I think “The Magic” is mostly gone for me…

[Sir_Cliff]

Break out of the Disney bubble and go other places. When you DO get back to Disney you can see it with better eyes and enjoy it better. Going every year, you find yourself so invested that it's not even an enjoyable trip anymore because you spend so much time being mad and complaining. The company instilled that kind of mindset in us but we HAVE to walk away before we really hate the company, lol. Which is sad because I love it but I need a break.

I'm curious to know when almost solely vacationing at Disney became a thing. They certainly lean into it now with DVC, but my impression is that going to WDW several times a year or even once every year is something that significant numbers of people only started doing relatively recently.

I agree that standards have slipped and prices are out of control, so I'm not discounting those reasons for people failing to get much enjoyment out of a WDW trip. I do wonder, though, whether the fact so many now visit so frequently contributes to the sense that it isn't the special place it once was as all the flaws become especially obvious with such familiarity.

Must admit that I am often surprised when posters who are almost unfailingly negative on here about everything happening at WDW mention recent trips or that they're currently at the resort as I can't imagine continuing to spend so much money on a place that really doesn't bring me joy. I enjoyed my last WDW trip in 2017, but even then I felt a little nickel and dimed so when I think about where to spend my time and money, WDW is not really on my radar. I'm sure I'll get back there at some point (between DLP trips!), but leaving those kinds of gaps between visits means there's still some excitement in going there even if I'm not thrilled with a lot of how they're currently running the parks.

 

[jimbojones]

Depends where in WDW you ate then and where you eat now.

I remember eating in the Contemporary's cafeteria (prob late 1970's). WDW's cafeteria was very good compared to other cafeterias of that time period.

Disney quick serve burgers (1980's) were not good, but the type/quality of burgers and fries they served were not uncommon for that era.

Alas though, I also remember the few times we dined in what is now California Grill. Food there was excellent!

When Epcot was young, the World Showcase restaurants had comparatively great food for that era.

WDW food quality has had numerous ups and downs over the last 20 years. On my most recent visit this spring, some food was very good, some was terrible.
The food we were served at Pinocchio's was nearly inedible. Hot food was not hot, and cold food was not cold. The pizza was room temp, the chicken strips were rubbery, and we were not late picking up our food.

Yes standards for food have changed a lot! I think many younger people do not understand just how much more quality food is available today compared with the 70s 80s and 90s. If my kids school served what I was fed as a child someone would probably get fired. Standards and expectations for food quality are way higher than they were 30+ years ago. We also have a much greater diversity of food options available to us today. My grandparents would not be able to identify much of what is on the shelves of a decent super market today.

A 1980s suburban meal was chicken or beef, a potato, and some canned or frozen vegetables boiled until all flavor was gone ("English style") , or spaghetti and meatballs. A middle class traveler was easier to impress. "A salad with something other than iceberg lettuce, how exotic!" - my parents in the 80s.

 

[Kamikaze]

Its called sponsorship, theres been alot of rides you probably don't like. Especially in Disneyland where you used to have the monsanto aluminum hall of fame, monsanto home of the future, monsanto fashion and fabrics through the ages, general electric COP, Dutch boy color gallery, Epcot was nothing but sponsorship for its early existence. Or is it just oil that you dont like? In that case I hope you enjoy the Frozen overlay.

No, its not sponsorship, it was blatant shilling of oil. Its different.

This is far different that Siemens sponsoring Spaceship Earth.

That Time Mickey Mouse and Goofy Shilled for Exxon at Disney World — Paleofuture

Back in 1985, Mickey Mouse and his old pal Goofy taught kids visiting Disney's EPCOT Center about the future of energy in America—with a little help from the good folks at Exxon. Some kids at the World's Fair-themed park received a complimentary comic book entitled Mic

paleofuture.com

 

[SteveAZee]

So I do have a question about Energy. I first went in 1983. And loved the ride, and it might have been my favorite when i was 8. But by the time that it was removed, its time was over. IF you read tourist guides or reviews, they told you to skip it, with its too long of a ride time (in todays world of short attention spans), people used it for the ac and to sleep.

The ride cost alot to run, and was usually 25 percent full (kind of like the star cruiser), a refurb wouldnt have helped it as it still would have been really long, with a ride mechanism that would always be a slow ride first watching a movie then a short ride through animatronics. No matter what they did, it would have been a D style ride in a location, cost and size that needed to be an A or B.

