How can EPCOT be saved?

[DisneyDream2004]

My wife and I were talking last night about how EPCOT has evolved from a learning, educational park (with some thirlls) to a total thrill park anymore. I'd thought I'd ask everyone for their top five changes that would turn the tide at EPCOT and bring it back into it's glory.


5.) Add SPAIN
4.) Do something with Canada, like add a ride.
3.) What ever happened to the pavillion ideas? All the rides are wiping out the pavillions!!
2.) HORIZONS ressurection.
1.) Stop adding pure thrill rides.

Let me know what you think!

 

[bhg469]

you just said add a ride to canada and then said the pavillions are suffering because the rides. the world showcase hasnt gotten any smaller to the pavilions arent going anywhere

 

[WDWScottieBoy]

My wife and I were talking last night about how EPCOT has evolved from a learning, educational park (with some thirlls) to a total thrill park anymore. I'd thought I'd ask everyone for their top five changes that would turn the tide at EPCOT and bring it back into it's glory.

What about Epcot has really changed THAT much? Sure, they took out a pavillion and added Mission:Space. That's one ride. Yeah, they've got Test Track as well, but come on. The World Showcase hasn't changed much at all. It still has the same educational values that I remember growing up. The only things I've noticed is the addition of a few rides. There's nothing wrong with that IMO. Of course, there are a few missed pavillions, but do the rides pavillions that replaced them not do any glory for the park at all? Where do you suggest they build a new country (Spain in your opinion, I'd MUCH rather see Switzerland!)?

 

[DisneyDream2004]

I just think some of the rides, Misison Space and TT took out the old pavillions, and Soarin is doing the same thing with the Land. Now the Wonders of Life Pavillion is open seasonally?!?

As for Canada, I didn't say tear it down and build a super thrill ride. I meant enhance the pavillion. Nothing wrong with keeping the educational aspect of the area, the WS just needs a few more rides.

 

[webmomom]

As much as I love Epcot, I do think they need to do something with the different countries. Just a couple of little changes would be nice. Japan just updated their store and it is a nice change. More and different merchandise. I agree with you about the pavillions. I am not a thrill rider so these new rides do nothing for me.The pavillion rides were nice, no height restrictions,etc. and you could look into the future and/or use your own imagination. I use to love the smell of the orange field.

I definitely think they should do something with Canada. People just walk by and don't go and explore this country. Since they have a lot of kiosks outside I think people think this is the country. The first time I was to eat at LeCellier I could not find it. They need to make it more acessable to people.

When we use to go before, as we would be walking around, little surprises would happen. We have picture of different things walking around. The one I remember the best was people dressed up as some kind of future birds on stilts. I don't see that anymore.

I also agree on Spain. It was neat seeing that space being filled. We were there the year that Spain was there. We had gone after the F&W and they had stayed. they had light strung in the trees along the pathway and it was really nice at night.

As much as I hate saying this, but I feel the American pavillion really needs help. The show is good, the singers great but there store is the pits. They have nothing. A Couple of years ago they had outside American Craftsman with their works being sold and that was so nice. They relly had some nice merchandise. We were told it was a trial period and we were hoping it would stay, but of course it did not.

 

[Number_6]

you just said add a ride to canada and then said the pavillions are suffering because the rides. the world showcase hasnt gotten any smaller to the pavilions arent going anywhere

I think they mean that WoL is "seasonal" but I've been down when its busy and it still wasn't open. The Land is about to be raked through the coals with the addition of Soarin'. The changes made to Imagination were not for the better, either in the attraction itself or the post-show area. Each of those is considered a pavillion as well. World of Motion was a ride, but it taught you something much like SSE still does. Horizons looked to the future and the potential that exists. Test Track hasn't really taught me anything and Mission:Space is a simulator and not much more. Mind you, I like Mission:Space and Test Track, but it does kinda back off from the "learning environment." In that way, the idea of pavillions is suffering in Future World. World Showcase could use one or two new attractions to revitalize it as there are some people that will show up at Epcot just to do some rides and then leave. World Showcase gets alot of people late in the day because they want dinner or want to stake out an area to watch Illuminations. The bonus of a ride in Canada(there is talk of a log flume style ride there) would be to block the view of Soarin' which currently looms over Canada and looks out of place.

