Jedi Training Academy to close to reopen later this year as 'Jedi Training - Trials of the Temple'

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
JTA was not based on Star Wars Rebels. If it has been "re-imagined" to that it's the definition of a convoluted backstory.

The "Trials of the Temple" re-do is indeed based on SWRebels. That's why it included the Seventh Sister, who is a character from SWRebels.

I'm sorry you think it's convoluted. Those who have seen Rebels or pay attention to the show's dialogue should ordinarily not have any confusion as to what's happening.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
The "Trials of the Temple" re-do is indeed based on SWRebels. That's why it included the Seventh Sister, who is a character from SWRebels.

I'm sorry you think it's convoluted. Those who have seen Rebels or pay attention to the show's dialogue should ordinarily not have any confusion as to what's happening.

I just rewatched the video I took of the show last year. Now I see what you're talking about.

In fairness to myself and all other parents attending, we're paying more attention to our children than the lines in the show. The kids are probably just focused on learning their light saber skills. Most likely the majority of them do not watch Rebels on a regular basis.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
Not having classic Star Wars characters,vehicles, aliens, and droids, the new land will easily be its downfall. The original trilogy is timeless but we don't know how long the sequel trilogy will be relevant. Not having those X-Wings or Imperial Shuttles or classic Stormtroopers or Darth Vader will really just harm the entire land in the long run, in my honest opinion.

I just can't imagine that they'd exclude the classic characters. Is this confirmed? @CaptainAmerica do you info?
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
From the show:

"Our greatest hopes and greatest fears may seem to come alive here. You might see frightening enemies and they might seem different for each of us. But remember they are not real. What we see is our fears seeming to be real."

"So what if we have a fear of wamp rats?"

"Then you might see wamp rats."

After DV and SS appear...

"Students, remain calm they appear to be real."

So.... perhaps a better attention to the show dialogue is in order?
That's the new show not the original. Perhaps reading what I actually wrote would help with comprehension of a pretty simple concept.
 
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GoofGoof

Premium Member
The "Trials of the Temple" re-do is indeed based on SWRebels. That's why it included the Seventh Sister, who is a character from SWRebels.

I'm sorry you think it's convoluted. Those who have seen Rebels or pay attention to the show's dialogue should ordinarily not have any confusion as to what's happening.
The vast majority of WDW guests do not have an intricate knowledge of Star Wars Rebels. They know Darth Vader and Darth Maul from the movies.
 

Disney Dad 3000

Well-Known Member
I always enjoy stopping to check out a few minutes of this and I would hate to see this show go (still working on getting my kids courage up for this in a future visit). I would guess though the show is safe for several more years and it and ST will both get shut down at the same time (maybe 2021-22).

I thought it had been common knowledge that the new SWGE focused on episodes 7-9 but I know there is so many updates and rumors to keep up with you don't know them all unless you are marni or read through the great resource mister penguin put together. I don't see how the Jedi trials though would fit unfortunately in the new land, even with a revamp. I too loved ep 4-6 but after the initial disappointment, I get the idea of a new locale and the immersive experience they are going for.

To me this just really boils back to the fact they have plenty of story lines and opportunity that they should have just gone all out and built a star wars 5th park with SW all in one place (which would probably make both SW and non SW fans happy). Then they could have had lands for each of the trilogies and put Jedi in a Coruscant area or a in a mini dagobah area or even if they wanted to tie to newer films with older references like Jeddah in rogue one.
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
That's the new show not the original. Perhaps reading what I actually wrote would help with comprehension of a pretty simple concept.

OK, then...


I brought this up in one of the Star Wars threads and nobody seemed to know what the future is for JTA. I assumed they would build an area into SW Land for this attraction (preferably indoors since it's hot as heck waiting for the show to start and can get cancelled if it rains). Some of the hard core Star Wars fanboys got bent out of shape over that because Darth Vader is dead before the timeline of the new trilogy and only characters from the new trilogy can be part of Star Wars Land. I don't know if that's just Fanboy talk or if Disney plans to actually follow that as a strict rule. I think they could get around it with some convoluted backstory to explain why Vader is there.

They did indeed get around it with the updated JTA and renamed it Trials of the Temple. I don't remember the plot of the original JTA, but the new one specifically provides a plot point that's canon to the original trilogy and Rebels of why all those dead characters are there. So, there's your backstory. And it's not a convoluted one.



