For the dudes sitting as a lady stands...

Swissmiss

Swissmiss

Premium Member
@Osh Popham - you'll be happy to learn there were two gentlemen on the bus I took home from work this evening. One offered his seat to me (I smiled and politely declined because I don't stay very long on that particular bus and was in a place where short little me was nevertheless tall enough to hold onto something - which is not always the case depending on the bus model). The other offered his seat to a young woman, but she too politely declined.

My DD, who will soon be 12, has already started giving up her seat to the elderly (both men and women) before I can even react.

And for the record: although I certainly appreciate the gesture of a man offering his seat, I do not expect it. As a PP said, a little bit of courtesy just makes the world nicer.
 
Rob562

Rob562

Well-Known Member
Osh Popham said:
If you are sitting on the monorail, bus, boat, etc. and a woman, child or another dude holding his sleeping child gets on and has to stand as you sit, you may want to take a long, hard look in the mirror.

Society will never "evolve" to the point at which offering your seat to these folks will not be the right thing.

Saying so may make me unpopular but if anyone takes this to heart, well worth me saying so. It really does feel good to be a gentleman.
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I agree with everything you're saying except the fact that you're offering your seat to a woman strictly on the grounds that she's a woman.

I'm a healthy 40 year old male and I will gladly give up my seat for someone who truly needs it: the elderly, a parent with a young child, someone who has an obvious need like a cast, cane or crutches (or if I saw them before we got on the bus and they obviously weren't moving as if they were totally healthy). Beyond that I feel that "first come, first served" is the rule of the day, and the only way to make a system like that fair to all. And that includes children above the age of 10 or so.

I realize that I'm a man, but to suggest that a woman "needs" the seat simply because she's a woman to me comes across as a bit demeaning to the woman. It's like she's being told that she's "not strong enough" to survive first-come-first-served and that she needs the help of a man to survive. If you want a seat and the bus is almost full, wait for the next bus.

I will leave you with a situation to ponder:
Let's say you have a large group of people that'll fill a bus completely (sitting and standing), evenly divided between male and female. There is no one under the age of 18, no one is elderly or injured, everyone is in perfect health. Who do you feel should get a seat and who should stand?

-Rob
 
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Minthorne

Minthorne

Well-Known Member
Rob562 said:
I will leave you with a situation to ponder:
Let's say you have a large group of people that'll fill a bus completely (sitting and standing), evenly divided between male and female. There is no one under the age of 18, no one is elderly or injured, everyone is in perfect health. Who do you feel should get a seat and who should stand?
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Whoever bought the Bus+ enhanced experience! :happy:
 
CaptainAmerica

CaptainAmerica

Premium Member
Rob562 said:
Let's say you have a large group of people that'll fill a bus completely (sitting and standing), evenly divided between male and female. There is no one under the age of 18, no one is elderly or injured, everyone is in perfect health. Who do you feel should get a seat and who should stand?
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The men should offer seats to the women. If any of the women decline, that's fine too. It's not a matter of women being incapable of standing, it's a matter of anthropology rooted in history and biology. Men and women are different, no matter what the post-feminists would have you believe. One is not "better" and the other "worse," but they are different nonetheless.

Feminism used to argue that men and women are equal, which is something I wholeheartedly endorse. Fairly recently, the argument shifted to "men and women are the same," which is simply not true. Equality and sameness are different.
 
RustySpork

RustySpork

Oscar Mayer Memer
Rob562 said:
I agree with everything you're saying except the fact that you're offering your seat to a woman strictly on the grounds that she's a woman.

I'm a healthy 40 year old male and I will gladly give up my seat for someone who truly needs it: the elderly, a parent with a young child, someone who has an obvious need like a cast, cane or crutches (or if I saw them before we got on the bus and they obviously weren't moving as if they were totally healthy). Beyond that I feel that "first come, first served" is the rule of the day, and the only way to make a system like that fair to all. And that includes children above the age of 10 or so.

I realize that I'm a man, but to suggest that a woman "needs" the seat simply because she's a woman to me comes across as a bit demeaning to the woman. It's like she's being told that she's "not strong enough" to survive first-come-first-served and that she needs the help of a man to survive. If you want a seat and the bus is almost full, wait for the next bus.

I will leave you with a situation to ponder:
Let's say you have a large group of people that'll fill a bus completely (sitting and standing), evenly divided between male and female. There is no one under the age of 18, no one is elderly or injured, everyone is in perfect health. Who do you feel should get a seat and who should stand?