So my question, when does nostalgia outrank reality?

COP and other rides that have some of the same faults are saved due to history. While being an opening day attraction at Epcot and 35ish years later, it didnt qualify for that same historical status imho.

I feel about the same as this, I rode UofE in 1982 (I was in my 20's) and experiencing EPCOT for the first time. I was impressed with the scope of all of EPCOT and I liked the Edutainment, even if it was biased or simplistic or whatever. Looking back at the classics though and watching videos (which are never as good as the real thing) of this, Horizons, etc... I wouldn't want to go back to that. The world is a different place running at a different pace. I'm glad that I had the chance to experience that era, but I'm good with moving forward.

 

[jaklgreen]

I do find it sad that Disney is not the same Disney as it was 20 years ago. I blame them trying to keep everyone happy instead of them doing what they have always done. That and it is never enough money for the shareholders. When a business changes their focus from a great product and making money, to just trying to be a money machine, things suffer. They never should have introduced the dining plan, and they never should have introduced FP. If they kept it how it was, with everyone waiting in line, and not trying to streamline food, things would be so different.
It is OK to not want to go. I still love going but the way I do WDW has changed. I am DVC and so I spend more time at the resort just relaxing. I will sleep in and then go to the parks for a few hours, go on my standard rides and then go have a decent meal. I am just happy to be there as opposed to working. I must be feeling my age, but I just can't go go go all day anymore.
I agree with what AndyS2992 said in an earlier post, the cast members are not the same as they used to be. I have heard more personal conversation, usually complaining, in the last 2 years than I have heard in the last 20. I get working with the public sucks, I did that for over 30 years, but if you can't put on that happy face anymore(which I can not), then you find something else.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I live 12 miles away from WDW and the last time I was in a park at WDW was right after RotR opened.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

This is comedy, right? You list attractions but of the first 5 you talk about, 3 are the absolute worst. Longing for Universe of Energy? It was an ad for OIL COMPANIES. It was awful. I don't see how any one can possibly miss it.

To each their own, of course.

To me, Universe is all-time favourite. Grand, miraculous, mysterious. Phenomenal songs too, that bookended the ride with a great preshow and finale. It just lagged a little bit during some of the movie parts.

And yes, a corporate ride. I share your reservations about that. I even did so as a young teenager, in EPCOT's heyday. But ultimately this is what EPCOT was, what it was always meant to be. A showcase of American industry. Which is not exclusively a force of evil in this world.

 

[ppete1975]

No, its not sponsorship, it was blatant shilling of oil. Its different.

This is far different that Siemens sponsoring Spaceship Earth.

That Time Mickey Mouse and Goofy Shilled for Exxon at Disney World — Paleofuture

Back in 1985, Mickey Mouse and his old pal Goofy taught kids visiting Disney's EPCOT Center about the future of energy in America—with a little help from the good folks at Exxon. Some kids at the World's Fair-themed park received a complimentary comic book entitled Mic

paleofuture.com

But its really not, the comic book and if remember the movie (its been years) wasnt EXXON this EXXON that, it was talking about fossil fuels. Which like many pavillions talked about how things are done. At that point it was fossil fuels, but it also discussed how we need to move past it. Heck the building had solar panels. Just because an article says a buzz word like shilling doesnt mean its true, there was nothing blatant like you keep portraying about Exxon as the sponsor. That was different than any other sponsor. I will say sponsorship isnt as in your face as it was in the 50s-80s at Disney, but almost all things had a sponsor. In epcot that included corporate lounges.
Heck GM has a car showroom at the end. So you got a mickey mouse comic book that said presented by exxon?
I cant find the transcript for the original but Ellen doesnt even mention EXXON.

Some rides gave you samples of the sponsors products at the end, so the comic books werent a big deal.

 

[ppete1975]

I feel about the same as this, I rode UofE in 1982 (I was in my 20's) and experiencing EPCOT for the first time. I was impressed with the scope of all of EPCOT and I liked the Edutainment, even if it was biased or simplistic or whatever. Looking back at the classics though and watching videos (which are never as good as the real thing) of this, Horizons, etc... I wouldn't want to go back to that. The world is a different place running at a different pace. I'm glad that I had the chance to experience that era, but I'm good with moving forward.