 

[nickcarraway]

Total thrill park? Um, you obviously haven’t been to a Six Flags lately. EPCOT is still definitely an educational experience. Yes, the landscape of EPCOT has changed but so has America. In Future World (which should totally be renamed to Discovery World), the idea of the pavilion is still there. But now, the ride is front and center. It’s not a space pavilion. It’s Mission: Space with some educational and fun stuff (as well as a gift shop) thrown in post-show. Same goes for Test Track. This is the future of EPCOT, if you will. And I don’t think much has changed in the World Showcase. But it should. The Cold War-era World Showcase is not our world anymore. Latin America and former Soviet countries are wholly absent. Spain? Sure. But it might be more representative if Brazil, Chile, or Argentina were present.

 

[Kadee]

I absolutely LOVE EPCOT! I love the rides AND the countries. I find it very educational and make sure my daughter learns something on every trip. I am a science teacher and have used Disney references in my teaching. Even the thrill rides are educational. I mean, how else would you know what it is like to blast off in a rocket? PERFECT attention getter to an astronomy unit. The ride on video would be great for a classroom. TestTrack has many aspects of education.....Physics...experiments (testing the cars), and why the curves are banked, etc.... I can not wait for Soarin'! Wonderful for Geography lessons! The countries are perfect for geography and/or history. TOO many educational opportunities to list them all. The Land and Living Seas are very good, too. Even in the other parks, you can learn something. You just have to want to learn and look for the opportunities.


....Never stop learning!!:wave:

 

[WDWScottieBoy]

Now the Wonders of Life Pavillion is open seasonally?!?

UPDATE! WoL hasn't been open for quite a while now. It's one of those "seasonal" things that goes down and sits there for a long time empty and doesn't open back up. I would hope this ISN'T the case, but I have a really good feeling that's how it's ending up so far.

 

[MickeyKimmy]

I have to agree with you DisneyDream. I remember how Epcot was those first times when I was there, and I have to say that there is a totally different atmosphere now. I remember the old days with Horizons and World of Motion and the original Imagination, and I must say that I do miss them. I think some of the posters above misunderstood you, but here is my take on it. Epcot is still primarily an educational park, but it is slowly being pulled in the wrong direction. The new attractions lately have been more of thrill rides than educational rides. I guess you can learn something from TT, but I have to say that all the times I have ridden it I have never learned anything. Anyway, I still love Epcot and always will, and I love thrill rides too - just not in Epcot. I guess I am just hoping that in the future all the great attractions, especially SSE, are not removed to replace it with something that Disney thinks will bring in more teenagers or lure people away from Universal.

 

[kevmagkingdom]

While Epcot may be shifting the focus a bit lately, it's not adding "pure thrill rides". Test Track, Mission Space are only two rides. TWO. So, calm down. Epcot is not changing the World Showcase, and never will (updates aside).

 

[General Grizz]

1. Change management. Don't even TOUCH SE until you get new management and better WDI/budget.
2. Revive "seasonal" or decaying attractions
3. TOTAL redo to Imagination. Bring in a QUALITY ride with the Dreamfinder.
4. Stop this cloning/changing Epcot for it. The Land needs to be saved.
5. Brand new post-shows to Mission Space and Test Track describing the ESSENCE of subject matter, quality presentations, and true ATTRACTIONS for families to enjoy.

That's a start. . . the D-Army will explain more soon.

 

[Lores]

Well, I agree with all of you in one way or another. First, yes, Epcot is loosing it's educational side. Ok, yes, M:S and TT... But let's be honest, the way cars are made is kilometers away from the history of transportation (like if SE was about how phones are made) it's funny and exciting, but far from educative. An S:E is a simulator, a new one, a modern one, a technolgy-wise one, but a simulator non the less. Was Horizons education? Maybe not, but there was a story in it. And that takes me to my point: story. If you take a closer look, new rides have no story at all: Soarin'... No story. TT... No story. M:S... No story. Emotions, thrills, moments, but that's it.

