John Boyega accuses Disney of pushing his Star Wars character aside

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
The funny thing is it wasn't just non whites. They paraded Gwendolyn around like she was the ultimate bad in the universe with some huge part in the film. So it seems it wasn't just non whites that got the short end of it. Phasmas part was significantly worse and underutilized than Finn. But hey, she had a cool outfit.

I'm sure the pre-Froce Awakens toy sales justified how little the character was ultimately used. :rolleyes:
 

Wendy Pleakley

Well-Known Member
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Lucasfilm made a point of saying how their movies would be more inclusive, only to then sideline the sequel trilogy's token black character.

The diversity bait and switch marketing is worth calling out.

I didn't feel he was overly sidelined. One could argue that his character was deemed important enough to take the lead in his own subplot in Episode 8.

We shouldn't focus too much on marketing. A lot of people were disappointed at how little Phasma was in the movies. She was always meant to be a minor character. She played heavily in the marketing due to the "coolness" factor. Trailers are designed to sell movies, not accurately describe the product. Judging a movie based on the degree it lives up to the marketing is a recipe for disappointment or false expectations.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
Trailers are designed to sell movies, not accurately describe the product. Judging a movie based on the degree it lives up to the marketing is a recipe for disappointment or false expectations.

Which is bad and some of us would prefer media companies stop doing it, especially when portraying minority characters.

"Marketing gonna market" is not a good excuse anymore.
 

erasure fan1

Well-Known Member
That Disney's essentially cashed in on the character before anyone saw her in the movies and they probably felt that was good enough.

Of course, making a more interesting/impactful character probably would have increased toy sales too.
The funny part is I don't really remember there being a lot of phasma toys. Outside of the 3in and maybe a black series figure, I don't remember a big push. And that's why parading her around to all the events and putting her front and center made such little sense after seeing the force awakens. We can safely say that Disney missed the boat in every area with the sequels.
 

DoleWhipDrea

Well-Known Member
The funny part is I don't really remember there being a lot of phasma toys. Outside of the 3in and maybe a black series figure, I don't remember a big push. And that's why parading her around to all the events and putting her front and center made such little sense after seeing the force awakens. We can safely say that Disney missed the boat in every area with the sequels.

Yeah, I don’t remember being able to find any Phasma toys...just like you couldn’t find any Rey toys when TFA came out. Different background stormtroopers were deemed more important than one of main characters.

They dropped the ball with merchandise, too. Though my understanding is that that was Hasbro’s call. They didn’t want to produce any toys of female characters.

With this entire ST and inclusivity, it was one step forward, two steps back.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I thought of a way they could remedy many of these issues, both with Finn and Phasma's characters, and how they were ultimately pushed aside in the sequel trilogy:
A spin-off, standalone prequel film in the likes of Rogue One and Solo... FN-2187.

It tells the events of what happened from the time he was taken from his family as a young child by the First Order, and trained to be a fighter for the First Order, and ends within moments of boarding the ship for the assault on Jakku, as seen at the very beginning of TFA.

This could solve many problems within the pacing and character developments within the sequel trilogy, such as:

Allowing much more time to show FN's internal struggle with right & wrong.
At the beginning of TFA, it seemed so rushed how he transitioned from bad guy to wanting to help the Resistance. It didn't really flesh-out his emotions and make the transition meaningful (imo). It felt like: Ok, battle time...wait this is wrong...*poof* I'm good now!
With a spin-off prequel having FN as the main character focus, it could allow time to show his conflicts grow within, as he sees signs throughout his training & upbringing that this may not be a good team/family that he's part of, and their motives may not be so healthy.
The whole movie showing him have a constant struggle with wanting to do what is required of him by his First Order "family"... but deep down him having this feeling something is "off".
Perhaps even show a long, developed friendship with the stormtrooper who ultimately perished in front of FN at the beginning of TFA, and left that bloody handprint on his helmet. Show how years & years of past friendship led FN to ultimately snap and switch to good when he seems them die before his eyes.

