Guardians of the Galaxy coming to Energy Pavilion at Epcot

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Suspirian

Suspirian

Well-Known Member
So are we expecting this GOTG attraction to have any connection to the Energy pavilion or some other science related topic Like Nemo and Friends? Or will it just be a random GOTG land in the middle of future world?
 
Mike S

Mike S

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
I agree with this and feel the same way. It's a double standard and we hold Disney to a higher standard. Disney and Universal were somewhat unique in their style and their execution. Universal had more speed, action, excitement and screens. Disney relied on a slower pace, elaborate storytelling and a religious dedication to theme including elaborate queues and show buildings. I loved having both be different and never understood why people wanted one or the other to change or conform. Why people complain that Universal is too screen based or Disney needs more thrills. I fear some of the recent moves by Disney are actually attempts to "compete" with Universal in what a lot of fanboys wanted, the "theme park war". As I said in an earlier post, be careful what you wish for. Disney may be taking a page from Universal's play book and going IP based rides to pump up attendance.

Disney had 4 somewhat unique parks in FL: a MK park, a studio park, a zoo/park combo and EPCOT. The MK was most popular by far. The complaint from a lot of fans has always been that AK and DHS were half day parks because they lacked a volume of "rides". I never felt AK was a half day park, but if you just wanted to ride the headliners and skip the animals I could see why people thought that. Same with DHS (the version of DHS before it became a construction zone). A lot of people were bored with the studio tour and the shows and just went, did the headliners and left. EPCOT thrived because of the popularity of the countries in the evening and several headliner attractions. The common theme is that a lot of people these days just want a volume of rides. They don't really care for shows or animal exhibits (why do you think Sea World keeps adding coasters instead of more animals) People aren't as interested in elaborate theming or intricate details (see the criticism of FLE), they don't want to invest the time in exploring areas of a park like TSI or the trails in AK. They want instant gratification. a selfie to post on Instagram and a ride that takes 5 mins or less so they can get back on their phones and tweet or post about it.

It does seem that some of the uniqueness of each park is being lost with each addition, but the truth is that the majority probably prefer it that way. They'd rather have an AK with 12 rides and no character or soul than what we currently have. They'd rather have DHS without the studio part and with a fleshed out Star Wars and Pixar Land. They would prefer IP based attractions at EPCOT over slow moving, time consuming, educational rides. Disney seems to be pushing its 3 other WDW parks to be more like MK and more like IOA. I don't like it, but I don't think they care, I'm just 1 voice. A lot of other people do like it.
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Great response. I do think the new direction for DHS is the right one though except TSL should've been Pixar Place but that's besides the point. AK should have more additions after Avatar to balance it out better for more people but never at the cost of the live animals. The next projects should be Australia/South America and New DinoLand. Ipcot I believe is a lost cause at this point sadly but DHS and AK could still have their own feel.
 
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tirian

tirian

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
I agree with this and feel the same way. It's a double standard and we hold Disney to a higher standard. Disney and Universal were somewhat unique in their style and their execution. Universal had more speed, action, excitement and screens. Disney relied on a slower pace, elaborate storytelling and a religious dedication to theme including elaborate queues and show buildings. I loved having both be different and never understood why people wanted one or the other to change or conform. Why people complain that Universal is too screen based or Disney needs more thrills. I fear some of the recent moves by Disney are actually attempts to "compete" with Universal in what a lot of fanboys wanted, the "theme park war". As I said in an earlier post, be careful what you wish for. Disney may be taking a page from Universal's play book and going IP based rides to pump up attendance.

Disney had 4 somewhat unique parks in FL: a MK park, a studio park, a zoo/park combo and EPCOT. The MK was most popular by far. The complaint from a lot of fans has always been that AK and DHS were half day parks because they lacked a volume of "rides". I never felt AK was a half day park, but if you just wanted to ride the headliners and skip the animals I could see why people thought that. Same with DHS (the version of DHS before it became a construction zone). A lot of people were bored with the studio tour and the shows and just went, did the headliners and left. EPCOT thrived because of the popularity of the countries in the evening and several headliner attractions. The common theme is that a lot of people these days just want a volume of rides. They don't really care for shows or animal exhibits (why do you think Sea World keeps adding coasters instead of more animals) People aren't as interested in elaborate theming or intricate details (see the criticism of FLE), they don't want to invest the time in exploring areas of a park like TSI or the trails in AK. They want instant gratification. a selfie to post on Instagram and a ride that takes 5 mins or less so they can get back on their phones and tweet or post about it.

