineering pavilion...Move One Man's Dream over there, replace the Kodak theater with the COP in it's 1964 original dialogue... The focus of the pavilion could be Imagineering through the decades with a restored Journey Into Imagination attraction, and big portion of the expanded pavilion devoted to the World's Fair...which was the beginning of a lot of classic attraction design... While we are at it, move Small World over as well complete with the Tower Of Four Winds and expanded 21st century Mary Blair facade...Make the area a "Waltopia" discovery area...One Man's Dream with some classic attractions as historical illustrations....Moving forward that would be the location for the Blue Sky promotions of things to come etc... EPCOT is based on a World's Fair model..seems fitting that his Worlds Fair attractions would all 'Come Home:...

 

[Skywise]

They could turn Imagination into an Imagineering pavilion...Move One Man's Dream over there, replace the Kodak theater with the COP in it's 1964 original dialogue... The focus of the pavilion could be Imagineering through the decades with a restored Journey Into Imagination attraction, and big portion of the expanded pavilion devoted to the World's Fair...which was the beginning of a lot of classic attraction design... While we are at it, move Small World over as well complete with the Tower Of Four Winds and expanded 21st century Mary Blair facade...Make the area a "Waltopia" discovery area...One Man's Dream with some classic attractions as historical illustrations....Moving forward that would be the location for the Blue Sky promotions of things to come etc... EPCOT is based on a World's Fair model..seems fitting that his Worlds Fair attractions would all 'Come Home:...

I'm sorry sir - Epcot is a place that encompasses IgerVision - where we have such forward thinking concepts as MoanaLand, GuardiansOfTheGalaxyLand, NemoLand and It's A Small World Village(R) where you can find such delightful Disney characters as Mary Poppins, Coco and Olaf!

 

[Bocabear]

So true...

 

[Archie123]

You say that now... Might I point out that, last year, the Muppets weren't racist?

And they still aren’t.

Also, may I suggest taking some Tylenol since you still might hurt yourself with all the straining you are doing trying to make a point.

 

[DryerLintFan]

And they still aren’t.

Also, may I suggest taking some Tylenol since you still might hurt yourself with all the straining you are doing trying to make a point.

Ibuprofen is better for muscle pain...

 

[Archie123]

Ibuprofen is better for muscle pain...

True. I‘ll let Skywise decide what to take for his stretching injury.

 

[Skywise]

And they still aren’t.

Also, may I suggest taking some Tylenol since you still might hurt yourself with all the straining you are doing trying to make a point.

Not what Disney says.

"This program includes negative depictions and/or mistreatment of people or cultures, these stereotypes were wrong then and are wrong now."

 

[FigmentsFangirl]

I always considered Orville's "No privacy at all around here!" as ageist. Not to mention Billy's amazement at how Grandma can possibly be any good at a video game...

And the whole exploding turkey thing is clearly anti-Dadism at its worst.

For me its an annual tradition of something explosion over christmas, normally its dinner {and we end up having Denny's or something}

 

[ImperfectPixie]

For me its an annual tradition of something explosion over christmas, normally its dinner {and we end up having Denny's or something}

Very reminiscent of A Christmas Story.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Very reminiscent of A Christmas Story.

Also narrated by Jean Shepherd.

Coincidence? I think not!!!

 

[WondersOfLife]

I think the difference of CoP and JC is that CoP isn’t directly stereotypical toward a certain group of people. There’s no (that I can recall) racist, homophobic, or classist jokes. It’s a liiiittle sexist based on the times, especially in the first couple decades, but that could easily be tweaked with a much needed rewrite anyway.

I would argue that CoP is pretty diddly darn racist, classist, AND sexist. There are very easy arguments that could be brought up there.


But I also don't believe it should be shut down.

 

[drizgirl]

I think the difference of CoP and JC is that CoP isn’t directly stereotypical toward a certain group of people. There’s no (that I can recall) racist, homophobic, or classist jokes. It’s a liiiittle sexist based on the times, especially in the first couple decades, but that could easily be tweaked with a much needed rewrite anyway.

Stop the presses! Something from early 20th century was sexist?

 

[Parker in NYC]

I would argue that CoP is pretty diddly darn racist, classist, AND sexist. There are very easy arguments that could be brought up there.


But I also don't believe it should be shut down.

Women's lib existed in the original WDW version. Can you imagine the outrage then?! Imagine if people could have tweeted about it.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I think the difference of CoP and JC is that CoP isn’t directly stereotypical toward a certain group of people. There’s no (that I can recall) racist, homophobic, or classist jokes. It’s a liiiittle sexist based on the times, especially in the first couple decades, but that could easily be tweaked with a much needed rewrite anyway.

