danyoung56
Well-Known Member
I agree - that would suck. I think calling a company out when needed is very important. I just wonder about someone who does only that.
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How is WDW not what it used to be?
- Thread starter JusticeDisney
- Start date
Why? Do you have special insight as to why he shouldn't?
DfromATX
Well-Known Member
It's the same on the cruising board that I also frequent. If anyone dares to go online and knock the cruise line or complain about their cruise, they better watch out. I get what you're saying. And honestly, I don't take personal offense that Pumba is angry at the demise of Disney - my own brother who I love very much is the same way lol. It's really ok. Disney (and cruising for that matter) are not for everyone. I was just curious as to why he would spend time on here if he didn't like it.
danyoung56
Well-Known Member
No, I have no special insight - only an opinion, just like everyone else.
scottnj1966
Well-Known Member
First off I do love Walt Disney World. I have been going since the 70's. I have watched so much change, for the good and bad.
Here is part of my list of things that have changed the park and Walt's dream
Alcohol served at the Magic Kingdom. This is not such a big deal but what this did was show the world that Walt's ideals have been pushed to the side for profits.
Maintenance of the parks!!! Everywhere you look there are light bulbs burned out, paint flaking, something loose, rides breaking down more frequently, garbage cans full, trash on the ground, and some things just plain dirty. These things never happened in the past.
When maintenance does get done it is fast and sloppy. I have seen some things repaired that just made me mad and I don't ever work there. Example 1: Picture fell off the wall in the Casey's sitting area. A few days later it was rehung upside down. Example 2: Light fixture at the Main Street train station was repaired with an extra long very bright and new bolt. If it was temporary but months later it is still there, throws off the 1890's feel.
Cast member attitudes. Of course this is a society problem which is getting into the parks but Disney was much better at controlling these things. It seems cast member on their cell phone and talking with other coworkers instead of interacting with guests are the priority to many of them these days. I am not saying it is a majority but I remember a time that you would never see anything like that.
Cost. Even if you factor in cost of living and inflation the price of Disney has almost tripled since it opened. And now they keep pushing high priced add-ons. The push of wanting more and more money from us really can ruin a trip to Disney.
The removal of the classic rides instead of building in a new location. This frustrates me two ways. One, losing rides that would benefit from a refit instead of replacing really upsets many, and two, Disney needs more rides and activities added to spread out the larger crowds. It is getting out of hand.
Having dinner at the parks. If you don't have a reservation they will not even try to get you in. I have on many occasions walked into a restaurant after they said they only are taking guests with reservations, only to find many many empty tables. This leads me into the next issue;
Management of the parks. What happened to it. Are the lawyers and accountants running the show? It sure seems like it. I could go on and on about things that have changed for the worse but it doesn't matter. Change is going to happen and much of it is to safe them a buck, any one remember all the topiaries? I remember the walkway to the Contemporary was full of them.
With all that said I still love going and enjoy some of the new stuff they have added or about to add. I just hope they don't lose what makes Disney, Disney!
Scott
Here is part of my list of things that have changed the park and Walt's dream
Alcohol served at the Magic Kingdom. This is not such a big deal but what this did was show the world that Walt's ideals have been pushed to the side for profits.
Maintenance of the parks!!! Everywhere you look there are light bulbs burned out, paint flaking, something loose, rides breaking down more frequently, garbage cans full, trash on the ground, and some things just plain dirty. These things never happened in the past.
When maintenance does get done it is fast and sloppy. I have seen some things repaired that just made me mad and I don't ever work there. Example 1: Picture fell off the wall in the Casey's sitting area. A few days later it was rehung upside down. Example 2: Light fixture at the Main Street train station was repaired with an extra long very bright and new bolt. If it was temporary but months later it is still there, throws off the 1890's feel.
Cast member attitudes. Of course this is a society problem which is getting into the parks but Disney was much better at controlling these things. It seems cast member on their cell phone and talking with other coworkers instead of interacting with guests are the priority to many of them these days. I am not saying it is a majority but I remember a time that you would never see anything like that.
Cost. Even if you factor in cost of living and inflation the price of Disney has almost tripled since it opened. And now they keep pushing high priced add-ons. The push of wanting more and more money from us really can ruin a trip to Disney.
The removal of the classic rides instead of building in a new location. This frustrates me two ways. One, losing rides that would benefit from a refit instead of replacing really upsets many, and two, Disney needs more rides and activities added to spread out the larger crowds. It is getting out of hand.