-Rob
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Capitalism dictates that it would also be socially acceptable to sell your seated position for a non-seated position plus some amount of money. Simple supply and demand economics can help with pricing. Obviously the higher the need the higher the cost.
 
RustySpork

RustySpork

Oscar Mayer Memer
CaptainAmerica said:
The men should offer seats to the women. If any of the women decline, that's fine too. It's not a matter of women being incapable of standing, it's a matter of anthropology rooted in history and biology. Men and women are different, no matter what the post-feminists would have you believe. One is not "better" and the other "worse," but they are different nonetheless.

Feminism used to argue that men and women are equal, which is something I wholeheartedly endorse. Fairly recently, the argument shifted to "men and women are the same," which is simply not true. Equality and sameness are different.
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Yikes.
 
Osh Popham

Osh Popham

Active Member
Original Poster
Rob562 said:
I agree with everything you're saying except the fact that you're offering your seat to a woman strictly on the grounds that she's a woman.

I'm a healthy 40 year old male and I will gladly give up my seat for someone who truly needs it: the elderly, a parent with a young child, someone who has an obvious need like a cast, cane or crutches (or if I saw them before we got on the bus and they obviously weren't moving as if they were totally healthy). Beyond that I feel that "first come, first served" is the rule of the day, and the only way to make a system like that fair to all. And that includes children above the age of 10 or so.

I realize that I'm a man, but to suggest that a woman "needs" the seat simply because she's a woman to me comes across as a bit demeaning to the woman. It's like she's being told that she's "not strong enough" to survive first-come-first-served and that she needs the help of a man to survive. If you want a seat and the bus is almost full, wait for the next bus.

I will leave you with a situation to ponder:
Let's say you have a large group of people that'll fill a bus completely (sitting and standing), evenly divided between male and female. There is no one under the age of 18, no one is elderly or injured, everyone is in perfect health. Who do you feel should get a seat and who should stand?

-Rob
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Thank you for the scenario. IMO all of the women would be offered up the seats available. I don't say this to assert we are not equals as I could not disagree with that statement enough.

I look to honor women and the elderly, respect children as that is a 2 way street, and offer compassion to those who could use the seat more than myself. I realize it's an archaic belief system and I offer it only as a counterpoint.
 
njDizFan

njDizFan

Well-Known Member
CaptainAmerica said:
The men should offer seats to the women. If any of the women decline, that's fine too. It's not a matter of women being incapable of standing, it's a matter of anthropology rooted in history and biology. Men and women are different, no matter what the post-feminists would have you believe. One is not "better" and the other "worse," but they are different nonetheless.

Feminism used to argue that men and women are equal, which is something I wholeheartedly endorse. Fairly recently, the argument shifted to "men and women are the same," which is simply not true. Equality and sameness are different.
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Hold on, what's a matter of anthropology? Are you saying that since it's the way it's always been then it must stay unchanged? As far as comparing this as apple to apples comparison with picking your nose, that I would say is quite hyperbolic.

And you are also ascribing a social mores to a be a generic inherent ideal that should cross all cultures and societies. For many people in the West this may be a common practice but hardly enigmatic of every situation. Take any subway during rush hour in NYC for example.

But of course I would get up for anyone less able bodied then myself. Although after 12 hours in the parks my old age and Sciatic puts me somewhere between a cranky 2 year old and a arthritic octogenarian.
 
Swissmiss

Swissmiss

Premium Member
I am a short woman - just under 5'2" - unless the bus has handle holds on the back of the aisle seats, or vertical bars from floor to ceiling, there is no way for me to safely hold on to straps hanging down from the ceiling of the bus, as I cannot reach them without having to be up on my toes - which makes it difficult (and hazardous) to stand on a moving bus. Again, as I do not expect to be given a seat, I will let a crowded bus go by and wait for the next one if I don't think I can position myself in one of the areas where I can safely stand. But if someone more "in need" than I comes on the bus - the elderly, pregnant woman - I will give up my seat because I figure my 50 year old bones can take a fall better than someone older or someone pregnant.
 
RustySpork

RustySpork

Oscar Mayer Memer
Osh Popham said:
Thank you for the scenario. IMO all of the women would be offered up the seats available. I don't say this to assert we are not equals as I could not disagree with that statement enough.

I look to honor women and the elderly, respect children as that is a 2 way street, and offer compassion to those who could use the seat more than myself. I realize it's an archaic belief system and I offer it only as a counterpoint.
Click to expand...

If you're giving up your seat for someone else, you are not treating that person equally. The only thing you're doing is making you feel good about an action you are taking without considering the affect it will have on that person.
 

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