Journey of Water featuring Moana coming to Epcot

[Casper Gutman]

Which rides are used for ILL is a function not of scale or quality, but demand and capacity. It’s hard to know exactly what the demand is for Rat since there’s no standby line, but it’s safe to assume that it’s “high” given that that’s a rule for new rides.

When TSL opened, A.S.S. was placed in the FP+ tier 1, not because it’s an E-ticket, but because it couldn’t handle the demand it was generating.

I don’t fault guests for their preferences, but it’s ultimately guests who determine which rides have their capacities rationed more so than it is TWDC.

This is all true of FP. But it was WDWs choice to begin charging per ride, and I’d argue that shift means Rat has to be judged as a $10 (or whatever) ride. It’s a policy that fundamentally redefined how we should view each ride - is it worth the price or is WDW overcharging? Rat is a great addition. It isn’t a $10 per-person-per-ride addition.

 

[UNCgolf]

Disney critics: “We need more D tickets. Not everything has to be so elaborate. Just add things to help spread out the crowds.”

*Disney adds a D ticket*

Disney critics: “They could have done so much more with this! It’s definitely not an E ticket. We deserve better!”

[Edit: I thought I was in the Ratatouille thread when I posted that. This was not in reference to JoW.]

This seems to misconstrue the argument. I could have missed it, but I don't think I've seen anyone complain that it's not an E. People have complained that they don't think Rat is a good ride and/or that it doesn't fit the area; not that it's a D ticket instead of an E ticket.

With the caveat that I haven't been on it yet, I think it looks pretty bad. I would definitely have preferred a different attraction there even if it was just a C ticket.

 

[DisneyDodo]

This seems to misconstrue the argument. I could have missed it, but I don't think I've seen anyone complain that it's not an E. People have complained that they don't think Rat is a good ride and/or that it doesn't fit the area; not that it's a D ticket instead of an E ticket.

With the caveat that I haven't been on it yet, I think it looks pretty bad. I would definitely have preferred a different attraction there even if it was just a C ticket.

The critics may not explicitly phrase their complaints that way, but they will lament all the ways it could have been better (which, if implemented, would elevate Rat to the "E-ticket" category) or they compare it unfavorably to rides that are E-tickets (e.g. "It's not as good as RotR or Spiderman.")

And this attitude is not unique to Rat. It comes up every time Disney adds something that's not a super-headliner - TSL, NRJ, UTS~JotLM, etc.

 

[Bocabear]

Thematically I think Rat fits fine...the movie takes place in Paris..it is at least in e relevant location and it is a new attraction.
Moana in Futureworld and Guardians Of The Galaxy feel very misplaced. Moana Journey Of Water seems like the perfect fit for Animal Kingdom...tied into a South Pacific section of the park that could be created where Chester and Hester were... Guardians would have been a better fit in DHS...

 

[gustaftp]

When I rode Ratatouille the woman in front of me cried tears of joy and I couldn't help but roll my eyes because yes, I do believe there is merit to the idea that many, many people are so deep into the Disney brand that they've made it their entire lifestyle that, yes, they might proclaim that a lazy, low effort, middling kiddie ride that doesn't belong at Epcot is "Great, actually."

You have no idea why she cried. Like nearly every sane person, I do not enjoy the current JII. However, when I ride it I get tears in my eyes when we go though the upside down house, because I remember riding the ride with my now-passed-on Oma (German Grandmother) about 15 years ago and she was laughing so hard at that scene. So as much as I hate the ride, the memory is so fond for me that I find myself tearing up a bit.

 

[Rich Brownn]

As I've said before one of the biggest problems with new vas old EPCOT is the fact of replacing 12-15 minute rides with 2-5 minute ones. It gives Future World the impression of running out of things to do quicker than it used to.

 

[Phicinfan]

I don't think I am the subject of this forum but if you would like to start that thread, go ahead.
I do not apologize that my opinion may not be yours but I respect your right to discuss it.

No, you are most free to voice your opinion, just as long as you understand its your opinion, and stating it over and over and over and over and over and etc... doesn't make it necessarily correct. Enjoy!

 

[Phicinfan]

Thematically I think Rat fits fine...the movie takes place in Paris..it is at least in e relevant location and it is a new attraction.

Agreed, not ideal but it fits thematically.

Moana in Futureworld and Guardians Of The Galaxy feel very misplaced.

Moana is not in Future world, its in World of Nature. That is the miss I think for you. As for Guardians, how does that NOT fit World of discovery or Future world?

Moana Journey Of Water seems like the perfect fit for Animal Kingdom...tied into a South Pacific section of the park that could be created where Chester and Hester were...

Agreed that would probably be a solid fit.

Guardians would have been a better fit in DHS...

If the focus is on the movie, totally agree. If base on some aspect of the future, not aligned here. Have to wait and see what exactly this is.

 

[UNCgolf]

The critics may not explicitly phrase their complaints that way, but they will lament all the ways it could have been better (which, if implemented, would elevate Rat to the "E-ticket" category) or they compare it unfavorably to rides that are E-tickets (e.g. "It's not as good as RotR or Spiderman.")

And this attitude is not unique to Rat. It comes up every time Disney adds something that's not a super-headliner - TSL, NRJ, UTS~JotLM, etc.

I really like NRJ.