I think world of motion would be ok now, or at least at spaceship earth level.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

But its really not, the comic book and if remember the movie (its been years) wasnt EXXON this EXXON that, it was talking about fossil fuels. Which like many pavillions talked about how things are done. At that point it was fossil fuels, but it also discussed how we need to move past it. Heck the building had solar panels. Just because an article says a buzz word like shilling doesnt mean its true, there was nothing blatant like you keep portraying about Exxon as the sponsor. That was different than any other sponsor. I will say sponsorship isnt as in your face as it was in the 50s-80s at Disney, but almost all things had a sponsor. In epcot that included corporate lounges.
Heck GM has a car showroom at the end. So you got a mickey mouse comic book that said presented by exxon?
I cant find the transcript for the original but Ellen doesnt even mention EXXON.

Some rides gave you samples of the sponsors products at the end, so the comic books werent a big deal.

And let's not forget the de facto post-show, the great Energy Exchange! Where you can educate yourself about wind and solar power and sustainability.

One of my favourites was the energy-producing bike. It's overt goal was to show how very little energy you produce by cycling even fast. But I always remembered that this means the reverse too, then: that with a little bit of energy you can thus cycle a lot. To this day I do everything on bike.

So much more than just an Exxon / oil add:

EPCOT's Universe of Energy Companion Site: Energy Exchange

Board our virtual Traveling Theater for a trip through the Universe of Energy and beyond. Travel back 300 million years to view the age of the dinosaur; explore the present through sights, sound and memories; and glimpse the future of energy resources and conservation.

progresscityusa.com

 

[Goofyernmost]

Well then, technically speaking, you followed the kids around the park, for at least some of the day.

Small children in WDW are part of what makes it fun, IMO.

Then again, this past spring I happened to visit gorgeous park on a beautiful spring day. Part of what made it so special, IMO, was that it drew people of all ages, from all walks of life. The diversity of people all enjoying the same space is part of what made me appreciate the location. normally, I don't pay all that much attention to other people in public spaces, but all the smiles were infectious that day.

In that way, WDW still has a good deal of magic. Catching a stranger smiling and laughing, that's still great fun at WDW.

I assume you mean our own small children. This may sound awful, but my kids were important because they were family, however, from the moment I went under the "Welcome" sign in 1983 at age 35 I was there for me. I was fortunate that my kids loved it too, but even if they didn't, I would have gone anyway and did about 2/3rds of my trips there without them or anyone else. When we had the family together a big part of my enjoyment was that we could do just about everything together. Every experience was shared and discussed for years after. Sometimes it still comes up and both my kids are nearly 50 years old now.

It has never been the attractions or the show and definitely not the food that drew my back, it was that personal magic that happened to me internally. My inner child returned much more mature and world wise. I wasn't wide eyed or seeing only what I wanted to see. I saw the good, the bad and the ugly but none of that ever interfered with my inner feeling. I saw a lot more bad and ugly outside the gates then the few things that caught my attention inside them.

What killed the magic for me is the degree of difficulty just to visit a theme park. Actually more so than the cost, which is a factor as well. The reservations and the different varieties of Fast Pass. (including the original, although what is there now makes the original seem like heaven). We all must keep in mind is that many, many of the new guests were probably still infants or not even a gleam in anyone's eye back when many of us started going there, so they have nothing to compare it too which makes it still an awesome experience just probably not as long lasting as we older guests got to be.

 

[jaklgreen]

I assume you mean our own small children. This may sound awful, but my kids were important because they were family, however, from the moment I went under the "Welcome" sign in 1983 at age 35 I was there for me. I was fortunate that my kids loved it too, but even if they didn't, I would have gone anyway and did about 2/3rds of my trips there without them or anyone else. When we had the family together a big part of my enjoyment was that we could do just about everything together. Every experience was shared and discussed for years after. Sometimes it still comes up and both my kids are nearly 50 years old now.

It has never been the attractions or the show and definitely not the food that drew my back, it was that personal magic that happened to me internally. My inner child returned much more mature and world wise. I wasn't wide eyed or seeing only what I wanted to see. I saw the good, the bad and the ugly but none of that ever interfered with my inner feeling. I saw a lot more bad and ugly outside the gates then the few things that caught my attention inside them.

What killed the magic for me is the degree of difficulty just to visit a theme park. Actually more so than the cost, which is a factor as well. The reservations and the different varieties of Fast Pass. (including the original, although what is there now makes the original seem like heaven). We all must keep in mind is that many, many of the new guests were probably still infants or not even a gleam in anyone's eye back when many of us started going there, so they have nothing to compare it too which makes it still an awesome experience just probably not as long lasting as we older guests got to be.