It does seem that some of the uniqueness of each park is being lost with each addition, but the truth is that the majority probably prefer it that way. They'd rather have an AK with 12 rides and no character or soul than what we currently have. They'd rather have DHS without the studio part and with a fleshed out Star Wars and Pixar Land. They would prefer IP based attractions at EPCOT over slow moving, time consuming, educational rides. Disney seems to be pushing its 3 other WDW parks to be more like MK and more like IOA. I don't like it, but I don't think they care, I'm just 1 voice. A lot of other people do like it.
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You make a lot of good points, yet I'm not sure how many people really do like the proliferation of IPs. WDW has been around long enough that people know what to expect at the four parks.

Having worked in Celebration for years, I would argue the MK is popular because it (a) has the most attractions and (b) is, of course, the castle park. Space, BTMRR, HM, and JC "pack 'em in" without requiring movie-based IPs. POTC never needed a movie connection. Iger relies on IPs because he's lazy.

If anything, there's more complaining about mediocrity, cutbacks, and a lack of innovative attractions than about the number of IPs. For example, the new Frozen ride is crowded but the M&G is often empty. Frozen is Disney's most popular animated franchise in over a decade, but it looks like more Guests are obsessed with a new attraction [starring Frozen!] than the IP itself.
 
A

ANJ

Active Member
WOW, I just cant keep up with this thread. SO after thinking about this tragedy I come to the conclusion that Iger and company are really missing the mark here. I couldn't agree more with @tirian and @GoofGoof . But in the big picture the summation of these additions are going to be what will eventually hurt WDW. Yes, Iger is giving the rubes what they want. More IP packed attractions. But they are also pricing out the lower and middle class families. The whales expect quality, value. That's why they buy a Mercedes. If a Mercedes all of the sudden becomes a piece of junk they will no longer buy it. Same with the parks. The reason why WDW became the most popular vacation destination on the planet was because of quality and value, not IP's. I contend that even Mickey Mouse himself wasn't the draw. It was the incredible accommodations, impeccable service and maintenance. Hospitality at its finest. People didn't mind paying. Once those things are gone So will the discerning guest. The best thing a business can acquire is a loyal fan base, you lost that and the erosion begins to set in. Is this where Disney and WDW are now? IMO yes! You may have not liked Eisner but he didn't kill the loyal fan base like Iger is doing. I believe Eisner just made some mistakes. Costly? yes but Iger in his infinite wisdom is literally crushing all the that building of customer loyalty that started with Walt. His legacy? A theme park half way around the world that most Americans will never see. Great Bob, just great! Ok so you say its all about the share holders? Being one of them myself I hardly believe that Shanghai will do little to effect the share.
 
GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
tirian said:
You make a lot of good points, yet I'm not sure how many people really do like the proliferation of IPs. WDW has been around long enough that people know what to expect at the four parks.

Having worked in Celebration for years, I would argue the MK is popular because it (a) has the most attractions and (b) is, of course, the castle park. Space, BTMRR, HM, and JC "pack 'em in" without requiring movie-based IPs. POTC never needed a movie connection. Iger relies on IPs because he's lazy.

If anything, there's more complaining about mediocrity, cutbacks, and a lack of innovative attractions than about the number of IPs. For example, the new Frozen ride is crowded but the M&G is often empty. Frozen is Disney's most popular animated franchise in over a decade, but it looks like more Guests are obsessed with a new attraction [starring Frozen!] than the IP itself.
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I do agree that there are plenty of other complaints and its lazy on Disney's part to go the IP route. It's just much easier in the short run to market and tends to draw more of a crowd. Take Avatar as an example. They are likely to draw more people to an Avatar Land than they would if they built the same 2 rides but used a generic dragon for the flying ride and just had a boat ride through a land of "mythical" beasts. Basically beastly kingdom. To the general public it is easier to relate to going to Pandora from the Avatar movie. Where I do think the IP route is short sighted is that they don't have the staying power of rides like HM or PoTC which were based on original concepts. How long before the IPs grow stale? The rides based on Classic Disney cartoons are safe but the others... Universal has already had to turn over a number of attractions based on dated IPs and replace them. At Disney you can't close anything down without an online protest petition and fanboy backlash.

Your point on the Frozen thing is interesting. I know I am looking forward to checking out the ride but wouldn't wait in line for the meet and greet. I thought that the meet and greet at MK was pretty popular before it moved to EPCOT with really long waits. I wonder if the ride isn't drawing as many young kids (girls) as they thought it might. Half the reason for adding the ride was supposed to be to draw more people with kids away from MK.
 
GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Mike S said:
Great response. I do think the new direction for DHS is the right one though except TSL should've been Pixar Place but that's besides the point. AK should have more additions after Avatar to balance it out better for more people but never at the cost of the live animals. The next projects should be Austrailia/South America and New DinoLand. Ipcot I believe is a lost cause at this point sadly but DHS and AK could still have their own feel.
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Agreed on DHS. Once it was no longer used as a studio the theme kinda fell apart. It was pretty good when they had the operating studio tour and it was a lot different than going to MK or EPCOT. They were 3 very different experiences. I'm looking forward to SW Land but I do worry about how they will tie in all the various sections of the park or if they will even try that hard. It could just be an IOA style mish mash of random lands based on unrelated IPs.

I do think AK needs another major attraction. I just hope or want it to be animal based. Real, not fictional animals. I'm OK with Avatar there but that's where I draw the line. Did anyone at Disney actually see the Jungle Book? If that's not a slam dunk IP for a true E-ticket dark ride I don't know what is:). Get it done and don't skimp...if not a traditional dark ride than go with a boat ride with the big boats and a giant drop or even a Splash style flume ride. It gets damn hot at AK it would be nice to have another way to get wet.

I still think the million dollar question that a number of us have asked is will this GoTG thing be just a randomly placed attraction based on that IP in EPCOT or will it be GoTG replacing Ellen and Bill Nye in teaching us about energy or something similar that still fits in the overall theme? I know it's not popular to say around these parts but I was OK with Nemo at the Seas and Donald Duck in Mexico. In both cases they were characters used to introduce or highlight the subject matter but the point and overall quality of the attractions didn't change. I think the rat ride could work in France too the same way since it would be based on a French restaurant. Still not sure the same can be said about Frozen Norway, but the ride looks pretty good. If they just add random IP based rides to EPCOT with no attempt at a coherent theme then that's a real problem for me.
 
seabreezept813

seabreezept813

Well-Known Member
Phil12 said:
I was pointing out that Disney deals in illusion, not reality. There's nothing wrong in dealing in illusion but when people confuse illusion with reality, we have a problem.

I'm sure a lot of people that visited UoE were also under the impression that that the solar array on top of the building provided a substantial amount of power for the vehicles in the pavilion and/or was cost effective. Neither was true then or now. It's not that it couldn't be done. The point is that it wouldn't be at all cost effective and would be an example of poor energy management and wasteful to boot.

It's not to say that photo voltaic arrays are not useful. They are very important for off-grid applications in remote areas on earth and in outer space. And they can be used for emergency power when the grid goes off line for traffic lights and other essential power needs.

I can't help but wonder how many people were left with the impression that the energy needs of the UoE were supplied in large part by that solar array. And also, after seeing the Astuter Computer Review and Backstage Magic, how many people came away with the impression that WDW had a huge central computer complex that ran everything in the resort?

Those concepts tend to indelibly stick in the minds of some people. They come away from WDW with the idea that Disney is somehow able to defy or change the laws of physics and logic.

Blurring fantasy and reality can lead some people to believe that 20K was a worthwhile attraction.
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From the reading that I have done, most guidebooks were clear that those panels only provided a limited amount of the energy needed for the ride. So I am not convinced that Disney intentionally warps our sense of reality per say. People who read/research the attractions or parks would have access to that information and a casual guest might not even pick up on the use at all. But that is just my experience.
 
TinkerBelle8878

TinkerBelle8878

Well-Known Member
asianway said:
The way it was explained to me, Ron Schneider did not do the character very long and the primary Dreamfinder we all know is Steve Taylor. @TinkerBelle8878 can you help on this?
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I think you might have me confused with another user with a similar name. As much as I adore Figment and Dreamfinder, I only am really familiar with the original ride and never had the chance to see any Dreamfinder other than the AA. :)
 
Obi Walt Kenobi

Obi Walt Kenobi

Well-Known Member
What a fast growing thread and what a great debate! I'll leave it up to wiser folks than I to decide the merit of weather or not GOTG belongs in EPCOT. But I am a big fan of GOTG and I think I am excited and I think I want to experience this. I am also curious to know if there are any details about what kind of attraction this is going to be. Or even opinions on what it might be. Anyway thanks for your insight and catching me up on any details I missed.
 
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