Journey of the Little Mermaid is pretty terrible, though, and it's not because it's not an E ticket -- they also spent so much money on it that it probably should be an E. And Toy Story Land being a disaster doesn't have anything to do with E-ticket status either; it has fundamental design flaws everywhere and the theming is almost bare minimum. I also think claiming TSL wasn't intended to be a super headliner is wrong; Disney promoted it as a major expansion and clearly wanted people to think of it as something very important.

I'm sure some people think what you're suggesting re: E tickets, but I don't think it's the majority of complaints here. The complaints about changing Rat to fit it to EPCOT (which is unrealistic -- they'd have been better off just creating a new ride instead of doing that) wouldn't change it to an E, for example.

 

[Tom Morrow]

Thematically I think Rat fits fine...the movie takes place in Paris..it is at least in e relevant location and it is a new attraction.

I mean, yes, but only just barely. If they had to cram in an IP experience, with a little more effort they could have used the same ride system and layout but used it to create something more appropriate for Epcot. My idea is to have Remy give you a tour of Paris and all the Parisian cuisine he loves. What they did was essentially the cheapest, easiest way to give Epcot a new attraction. "This ride exists. We have space for it here. It technically fits. Done."

The bar should be higher than this. There's no point to having four different theme parks with four different overarching themes only to just plop attractions in that either don't fit at all (Guardians) or fit only by association (Rat).

You have no idea why she cried. Like nearly every sane person, I do not enjoy the current JII. However, when I ride it I get tears in my eyes when we go though the upside down house, because I remember riding the ride with my now-passed-on Oma (German Grandmother) about 15 years ago and she was laughing so hard at that scene. So as much as I hate the ride, the memory is so fond for me that I find myself tearing up a bit.

You're right, I suppose it was pretty judgemental of me to just assume she was just blown away by the ride.

 

[Bocabear]

Agreed, not ideal but it fits thematically.

Moana is not in Future world, its in World of Nature. That is the miss I think for you. As for Guardians, how does that NOT fit World of discovery or Future world?

Agreed that would probably be a solid fit.

If the focus is on the movie, totally agree. If base on some aspect of the future, not aligned here. Have to wait and see what exactly this is.

Thanks for reviewing all of my posts!

 

[dennis-in-ct]

Does anyone have a guess when this will be completed?

Also, Imagination does not fit in the "Nature" neighborhood, or does it.
What am I missing?

 

[doctornick]

Does anyone have a guess when this will be completed?

Also, Imagination does not fit in the "Nature" neighborhood, or does it.
What am I missing?

Imagination is considered part of World Celebration (the central part of Epcot also featuring SSE and the stuff in Innoventions East).

 

[Bocabear]

IE it is all a complete mess... Boundaries for areas make no sense... Well no sense with the current plan they have released...I would have to believe there is another plan where things begin to make sense with what they are doing, but at present it feels very disjointed.

 

[DisneyDodo]

IE it is all a complete mess... Boundaries for areas make no sense... Well no sense with the current plan they have released...I would have to believe there is another plan where things begin to make sense with what they are doing, but at present it feels very disjointed.

Of course it makes no sense! Usually, attractions are built to fit the land they're placed in. In this case, they're trying to contrive lands that fit the attractions that were already built without that land in mind. As a result, they have to resort to using overly generic land names that still don't even work. What does imagination have to do with celebrating the world?

I don't think breaking up FW into smaller, ideally more immersive, neighborhoods is a bad goal. I just think they should do it gradually. For example, they should keep the FW name in place for now, but start constructing sub-lands. Grouping Land & Seas into "World Nature" and then adding JoW makes sense. They should just leave it there until they can make the rest of it work, and then retire FW. But that would require deliberately theming neighboring pavilions to relate to each other, which is not what they're doing now (e.g. GotG and Play have absolutely nothing in common)

 

[DreamfinderGuy]

As for Guardians, how does that NOT fit World of discovery or Future world?

 

[ryno1982]

Imagination is considered part of World Celebration (the central part of Epcot also featuring SSE and the stuff in Innoventions East).

Oddly enough, to make things even more confusing, they were listing the ride as part of World Celebration, but the Film Festival as part of World Nature on the wait time boards throughout the park. This was a couple weeks ago, so not sure if they've changed it.

 

[James Alucobond]

I think you could argue Guardians "fits" within the context of the IP mandate, but an entire pavilion dedicated solely to Guardians does not fit, in my opinion. If the pavilion were Wonders of the Galaxy instead of Wonders of Xandar with a mix of information about hypothetical life elsewhere in the known universe alongside a bit of Guardians fantasy, it would be fine.

 

[Vinnie Mac]

Or you can just stay off discussion boards and go enjoy your wonderful day at EPCOT.
We get it, you like it... Go enjoy.

I think I'm within my rights to stay on this discussion board. The fun starts tomorrow! I will enjoy, thank you.

 

[Vinnie Mac]

But your assessment of general opinion seems flawed at best.

Without trying to sound rude, this is rather ironic coming from you (no offense).

I don't think either of us have agendas. We're just passionate about our opinions. As long as it doesn't get personal I don't think that's necessarily wrong, humans are emotional creatures who like to get their thoughts across in an effective manner.

Enjoy your trip.

Thank you nonetheless.