I agree with you. I loved WDW long before I had kids, even long before I went the first time. I grew up with next door neighbors that started going when WDW was built. I was born in 1973 and heard from them how wonderful it was and they purchased my first Mickey ears. My parents never took us because dad thought that all vacations were a waste of money. So I went at 20 for the first time with a couple of friends. I loved watching my kids enjoy what I loved, but as they got older, I started to go on my own also, so that I could enjoy it for me. I also appreciated the simplicity of it. When they announce FP, it sounded like a good idea, but then you get there and the kiosks were always packed and you ended up getting a couple of return times for late in the day. It also increased the wait times of the standby line dramatically. Things started changing after that.
Same with the Dining plan, in theory it sounded good until a year or so in and they started to steam line the menus, especially the desserts. We used to be able to pick a rice crispy Mickey treat at the counter services plus they all had their own unique desserts. After the dining plan came out, they went to putting the same crappy prepackaged desserts in all of the quick service locations. I want the Disney pre dining plan and pre FP back.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Not saying there were no decent options anywhere, but I think you could certainly say the ratio of good to crappy food has changed drastically, making good food much easier to find.

The ratio of good to crappy food is always a matter of opinion and is always relative, is what I'm saying.

Just in the last year I have dined at the Boardwalk Deli twice. The first time our food was great: the pastrami was excellent, and I posted here that I thought the deli was great. (We also had a very good chicken sandwich.) The second time our pastrami sandwiches were very greasy and the worst meal of that visit.

I could say the same about most WDW dining locations over the past 50 years of visiting WDW.

I earlier said Cali Grill was great, but my experiences there have been rather variable over the years. Even if the food was the same every visit, when it comes to CG, the seating matters. Table by a window= fabulous view of MK. Table in the back part of the restaurant= no view. If you happen to get a perfect view of the fireworks, that alone makes the experience fabulous.

But the food and the staff are not uniform every visit, and they are part of the dining experience. A chef who oversalts= a bad meal. A short-staffed kitchen= slow food delivery (most recent visit to Topolino's)

Did you know the Boma buffet rotates between two menus. Mon-Wed-Fri is one menu. Tu/Thur is the other menu. (I'm not sure about weekend schedule). IMO, the Mon/Wed/Fri menu is much better.

Food inconsistency is an aspect of WDW that I find frustrating.

For people with food allergies, inconsistency is even worse. It can be life-threatening.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I assume you mean our own small children.

No, that isn't what I meant in the part you highlighted. I meant the casual observation of people having fun in WDW.

While staying at one of the WDW moderate hotels years ago, one morning I was awakened by two young children passing by on the walkway above my room. As they walked, in a sing-song voice they chanted, "We're going to Disney World! We're going to Disney World!" the sheer joy in their voice was infectious. It still makes me smile to think of it over 15 years later.

Part of the fun of WDW is that we are not alone when we visit. As much as we lament large crowds, when we go to MK, part of what we crave is to be in a popular destination with other people. It is a bit like seeing a stadium concert. Just being in the same space with 1,000's of people is a powerful experience.


Shared experience with family is also part of the fun though. I agree though, the more complicated it gets to tour WDW, the harder it is to tour WDW with extended family.

 

[Cajun]

I still enjoy the Magic, but very expensive. Couldn't ride any new attractions on my trip last month because of the large crowds. I keep hearing that people don't have any extra money these days. Hard to tell with so many people in the parks!

 

[Goofyernmost]

I always saw E

No, that isn't what I meant in the part you highlighted. I meant the casual observation of people having fun in WDW.

While staying at one of the WDW moderate hotels years ago, one morning I was awakened by two young children passing by on the walkway above my room. As they walked, in a sing-song voice they chanted, "We're going to Disney World! We're going to Disney World!" the sheer joy in their voice was infectious. It still makes me smile to think of it over 15 years later.

Part of the fun of WDW is that we are not alone when we visit. As much as we lament large crowds, when we go to MK, part of what we crave is to be in a popular destination with other people. It is a bit like seeing a stadium concert. Just being in the same space with 1,000's of people is a powerful experience.


Shared experience with family is also part of the fun though. I agree though, the more complicated it gets to tour WDW, the harder it is to tour WDW with extended family.