There is nothing during the show itself to imply that the characters are force illusions. Yoda's voice is heard without a physical Yoda character so maybe that but Vader and the others are portrayed as real people physically present. If they want to call them force illusions to placate adult Star Wars fanboys that's fine. Convoluted backstories are not uncommon with Disney. For the kids in the show they think they are fighting Vader or Darth Maul not a force illusion.

If you're talking about the show that's been gone for 21 months, then perhaps you're right. Again, it's been a while since I've seen the original. The one that's there now -- and has been since December 1, 2015 -- is the Trials of the Temple version and provides a reason why those characters are there.



JTA was not based on Star Wars Rebels. If it has been "re-imagined" to that it's the definition of a convoluted backstory.

Yes, it has been reimagined. Twenty-one months ago. In your opinion it's convoluted. But it is canonical to the original trilogy and Rebels.



The vast majority of WDW guests do not have an intricate knowledge of Star Wars Rebels. They know Darth Vader and Darth Maul from the movies.

If they're guests at a Disney park and big enough fans of SW to want to participate, I'd think there's a good chance they've seen the animated series on a Disney channel.

If they've seen Return of the Jedi, they know all about how the force can manifest their greatest fear in order to fight them.

During the new show, of which you're obviously ignorant, the dialogue tells them that they're not real. You don't have to know the series except perhaps to have prior knowledge of who the Seventh Sister is. And in the dialogue, they introduce her as an Inquisitor, a Jedi hunter, which is really all you need to know.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
I'm not sure what's so difficult to comprehend here. The original Jedi Training Academy had a pretty simple plot. Kids were trained by a Jedi master, there was a disturbance in the force and the storm troopers came out and then Vader. Vader tried to turn the young padowans to the dark side. They resisted and then Vader brought out Darth Maul and they fought the kids. The kids eventually win and Vader and Maul go away. End of show. At no time did I see anyone question why Vader and Maul were together when they don't appear together in the films. Nobody cared. It was fun for the kids and adults watching.

According to some poster's here the show was "re-imagined" and the bad guys are now just force illusions to help explain why these characters are appearing together and this may also allow them to appear in SW Land. My whole point is that the show worked to me without that extra backstory. If you want to call me ignorant that's fine. We're all entitled to opinions.

I don't see why a theme park attraction must follow cannon for a film series to the letter. I fear that while attempting to do that with SW Land you will please hard core SW fans but disappoint some casual guests. When they opened WWoHP they built an Ollivanders in Hogs Meade even though its located in Diagon Alley in the books and movies. Having the attraction and wand sales was more important than following details to the letter. I've haven't heard many say they though WWoHP wasn't immersive because of that flaw and the wand shop was very popular and still is even after the second one opened. Same goes for classic SW characters. I personally can forgive the flaw of certain popular characters being around in the wrong timeframe as opposed to not having them. If it takes a convoluted backstory like ghosts to have those characters then that's fine with me since a small fraction of guests would even know the backstory. Again, just my opinion.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure what's so difficult to comprehend here. The original Jedi Training Academy had a pretty simple plot. Kids were trained by a Jedi master, there was a disturbance in the force and the storm troopers came out and then Vader. Vader tried to turn the young padowans to the dark side. They resisted and then Vader brought out Darth Maul and they fought the kids. The kids eventually win and Vader and Maul go away. End of show. At no time did I see anyone question why Vader and Maul were together when they don't appear together in the films. Nobody cared. It was fun for the kids and adults watching.

According to some poster's here the show was "re-imagined" and the bad guys are now just force illusions to help explain why these characters are appearing together and this may also allow them to appear in SW Land. My whole point is that the show worked to me without that extra backstory. If you want to call me ignorant that's fine. We're all entitled to opinions.

I don't see why a theme park attraction must follow cannon for a film series to the letter. I fear that while attempting to do that with SW Land you will please hard core SW fans but disappoint some casual guests. When they opened WWoHP they built an Ollivanders in Hogs Meade even though its located in Diagon Alley in the books and movies. Having the attraction and wand sales was more important than following details to the letter. I've haven't heard many say they though WWoHP wasn't immersive because of that flaw and the wand shop was very popular and still is even after the second one opened. Same goes for classic SW characters. I personally can forgive the flaw of certain popular characters being around in the wrong timeframe as opposed to not having them. If it takes a convoluted backstory like ghosts to have those characters then that's fine with me since a small fraction of guests would even know the backstory. Again, just my opinion.

Yeah, I have a SW obsessed kid.. but adult SW Geeks need to understand that "obsession" at those ages doesn't equal knowledge of every little character and plot. Example- Rogue One on opening night, much anticipated from my kid- was confused thru most of it as to how and who the characters were.. but afterwards spent the car ride home talking in length about the "super awesome battle" scene.