Now, speaking of World Showcase, I do believe some changes are needed. Mexico, for example, could look like a real mayan pyramid from the outside (it looks great for the 70's, but right now a more realistic image would be great), adn it's ride, "River of time" has some pretty outdated little movies, movies made in the sixties or seventies. Mexico is not like that at all right now.
I agree about Canada's changes, and more with the adition of "Soaring", now you cant take a picture of Canada without the gigantic structure behind.
And what about England and Morocco? They have no ride at all! No movie, no ride, no simulator. Nothing, just shops and restaurants. A little something could be added.

I'm from Spain, and still I would love to see some other country built there instead. Someone said Switzerland, I may go with that. Or Russia, no northern asiatic Country has been built. One for each continent al last.

North America = US, Canada
South America = Mexico
Europe = Italy, France, England, Norway
Africa = Morocco
Eastern Asia = China, Japan
Western Asia = ??

That's my two cents.

 

[Main Street USA]

1. Revitalize the "Pavillion" concept, rather than making new "rides." The pavillions are what made E.P.C.O.T. unique.

2. Rebuild World of Motion EXACTLY as it was.

3. Rebuild Horizons EXACTLY as it was.

4. Rebuild Journey Into Imagination EXACTLY as it first was.

he he, who likes those ideas? lol

Seriously, though, some good ideas above in this thread for sure, especially from Grizz. The destruction of the three pavillions I mentioned, though, has to be up there on the list of the WDW management's LARGEST GOOFS.

 

[Lexxweb]

Im busy booking my WDW vacation right as I am typing this so forgive me if I post something someone has already posted. I didn't have time to read every post in this thread!

I think adding the country EGYPT and having tombs and some cool slow moving egyptian spook ride (nothing like Mummy over at universal) But like have one of the attractions be in a actual tomb and another tomb be a restaurnt and gift shop.

And the ride as mentioned above would have to be slow moving somewhat dark ride through a tomb!

 

[Testtrack321]

1. Revitalize the "Pavillion" concept, rather than making new "rides." The pavillions are what made E.P.C.O.T. unique.

2. Rebuild World of Motion EXACTLY as it was.

3. Rebuild Horizons EXACTLY as it was.

4. Rebuild Journey Into Imagination EXACTLY as it first was.

he he, who likes those ideas? lol

Seriously, though, some good ideas above in this thread for sure, especially from Grizz. The destruction of the three pavillions I mentioned, though, has to be up there on the list of the WDW management's LARGEST GOOFS.

OH yeah, three biggest goofs, all those people who helped raise Epcot's attendance, and those long 2 hour long lines at Test Track are just goofs.

 

[Main Street USA]

OH yeah, three biggest goofs, all those people who helped raise Epcot's attendance, and those long 2 hour long lines at Test Track are just goofs.

Atta way to look at ONE side of my point! Next time walk all the way around it before you decide to post.

1. Let's look at YOUR side, i.e. the side you choose to pick at. You couldn't be more right...TT has long lines, and is amazingly popular, and let's throw M:S into the mix there, because it too, has been successful as far as attendance goes.

2. Now let's look at side 2, the side you so quickly and efficiently choose to ignore. These 3 GOOFS, yes GOOFS, are exactly that. If you're trying to tell me that keeping these attractions means that EPCOT would be in the toilet right now you're sadly mistaken (no matter how much you like Test Track, Testtrack321). The other thing you missed in your attempt to mock my post, is the fact that I never once said that TT and M:S wouldn't have been great ADDITIONS.

As an entire PAVILLION, World of Motion, Horizons, and the original JII blow Mission: Space and Test Track out of the water. That's not an opinion, that's a fact. Why? Because M:S and TT aren't pavillions, they're rides.