Make Phasma the villain she needed to be.
Make Captain Phasma the main, numero uno antagonist in the spin-off. Plenty of screen time. Show her true ruthlessness as she trains the young stormtroopers. Make actions and encounters with her reasons why FN is seeing the true wickedness behind the First Order.
Of course, bring back Driver, Gleeson, and Serkis to reprise their roles in the spin-off... but only for *minor* cameos.
Make Gwendoline Christie shine in this one as a main villain with action that felt so lacking in the sequels.

I believe this could be a successful project, whether as a theatrical release or for Disney+.
Give Boyega the story his character deserved, lead up to the big character transition from evil to good we saw in TFA, give more insight into the First Order and its operations, and make Phasma a main big bad.

I'm on board with any of this. What do you all think?
I think they probably had ideas spinning around for a Finn D+ something. I also think Boyega wet the bed and ruined any chance of that happening. I'm not sure Disney would want him back ever at this point.

As for Phasma, I think a micro series with her starting with the first order, and following her as she moves her way up to captain, could be very cool. Especially if they actually deliver on her being a super bad a. Unfortunately I think this current band of clowns at Lucasfilm have jacked up the sequels to the point of its unlikely they will persue any of those threads. I think they will put all the focus on the new movies.

You want more?!???

God no...I don’t want any more at all. The toy has been broken and it’s time to move on. And I can’t explain what that personal opinion means.

Less appeal than Star Trek at this point.less interesting than game of thrones (which I bet no one has thought of AT ALL in a year)
I feel for John Boyega and many of the other actors involved in the ST. No, Boyega doesn’t want to work with Disney again. Why would he? If your employer does you wrong, you can move on from them, and he’s moved on. Finn’s story was absolutely squandered. By TROS, he was either screaming Rey’s name over and over, or gleefully shooting down people that he used to work with while whooping. Seriously...what?!

People like to point fingers and say who specifically was responsible, but it’s a series of bad decisions with no one keeping a unified vision. Before you shoot big budget films like this, with plans for multiple movies, you have an outline. The ST clearly didn’t have an outline. I was going to say that Disney thought that they could do Star Wars films the way they do Marvel films, but they didn’t even do that. Marvel is charted out way in advance, and that’s a huge reason why the films have such a great payoff. With Star Wars, people were throwing balls to each other - from different rooms. And then others higher ups at Disney grabbed the ball and closed the door on their teammates, and accidentally broke the ball. So we all lost.

Seeing this mishandling on such an important franchise - something that truly means a lot to so many people - is infuriating.
Excellent 👏
As a long term Star Wars fan I am disappointed with the last three installments, I enjoyed watching them, but the stories could have been better developed. In the first iteration of the last three the Finn character had a key purpose but in the next two films he was just a side kick. If Finn had not survived his encounter with Kylo Ren just before the death planet blew up he would have been a hero and referenced as a hero in the next productions. Oh well, the Finn character needs to have achieved his goal as a deserter and disappear to the far reaches of the outer rim. Mr. B needs to find projects elsewhere.
Now the Phasma spin off showing her induction, development and achievement getting to the rank of captain would make for an interesting Star Wars related story. Sort of a Rogue One but for the Empire, it has possibilities.
I think in a short time the prequels will be generally regarded as better efforts/stories than these.

The Disney movies are forgettable. Which is worse than corny. Kingdom of the crystal skull
Is more watchable...trust me, I’ve tried.
A hard feat to pull off when you had 3 of the most iconic characters in movie history to use.

And to be clear: the prequels suck.
Yeah, I don’t remember being able to find any Phasma toys...just like you couldn’t find any Rey toys when TFA came out. Different background stormtroopers were deemed more important than one of main characters.

They dropped the ball with merchandise, too. Though my understanding is that that was Hasbro’s call. They didn’t want to produce any toys of female characters.

With this entire ST and inclusivity, it was one step forward, two steps back.
The lack of Star Wars merchandise now is a tremendous financial failure on Disney...

It’s an afterthought in record time. Times have changed...but the dwindling stock/demand for Star Wars in this day and age is flabbergasting. And it’s irrefutable proof that the Disney movies have been bad in my opinion.
 

doctornick

Well-Known Member
Not for nothing, but I was really hoping for a Finn/Poe Disney+ series at some point. Thought it would be cool to see them in action more as I rather liked both characters, but they were undeveloped. Oh well, that doesn't seem like that will ever happen.
 

GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member
You want more?!???

God no...I don’t want any more at all. The toy has been broken and it’s time to move on. And I can’t explain what that personal opinion means.

Less appeal than Star Trek at this point.less interesting than game of thrones (which I bet no one has thought of AT ALL in a year)
Excellent 👏

I think in a short time the prequels will be generally regarded as better efforts/stories than these.

The Disney movies are forgettable. Which is worse than corny. Kingdom of the crystal skull
Is more watchable...trust me, I’ve tried.
A hard feat to pull off when you had 3 of the most iconic characters in movie history to use.

And to be clear: the prequels suck.

The lack of Star Wars merchandise now is a tremendous financial failure on Disney...

It’s an afterthought in record time. Times have changed...but the dwindling stock/demand for Star Wars in this day and age is flabbergasting. And it’s irrefutable proof that the Disney movies have been bad in my opinion.
The PORG's. The fans enjoyed those little creatures more than the character Finn. They didn't even have lines.
 

erasure fan1

Well-Known Member
I think in a short time the prequels will be generally regarded as better efforts/stories than these.
I think that has already happened honestly. The prequels will always get dogged for Hayden and Natalies acting, some very cringey dialog and of course, Jar Jar. But overall, as a cohesive story and piece of work, the prequels have moved in front of the sequels for a lot of people. I know for me, the prequels have gotten easier to watch and the sequels, have gone the opposite.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I think that has already happened honestly. The prequels will always get dogged for Hayden and Natalies acting, some very cringey dialog and of course, Jar Jar. But overall, as a cohesive story and piece of work, the prequels have moved in front of the sequels for a lot of people. I know for me, the prequels have gotten easier to watch and the sequels, have gone the opposite.
...you know that I agree with you...but I can’t say it or Rambo and Rey will show up and blast me...

one highly bloated, completely unjustified box office for a reboot (which they kept hidden - I might remind) had masked what is a complete failure. But only a superficial cover at best.
 

InnKpr

Well-Known Member
Oh...and on a “related” note...I saw this the other night and forget to post it...

Actors revealing screw ups/mismanagement:

Hmm... This new information coming from Ridley makes Disney/Lucasfilm have quite the long nose after insisting that Palpatine's return was "planned from the start".

Most people suspected that was a lie. This pretty much confirms it.
 

Wendy Pleakley

Well-Known Member
Which is bad and some of us would prefer media companies stop doing it, especially when portraying minority characters.

"Marketing gonna market" is not a good excuse anymore.

I'm not a fan of misleading marketing, but it is what it is.

I'd have an issue if a movie trailer hinted at a diverse cast only to find out the characters in question are barely in the movie. However, did that happen here? Finn had a significant role in Episode 7 and the marketing portrayed that. He may not have been quite as important in subsequent episodes, but we were never promised something more than what was given.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I'm not a fan of misleading marketing, but it is what it is.

I'd have an issue if a movie trailer hinted at a diverse cast only to find out the characters in question are barely in the movie. However, did that happen here? Finn had a significant role in Episode 7 and the marketing portrayed that. He may not have been quite as important in subsequent episodes, but we were never promised something more than what was given.
The third trailer for the first movie was actually the peak of the “trilogy”....roll tape.

And frankly...it was completely misleading...but not about the characters
 

tk924

Well-Known Member
...Palpatine's return was "planned from the start".

 

erasure fan1

Well-Known Member
Hmm... This new information coming from Ridley makes Disney/Lucasfilm have quite the long nose after insisting that Palpatine's return was "planned from the start".

Most people suspected that was a lie. This pretty much confirms it.
Was it an outright lie? Probably not. I bet they did talk about it. Brainstorming and creative idea meetings tend to hit most all, well what if this happens. Was it a real contender? I doubt it. It seems to me it came to be after they let Rian do whatever he wanted. We all know that if it was an actual scenario, we would have had some hint Palps was around.
 

LSLS

Well-Known Member
Wasn't there a story say back that Johnson was basically forced to include finn more than he wanted? I mean, I guess the buck stops with disney, but if I'm remembering that correctly, its fair to point out they wanted him to be a much bigger player.
 

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