Having dinner at the parks. If you don't have a reservation they will not even try to get you in. I have on many occasions walked into a restaurant after they said they only are taking guests with reservations, only to find many many empty tables. This leads me into the next issue;
Management of the parks. What happened to it. Are the lawyers and accountants running the show? It sure seems like it. I could go on and on about things that have changed for the worse but it doesn't matter. Change is going to happen and much of it is to safe them a buck, any one remember all the topiaries? I remember the walkway to the Contemporary was full of them.
With all that said I still love going and enjoy some of the new stuff they have added or about to add. I just hope they don't lose what makes Disney, Disney!
Scott
As does he....
Brad Bishop
Well-Known Member
If what you're saying about maintenance (sloppy jobs) is common then that's going to be a mess that just keeps compounding itself each day. You have crappy/sloppy jobs done before that need to be fixed and then, on top of that, new jobs come in which will be done in a crappy/sloppy way. It won't take too long for all of that to seem insurmountable, especially when your average guest starts noticing and starts re-thinking future trips.
Also, what your describing is exactly what I saw at Six Flags back around 2000. The only difference is that WDW starts off more pristine and Six Flags never really did raise their prices all that much. A bottle of water or parking has been consistently more expensive than Disney but entry prices, I've thought, have been keep too low for quite some time.
Also, what your describing is exactly what I saw at Six Flags back around 2000. The only difference is that WDW starts off more pristine and Six Flags never really did raise their prices all that much. A bottle of water or parking has been consistently more expensive than Disney but entry prices, I've thought, have been keep too low for quite some time.
blueboxdoctor
Well-Known Member
I don't think it's drastically worse but they have let Future World in EPCOT really go down hill. Which is a shame, it could be really cool, they just don't seem to care about it at all, even though it's a rather large area everyone entering from the front has to walk through.
I'm also not a big fan of the new fast pass system, but it's really not a deal breaker at all for me.
Of course Hollywood Studios is a bit of a mess right now, but that's because it's in the midst of two big expansions projects so things are going to be interesting there over the next few years. However, they lied a bit which is annoying. They said they wanted to get rid of the hat in order to see all the way down the street to see the movie ride. Except now the hat is replaced by a very obnoxious dance party thing that pumps out the bass so loud it can be heard from almost anywhere in the park which also is a big slap in the face to those who want to eat outside at the Brown Derby.
Magic Kingdom I don't get the criticism for. I do prefer how the central area looked prior to the changes made to it the past year or two, but that's something I'll get used to soon enough (though, those extra little towers next to the castle, don't like those so much). Also not a fan of Starbucks taking over the bakery and replacing the good stuff with some lame Starbucks pastries and breads that aren't very good. But overall, I still am a big fan of MK.
Actually, still a big fan of WDW as a whole. Some issues that bother me (mainly Future World) but overall I remain very happy with WDW.
I'm also not a big fan of the new fast pass system, but it's really not a deal breaker at all for me.
Of course Hollywood Studios is a bit of a mess right now, but that's because it's in the midst of two big expansions projects so things are going to be interesting there over the next few years. However, they lied a bit which is annoying. They said they wanted to get rid of the hat in order to see all the way down the street to see the movie ride. Except now the hat is replaced by a very obnoxious dance party thing that pumps out the bass so loud it can be heard from almost anywhere in the park which also is a big slap in the face to those who want to eat outside at the Brown Derby.
Magic Kingdom I don't get the criticism for. I do prefer how the central area looked prior to the changes made to it the past year or two, but that's something I'll get used to soon enough (though, those extra little towers next to the castle, don't like those so much). Also not a fan of Starbucks taking over the bakery and replacing the good stuff with some lame Starbucks pastries and breads that aren't very good. But overall, I still am a big fan of MK.
Actually, still a big fan of WDW as a whole. Some issues that bother me (mainly Future World) but overall I remain very happy with WDW.
Chef Mickey
Well-Known Member
First of all, Disney has not done enough to expand and build truly great attractions in the Iger era. Let's just get that out there. However, I think there are reasons Disney has become lazy.
Disney has changed, but I think many consumers have changed versus 20 years ago. Many guests of today are impressed by things I find quite lazy, wasteful, and boring like interactive queues, celebrities, and tech all over the place.