I agree that even though overwhelming crowds are a bit cumbersome, to me but small crowds are a bigger downer. I can't explain why, it just seem more alive the more people that are there. To many is also quite negative.

I didn't mean to make it sound like I don't like other peoples children, and many things like you mentioned are cute and nice memories. I guess I am just more self motivating. I do remember, on one of my solo trips, sitting on one of those concrete seats after riding Splash Mtn. I usually don't get to wet on that but this time I got a few more splashes that usual.

A young family with a little girl about, I'd say, 6 or 7 years old. Looked at me for a while and finally asked how my shirt got all wet. I told her that I just got off Splash Mtn., and then her parents joined in. I was probably in my early 60's at that time. They couldn't believe that I was riding a ride like that at my age and asked what other rides I was able to go on. My reply was all of them. I was traveling solo at that time and out of no where the little girl asked me if I had any grandchildren. She was either very perceptive for her age or I look a lot older than I thought I looked. I told her that I had a granddaughter about the same age that she was. I've had a few incidents like that where kids I don't even know have either come up and talked to me or in two cases I was sitting next to them, one in a theater and the other on a WDW bus, that fell asleep against my shoulder. It might be because of my white beard. They might think I'm Santa and don't want to seem unfriendly. It was all very innocent but today I'd probably be arrested. I liked those times better. The one in the theater had her parents concerned that it was bothering me. I assured them that back in the dark ages I raised two little girls and I miss that so she should just sleep. However, all that said, I usually don't really pay attention to others. I may people watch very intermittently but that is usually only because they cross in front of where I am looking.

 

[HauntedPirate]

I don't think any person, even the most hardcore pixie-duster, has ever suggested that you should only go to Walt Disney World for vacations and nowhere else.

"Excuse me, Captain? There's a Mister Iger and Miss Mucha on Line 3 for you."

No, its not sponsorship, it was blatant shilling of oil. Its different.

This is far different that Siemens sponsoring Spaceship Earth.

That Time Mickey Mouse and Goofy Shilled for Exxon at Disney World — Paleofuture

Back in 1985, Mickey Mouse and his old pal Goofy taught kids visiting Disney's EPCOT Center about the future of energy in America—with a little help from the good folks at Exxon. Some kids at the World's Fair-themed park received a complimentary comic book entitled Mic

paleofuture.com

Because everyone knows the BIGEVILOIL© companies only talk about crude oil and never about needing diverse sources of energy. And there were zero references to anything but crude oil in the Exxon-sponsored Universe of Energy, right? And the pavilion was only powered by fossil fuels and nothing renewable.

 

[DisneyHead123]

The ratio of good to crappy food is always a matter of opinion and is always relative, is what I'm saying.

My point was that I think Disney has better and more diverse food options now than they did in the 1980s. If you’re claiming that this isn’t the case and the quality / diversity of food options on offer now is different but on par with Disney in the 80s, we’ll just have to agree to disagree on that one. Absolutely no comparison in restaurants / snacks / festival food between the 1980s and today. In my opinion.

I’m not sure if that’s what you’re expressing, or if you’re saying food is better now but still gets the same “score” as it would have in the 80s when the “food offerings relative to the era” are considered. As in, food offerings in the average town were much more limited in the 80s so relatively speaking it makes sense that they would have been more limited at Disney too.

 

[flynnibus]

So my question, when does nostalgia outrank reality?

Pretty much the same as most of EPCOT FW... by about 1990 due to lack of updates. It's not to say the attractions couldn't be saved, but to point out the attractions are not drawing, you have to look at their current state too.

They were never going to be attractions like IASW that can run intact for decades - they relied heavily on content that had contemporary messaging and visuals... while society was moving faster than it ever had.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Because everyone knows the BIGEVILOIL© companies only talk about crude oil and never about needing diverse sources of energy. And there were zero references to anything but crude oil in the Exxon-sponsored Universe of Energy, right? And the pavilion was only powered by fossil fuels and nothing renewable.

I went to it and to me it was one big infomercial for Exxon. What made it worse it was around and during the time of Exxon Valdez ginormous oil spill in Alaska. So the mood wasn't exactly pro-Exxon. And about the fossil fuels, are you saying that those massive numbers of solar panels on that roof were fake?

I felt that the "Ellen" version was much more diverse and much more entertaining than the original. It was long, but it was also a way to rest ones tired feet and sit down for 40 minutes in the cool, cool indoors. It was a multi-tasker.