I think all this talk of CoP falling afoul of the woke police is a bit of a red herring. Sure, it follows the history of a white American family through the twentieth century, but you make the good point that the things that seem to be provoking change mostly involve negative portrayals of certain groups. More effort will also be made to increase the diversity of people represented in existing attractions, but this narrative that CoP is on the chopping block for being too white seems like a bit of a dog whistle to me.

As for the sexist dialogue, my experience has always been that the audience laughs at its ridiculousness which I think is appropriate. Even if the reception has changed over time in accordance with changing values, it seems almost progressive for Disney to present a show about the evolution of the American family through the twentieth century that includes outdated gender roles exaggerated for comic effect.

 

[Homemade Imagineering]

I think all this talk of CoP falling afoul of the woke police is a bit of a red herring. Sure, it follows the history of a white American family through the twentieth century, but you make the good point that the things that seem to be provoking change mostly involve negative portrayals of certain groups. More effort will also be made to increase the diversity of people represented in existing attractions, but this narrative that CoP is on the chopping block for being too white seems like a bit of a dog whistle to me.

As for the sexist dialogue, my experience has always been that the audience laughs at its ridiculousness which I think is appropriate. Even if the reception has changed over time in accordance with changing values, it seems almost progressive for Disney to present a show about the evolution of the American family through the twentieth century that includes outdated gender roles exaggerated for comic effect.

Yeah, this all really ties back to the immense amount of sensationalism surrounding the JC changes and SM re-theme. To remove CoP (for what exactly?) would mean a litany of things for the park, and the park's customers. SM isn't being torn down, or having its ride system gutted. It's being drained, redressed, and ultimately retooled for future use while maintaining the most notable aspects of the attraction (aside from the obvious SotS theme), more specifically in the eyes of the general public, and/or more casual fans (TWDC's usual target demographic). To bulldoze the entire attraction completely, would cause major uproar beyond anything I could possibly comprehend, and would leave the fandom divided for decades to come. They're not trying to steer themselves down such an extreme path. This isn't Universal, this is Disney, and with Disney comes legacy attractions which have gained their own status within the company. Plus, I haven't actually heard anyone online complaining about CoP, in any sort of serious manner. Many love the attraction (some of which are fans who are defending the JC changes and SM re-theme), and for those who don't, find it boring and/or outdated, and have nothing more to complain about to move the needle.

Bottomline is, to remove CoP would cause an awkward division within the theme park community, alienate much of the loyal fanbase, and aside from that, there really isn't any reason as to why it would be deemed so problematic, any more than JC or SM seem to be for that matter. It isn't connected to any sort of problematic IP, and thus will not suffer the consequences SM had to suffer, for its connection to Disney's singlehandedly most infamous, problematic, taboo film of all time. This was the only fate for SM. The writing was on the wall for SM, even if we may have been blinded by the attraction's ability to separate itself from SotS's problematic aspects. If JC says anything, it's that we won't have to worry about legacy attractions being erased, but rather preserved for the long term with minor alterations. SM was a special case, period.

 

[DoleWhipDrea]

IMHO, I think the majority of the changes are hoped by WDI to be simple adjustments to be more palatable to today's audiences without having to completely get rid of popular attractions. I know a lot of fans are worried about changes, as Disney hasn't always had the best track record with making changes to beloved attractions, but some change is necessary for the parks to remain popular and profitable.

Thus far, all of the concept art I've seen for the JC updates look to be significant upgrades to an attraction that has made me cringe from certain scenes for years. I'm really excited that we're getting more AAs and some great gags!

I also don't expect WDI to release every single detail as things change, as even up through implementation, things have to be adjusted. This is live theater with special effects that have to run reliably for the majority of a day every day. I could write a long list of abandoned intended effects and elements for attractions for just one park alone...things change on the fly. I'm thrilled that they're sharing as much as they are and are providing some glimpses for us to look forward to.

 

[ChrisFL]

I'm fine with the JC changes mentioned so far and we just have to wait and see how it looks in the final product. Complaining while they're only partially done with the attraction...people would also complain if JC was shut down to make the upgrades...people are going to be upset either way.

I do hope the skippers are able to keep jokes going during the changes without it being awkward for them.

I don't know what "Forced wokeness" is, seems like bait for an argument to me.

COP if it was made today could have a different family from each era and have a different ethnicity or a mixed family...that would be nice IMO. The current family is a bit odd in how it changes during the decades anyway.

 

[lightningtap347]

I don't really understand why this ride is currently open. To anyone who has been on it currently, what are the skippers doing during these sections of the ride?

 

[wdwmagic]

I don't really understand why this ride is currently open. To anyone who has been on it currently, what are the skippers doing during these sections of the ride?

They are doing the usual spiel and not really mentioning the missing parts.