The attractions of today have been more geared to interactivity, putting "you" in the action, interactive queues, celebrity/character tie ins, and weaving tech into the fabric of the attraction versus telling a great story. See Test Track 2.0 as an example.
It's hard for old favorites like Horizons, World of Motion, Universe of Energy, and even the old Spaceship Earth to be relevant to today's 30 second attention space guest dying to check their smartphone.
The smartphone and digital age have ruined peoples' appreciation for a great show. People can barely sit through the American Adventure or Hall of Presidents without checking their phones. I see it all the time.
I'll give a concrete example. Toy Story isn't a great ride, but people love it because they get to essentially play a video game with their party and compete on personalized scores. I admit, I like Toy Story too, but I'd rather ride the Great Movie Ride with its outdated movies because at least it was ambitious, detailed, and themed.
So I think it's a combination of terrible park management by Iger and a changing guest that allows for "passable" attractions or no new attractions versus GREAT shows and constant updates. If they put enough character tie in, celebrity tie in, tech, or an interactive queue, many will be happy enough with the result.
Disney has changed, but I think many consumers have changed versus 20 years ago. Many guests of today are impressed by things I find quite lazy, wasteful, and boring like interactive queues, celebrities, and tech all over the place.
The attractions of today have been more geared to interactivity, putting "you" in the action, interactive queues, celebrity/character tie ins, and weaving tech into the fabric of the attraction versus telling a great story. See Test Track 2.0 as an example.
It's hard for old favorites like Horizons, World of Motion, Universe of Energy, and even the old Spaceship Earth to be relevant to today's 30 second attention space guest dying to check their smartphone.
The smartphone and digital age have ruined peoples' appreciation for a great show. People can barely sit through the American Adventure or Hall of Presidents without checking their phones. I see it all the time.
I'll give a concrete example. Toy Story isn't a great ride, but people love it because they get to essentially play a video game with their party and compete on personalized scores. I admit, I like Toy Story too, but I'd rather ride the Great Movie Ride with its outdated movies because at least it was ambitious, detailed, and themed.
So I think it's a combination of terrible park management by Iger and a changing guest that allows for "passable" attractions or no new attractions versus GREAT shows and constant updates. If they put enough character tie in, celebrity tie in, tech, or an interactive queue, many will be happy enough with the result.
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Sonconato
Well-Known Member
Thank you for identifying my thoughts exactly. Of course I remember the topiaries! When I used to take the tram from TTC to MK I would always admire them and the guides telling us facts like how it took eight years for one of them to grow. Now the "topiaries" are steel wire structures with Spanish moss slapped on the side.
Pumbas Nakasak
Heading for the great escape.
I tend to pitch my posts based on the capability of the recipient. In this case I shot too high.
If my insults were not obvious enough for you Ill do better in future. But spare the victim card Im truly NFI.
Pumbas Nakasak
Heading for the great escape.
I know its an old extremist practice, but repeatedly posting a lie doesn't make it true, regardless of how desperate you are to justify your intolerance of anything other than a magical opinion.
I tend not to take my own posts too seriously, if that escapes folks I can only blame the schools.
TK Allison
New Member
Long-time lurker but I have to chime in. I'm old enough to remember when Disney had the ticket books and you were limited to just a few of the 'E Ticket' attractions. I much preferred when they went to a 'higher gate price but all inclusive' pass. It made sense and really allowed guests to spend their time and money on the rides and attractions that really interested them.
The change I most don't like is that despite that high ticket price, you feel nickel-and-dimed from the second you drive onto the property. What once felt all inclusive feels very "you haven't paid / you don't have the right pass / you don't belong" to me now. It's off-putting.
Otherwise I agree with many of the comments posted in this thread. I understand why Disney chooses to remove older attractions, though I wish they wouldn't do so. Not every guest is seven or 17 years old and hoping for a tech-filled immersive experience.. Back in the day I couldn't understand why my parents wanted to stroll down and pop into the attractions on Main Street. Now I find myself wanting to do it too. You need to appeal to all types of guests and all types of budgets.
The change I most don't like is that despite that high ticket price, you feel nickel-and-dimed from the second you drive onto the property. What once felt all inclusive feels very "you haven't paid / you don't have the right pass / you don't belong" to me now. It's off-putting.