I said this in another thread about another topic as well.. I don't know about other families, but it's a rare occasion when my child has time to sit and watch a tv show. Between sports, homework, and dinner, there just isn't enough hours in the day. Most kids that age go to bed around 8pm, not up watching On Demand in the evening. He has seen a few episodes of Rebels though.. but when we do have random times for tv shows it's usually American Ninja Warrior or Ronaldo compilations on YouTube.

To make a long story short- Adult SW Fans need to accept that Kids are huge fans as well.. even without all of the intricate details. Not everything has to perfectly fit together for them to enjoy living a dream at Disney World.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
It's not at ALL convoluted for Vader to bring out the guy who died when Vader was a kid! (And if you say, wait, he's not dead, then you ARE in fact acknowledging the cartoons, in which case it STILL doesn't make sense because Maul is now opposed to Palpatine and Vader.)
That's my whole point. The show existed for years that way and worked just fine. It was wildly popular. It's only an issue for hard core SW fans. IMHO Disney should focus on appealing to the masses instead of limiting the offerings to placate a niche group of fans. Let the SW resort be the place for extreme SW geekiness.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
So, if an Indy ride in DAK appealed to the masses, you'd be okay with that?
Apples and Oranges. There is already a SW area at DHS. If they wanted to add an Indy land at DHS and there were both a Raiders ride and a Temple of Doom ride I wouldn't care that 2 bad guys who don't overlap in the films both appear in the land.

All that I'm saying is it's a missed opportunity to limit the new SW land to only new trilogy characters because of some desire to appeal to hard core SW fans. Give the rest of the public what they want which is Vader and Maul and bobba Fett.
 

Jones14

Well-Known Member
And how do you know that the general public wants Vader and Maul and Boba Fett? Everyone I know who would not be classified as a Star Wars fan could not care less about which characters end up in the land. Hell, most of them don't even know that there's going to be more than one ride, or that the First Order is even a different thing than the Empire. There's stormtroopers, Tie Fighters, and a bad guy in a cloak with a red lightsaber. That's all they know, and all they care about.

On the other hand, the hardcore Star Wars fans I know are happy that they're getting rid of the timeline issues by setting it in a particular time, and are super excited to get to fly the Millenium Falcon (a situation made possible due to the timeline and location). Not only is it not an issue, it's good for everyone, fans and average joes alike.
 

Magicart87

HOUSE OF MAGIC Member
Premium Member
Trails of the Temple. It's so obvious! Now I understand the reasoning behind the rename. In a few years time, when "the land" is ready for ground-breaking all WDI has to do is just slap some paint on this attraction and give it a new premise that has children limbo-ing under poisonous blow darts, deciphering tribal hieroglyphs and mastering a bullwhip. Instead of bulldozing they'll just work it into the new Indiana Jones mini-land. :cautious:
 
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21stamps

Well-Known Member
And how do you know that the general public wants Vader and Maul and Boba Fett? Everyone I know who would not be classified as a Star Wars fan could not care less about which characters end up in the land. Hell, most of them don't even know that there's going to be more than one ride, or that the First Order is even a different thing than the Empire. There's stormtroopers, Tie Fighters, and a bad guy in a cloak with a red lightsaber. That's all they know, and all they care about.

On the other hand, the hardcore Star Wars fans I know are happy that they're getting rid of the timeline issues by setting it in a particular time, and are super excited to get to fly the Millenium Falcon (a situation made possible due to the timeline and location). Not only is it not an issue, it's good for everyone, fans and average joes alike.

Do you have kids? I'm asking because some of the comments here aren't taking children into account whatsoever. Ya know, the kids who's parents buy all of the Star Wars merchandise- toys, clothes, costumes, backpacks, school supplies, bedding, room decor, etc etc.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
And how do you know that the general public wants Vader and Maul and Boba Fett? Everyone I know who would not be classified as a Star Wars fan could not care less about which characters end up in the land. Hell, most of them don't even know that there's going to be more than one ride, or that the First Order is even a different thing than the Empire. There's stormtroopers, Tie Fighters, and a bad guy in a cloak with a red lightsaber. That's all they know, and all they care about.