Now, before you fire back without looking at both sides again, let me make the side you WANT to hear abundantly clear. I love Test Track. I never miss it. I think it's STILL one of the most unique rides in the world, AND one of the most technologically advanced, if not THE most. I also enjoy Mission: Space, again, because it's unique. It doesn't exactly have the repeat quality that the others do, but it's still fun.

So, there, I love all of the current attractions. But they didn't warrant tearing out two amazing pavillions to build. The only one that is still in the crapper is JII. They ruined that. Plain and simple.

 

[General Grizz]

I love Test Track. I never miss it. I think it's STILL one of the most unique rides in the world, AND one of the most technologically advanced, if not THE most. I also enjoy Mission: Space, again, because it's unique. It doesn't exactly have the repeat quality that the others do, but it's still fun.

So, there, I love all of the current attractions. But they didn't warrant tearing out two amazing pavillions to build. The only one that is still in the crapper is JII. They ruined that. Plain and simple.

I love this viewpoint. Pavilion versus ride is a major concept. . . which will soon affect the Wonders of Life pavilion and possibly the Land. What we need is investment, high budget, and care. And you're right - whole pavilions. (This is why I praised the original M:S plans in another thread).

Remember how the Transcenter was the most photographed location in ALL of Walt Disney World? And then there's the Image Works. . .

 

[Main Street USA]

Oh man, the Image Works.......ugh.......I feel sick.

 

[Testtrack321]

Atta way to look at ONE side of my point! Next time walk all the way around it before you decide to post.

1. Let's look at YOUR side, i.e. the side you choose to pick at. You couldn't be more right...TT has long lines, and is amazingly popular, and let's throw M:S into the mix there, because it too, has been successful as far as attendance goes.

2. Now let's look at side 2, the side you so quickly and efficiently choose to ignore. These 3 GOOFS, yes GOOFS, are exactly that. If you're trying to tell me that keeping these attractions means that EPCOT would be in the toilet right now you're sadly mistaken (no matter how much you like Test Track, Testtrack321). The other thing you missed in your attempt to mock my post, is the fact that I never once said that TT and M:S wouldn't have been great ADDITIONS.

As an entire PAVILLION, World of Motion, Horizons, and the original JII blow Mission: Space and Test Track out of the water. That's not an opinion, that's a fact. Why? Because M:S and TT aren't pavillions, they're rides.


Now, before you fire back without looking at both sides again, let me make the side you WANT to hear abundantly clear. I love Test Track. I never miss it. I think it's STILL one of the most unique rides in the world, AND one of the most technologically advanced, if not THE most. I also enjoy Mission: Space, again, because it's unique. It doesn't exactly have the repeat quality that the others do, but it's still fun.

So, there, I love all of the current attractions. But they didn't warrant tearing out two amazing pavillions to build. The only one that is still in the crapper is JII. They ruined that. Plain and simple.

I belive Epcot would be stupid to not replace an aging ride like WoM, JII, or Horizons. These rides were built with sponsors money in mind. They were expensive to run and staff. Disney was willing to go the extra mile for these pavilions because they got money from sponsors. But then they pulled out, or cut back funding. They were great rides. I agree, but explain how it's a goof to get rid of those pavilions if the new ones are making money, the public loves them, and they offer a unique ride and learning experence? Horizons wasn't even a pavilion in your sense of the word. GM wanted a new thrill ride for their attraction and didn't want to spend more money than they did with WoM. Should we blame Disney for not adding a huge post-show? GE pulled out of Horizons and Disney just couldn't staff the ride for much longer and keep it running. Look at the attractions at MK and Epcot. Notice a difference? When Disney pays for the rides, they are smaller and shorter. Even a great ride like Splash Mountain has lots of segments with no AAs. But Horizons had them from start to finish BECAUSE THEY HAD MONEY NOT ONLY COMMING FROM TICKET SALES BUT FROM CORPORATIONS. It boggles my imagination why people fail to realize that Disney's hands are tied many times by what the sponsors want.