Otherwise I agree with many of the comments posted in this thread. I understand why Disney chooses to remove older attractions, though I wish they wouldn't do so. Not every guest is seven or 17 years old and hoping for a tech-filled immersive experience.. Back in the day I couldn't understand why my parents wanted to stroll down and pop into the attractions on Main Street. Now I find myself wanting to do it too. You need to appeal to all types of guests and all types of budgets.
DisKid
Active Member
In 1981 we stayed at what was then called the Club Lake Villas and paid $85 per night. They were just like condos and were considered a deluxe at the time. They were located around the area that Saratoga Springs is now. If memory servers me correctly (and I am sure it doesn't) I believe the Contemporary and Poly were around $100- $120 per night. However, I realize this is before that commercial was aired.
DisKid
Active Member
As for how WDW is not like it used to be, a lot has already been said about upkeep and vacant buildings. How about merchandise? Remember when you were able to get park specific merchandise only in the park you were in? Or merchandise themed to a particular ride you were at? Like you still find at TOT and Pirates? There used to be a lot more of that.
How about QUALITY merchandise? Not the cheap plastic stuff they are pushing now. We have some quality sandstone beverage coasters from the Wilderness lodge we would love to get some more of. They actually have the Wilderness Lodge logo on them. Now you get plastic or bamboo coasters and no logo. Do you remember not to long ago you were also able to get resort specific refillable mugs? Each resort had their on mug with their on logo on it. Now it is the generic type mug available at any resort. These are the kind of changes that we have seen also. I could go on and on about the cheaper merchandise but I won't.
Sure we still go but we don't spend as much on souvenirs as we use to. We are sure glad the we were there in the 80's and 90's and even early 2000's and were able to get some quality souvenirs.
As for the parks, Epcot Future World is a shell of what it used to be. To many empty pavilions. Imaginations used to be a fun pavilion. Had a great second floor for the kids to use their imagination and do interactive activities. Adults had fun there also!
As for the Magic Kingdom, wow. Stitches great escape? Really? I did not like alien but even it was better. And how about Buzz Lightyear. Shooting at cardboard cutouts. Really? That would never have been used in the 80's.
And then came fastpass. Before it the lines for the rides would move along. Sure you might have a half hour wait but you did not see 1-2 hour wait times(except at Christmas!). Fastpass RUINED standby. It greatly increased the standby times.
We have seen so many changes to the world, some good but more not so good. Too many not so good to list here.
How about QUALITY merchandise? Not the cheap plastic stuff they are pushing now. We have some quality sandstone beverage coasters from the Wilderness lodge we would love to get some more of. They actually have the Wilderness Lodge logo on them. Now you get plastic or bamboo coasters and no logo. Do you remember not to long ago you were also able to get resort specific refillable mugs? Each resort had their on mug with their on logo on it. Now it is the generic type mug available at any resort. These are the kind of changes that we have seen also. I could go on and on about the cheaper merchandise but I won't.
Sure we still go but we don't spend as much on souvenirs as we use to. We are sure glad the we were there in the 80's and 90's and even early 2000's and were able to get some quality souvenirs.
As for the parks, Epcot Future World is a shell of what it used to be. To many empty pavilions. Imaginations used to be a fun pavilion. Had a great second floor for the kids to use their imagination and do interactive activities. Adults had fun there also!
As for the Magic Kingdom, wow. Stitches great escape? Really? I did not like alien but even it was better. And how about Buzz Lightyear. Shooting at cardboard cutouts. Really? That would never have been used in the 80's.
And then came fastpass. Before it the lines for the rides would move along. Sure you might have a half hour wait but you did not see 1-2 hour wait times(except at Christmas!). Fastpass RUINED standby. It greatly increased the standby times.
We have seen so many changes to the world, some good but more not so good. Too many not so good to list here.
Lou Filerman
Active Member
It mostly has to do with the fact that we live in a world now where people love to complain. The Internet has made the idiots more vocal and they are the loudest and seek the most attention because mommy didn't love them enough. Of course the parks are better now...Epcot was junk back in the day, it's better. Hollywood studios...ok, I'll give you that one. Walt would love AK and MK is much better than it ever was. Don't let the idiots convince you other wise
Matt_Black
Well-Known Member
Yeah, you just RODE past cardboard cut-outs, like in Mr. Toad's Wild Ride.
216bruce
Well-Known Member
Nah, they had a vision, a dream back then and used plywood. Maybe even 1/2 inch plywood.