On the other hand, the hardcore Star Wars fans I know are happy that they're getting rid of the timeline issues by setting it in a particular time, and are super excited to get to fly the Millenium Falcon (a situation made possible due to the timeline and location). Not only is it not an issue, it's good for everyone, fans and average joes alike.
I'm not getting into some sort of academic debate over which characters are most popular. I think it's pretty safe to say that outside of maybe Luke, Darth Vader is the most well known and iconic character from the series.

You are implying there are 2 groups, those who are hardcore SW fans and everyone else. If I had to generalize I would say there are really 3 general groups not just 2. At one extreme there is a group of people who have never seen Star Wars and couldn't care less about it and although they probably know who Darth Vader is they don't care if he appears in the land or not. There is another large group in the middle who are at least casual fans of the movies and are pretty familiar with the characters and would have an opinion one way or the other. Then there is the other extreme which is the hardcore fan base that will worry about every detail. When I said the general public I meant the ones from the middle group who would actually care. I agree there are some people out there who just don't care. It's just my opinion that the group who are fans but not hardcore Star Wars nerds is a pretty large group and will want to see Darth Vader and other classic characters in a Star Wars Land.

It's not just me, how many other people have commented in this thread just today that they were surprised or disappointed that the new land is limited to the new trilogy.
 

Jones14

Well-Known Member
Do you have kids? I'm asking because some of the comments here aren't taking children into account whatsoever. Ya know, the kids who's parents buy all of the Star Wars merchandise- toys, clothes, costumes, backpacks, school supplies, bedding, room decor, etc etc.

I don't have kids, so I would not be able to speak to how they view the franchise outside of my friends who have them. From what I gather, BB-8 (understandably) rules the land these days, but I don't even have enough good friends with kids to make a general statement on what they like the most.

I'm not getting into some sort of academic debate over which characters are most popular. I think it's pretty safe to say that outside of maybe Luke, Darth Vader is the most well known and iconic character from the series.

You are implying there are 2 groups, those who are hardcore SW fans and everyone else. If I had to generalize I would say there are really 3 general groups not just 2. At one extreme there is a group of people who have never seen Star Wars and couldn't care less about it and although they probably know who Darth Vader is they don't care if he appears in the land or not. There is another large group in the middle who are at least casual fans of the movies and are pretty familiar with the characters and would have an opinion one way or the other. Then there is the other extreme which is the hardcore fan base that will worry about every detail. When I said the general public I meant the ones from the middle group who would actually care. I agree there are some people out there who just don't care. It's just my opinion that the group who are fans but not hardcore Star Wars nerds is a pretty large group and will want to see Darth Vader and other classic characters in a Star Wars Land.

It's not just me, how many other people have commented in this thread just today that they were surprised or disappointed that the new land is limited to the new trilogy.

I'm not saying that there's only the two groups, but those were the two you compared (hardcore fans and the general public, which I took to mean non-fans), so those were the two I addressed. I definitely disagree with you on the notion that most casual fans will be upset that the land isn't based during the original trilogy, though. The new trilogy seems to be going over well with casual fans, and Vader will still be present as long as Jedi Training and/or Star Tours is around. There are definitely going to be outliers, but I really think that the only way the majority of visitors would be dissastisfied is if they showed up to find a land based on the prequels. Going with the new trilogy makes the most amount of people happy, and gives them wiggle room to keep a few old favorites around.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
I'm not saying that there's only the two groups, but those were the two you compared (hardcore fans and the general public, which I took to mean non-fans), so those were the two I addressed. I definitely disagree with you on the notion that most casual fans will be upset that the land isn't based during the original trilogy, though. The new trilogy seems to be going over well with casual fans
We can agree to disagree. I think the majority of WDW guests will expect to see Darth Vader somewhere in a Star Wars Land. I don't disagree that the new trilogy is popular as well. If they built the land with characters only from the original trilogy I think we would hear the same complaints of where is Kylo Ren or BB8. I think people want to see all of their favorite characters. I also don't think most people think of it as having to be limited to only one set of movies. Like I said in the beginning of this discussion the original Jedi Training Academy had both Vader and Darth Maul who shouldn't be together if you follow strict Star Wars cannon. That show was wildly popular and I never personally heard a person complain that it didn't fit a specific timeline.
Vader will still be present as long as Jedi Training and/or Star Tours is around
Most of the insiders here seem to think that Star Tours will be rethemed to something non-Star Wars once the big push of crowds settles down for the land. One of the reason a few of us were questioning why they didn't build a show theater in the new Star Wars Land for Jedi Training is that it won't have a home once Star Tours goes. It's still pretty popular for kids so I hope they keep it around but it doesn't seem like it will fit.
 

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