FLIK Cards going away

[t3techcom18]

All I'm gunna say is this:

This is something that's been talked about, that they were going to turn it on, for two years or so now. The infrastructure has been there for a while (the wait times via the MagicBands are reported on the Merge consoles, while the posted FLIK wait time is on the FP console), but it hasn't been turned on.

Likewise, the reporting from the MagicBands have always been erratic and, even if just one isn't working correctly, it throws everything off, leading to extremely skewed readings (ie, a wait time that's 40, yet the system says it's 10). FLIK's were always troublesome, but it was pretty much foolproof.

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Nick Pappagiorgio]

Wonder how this works when they extend the lines past their usual entrances. Hopefully they tested this method in conjunction with the cards to verify it's at least as accurate

Was this "line length" ever included before? If I recall correctly, they usually touch the red card on something near the start of the line to register the start time. I have never seen them do this, and then run a card out to someone at the end of the line.

 

[Delgado]

Wonder how this works when they extend the lines past their usual entrances. Hopefully they tested this method in conjunction with the cards to verify it's at least as accurate

I was wondering the same thing. Yesterday the sign said 20 min for teacups...the line was down the walkway outside. I heard someone ask and the cast member said it is 20 minutes from under the entrance sign. And yes I waited slightly longer than 20 minutes but not more than 30. I can't remember the exact time, 26 or 27.

 

[anchorman314]

The thing with measuring wait times via the FLIK cards is that they are never truly accurate. If a card took 30 minutes to go from start scan to end scan, and the posted wait time is set to 30 minutes because of that, that may not be the current wait time. That was the wait time 30 minutes ago. A sudden influx of people right after the card was scanned in could make the wait be 45 minutes, just as a lack of new line entrants could make the wait time be closer to 15 minutes.

Now if they're going to use MagicBands to do a more frequent time tracking, (say every 5-10 guests) the resulting data would be inherently more accurate.

 

[flynnibus]

The thing with measuring wait times via the FLIK cards is that they are never truly accurate. If a card took 30 minutes to go from start scan to end scan, and the posted wait time is set to 30 minutes because of that, that may not be the current wait time. That was the wait time 30 minutes ago. A sudden influx of people right after the card was scanned in could make the wait be 45 minutes, just as a lack of new line entrants could make the wait time be closer to 15 minutes.

Now if they're going to use MagicBands to do a more frequent time tracking, (say every 5-10 guests) the resulting data would be inherently more accurate.

Replacing what token is used to measure doesn't change the problem you outlined. The flik cards measured what the line USED to be.. just like any system that measures at the END of the line. More frequent measurements reduces lag.. but the lag never can not be eliminated because it's a measurement taken at the end. If things change dramatically in the time that user was waiting, the measurement doesn't reflect what happened BEHIND the person being measured.

The only system that can really measure the current wait time would be a system that could count how many people are in line right now.. which means counting everyone getting in line.. and everyone exiting the line.

The wait is a function of two things... the current capacity of the attraction, and how many people are in line. The attraction capacity can be pretty easily estimated without a hard count if the grouper is able to function effectively. If you could people entering the queue.. and exiting the queue.. you have a pretty good estimate.

The problem is still that such a system must count people at the start of the queue.. and on busy attractions, the line itself can often extend well beyond the fixed queue. In which case, a count doesn't include the people in the extended queue..

 

[MinnieM123]

I'm wondering what they'll do with all the red FLIK cards, once they stop using them at the attractions. (Maybe, sell them off as historical souvenirs? )

 

[OliveMcFly]

YAY! I greatly disliked having to hand these to guests.

 

[larryz]

I heard someone ask and the cast member said it is 20 minutes from under the entrance sign.

So now the CMs have to be line location lawyers...?

 

[larryz]

Replacing what token is used to measure doesn't change the problem you outlined. The flik cards measured what the line USED to be.. just like any system that measures at the END of the line. More frequent measurements reduces lag.. but the lag never can not be eliminated because it's a measurement taken at the end. If things change dramatically in the time that user was waiting, the measurement doesn't reflect what happened BEHIND the person being measured.

The only system that can really measure the current wait time would be a system that could count how many people are in line right now.. which means counting everyone getting in line.. and everyone exiting the line.

The wait is a function of two things... the current capacity of the attraction, and how many people are in line. The attraction capacity can be pretty easily estimated without a hard count if the grouper is able to function effectively. If you could people entering the queue.. and exiting the queue.. you have a pretty good estimate.

The problem is still that such a system must count people at the start of the queue.. and on busy attractions, the line itself can often extend well beyond the fixed queue. In which case, a count doesn't include the people in the extended queue..

A CM with a portable device could easily scan the MB at the end of the line.

 

[Kevin_W]

My daughter always liked getting the red card, but as others have said this seems to be a natural thing for the MB's to be able to do. If they can sync ride photos to your account based on detecting you were on Sapce Mountain, they should easily be able to gather data on when you entered/exited the line.

 

[flynnibus]

A CM with a portable device could easily scan the MB at the end of the line.

But that's a CM position that doesn't usually exist... and isn't automated. And you have people that are not yet 'trapped' in the queue..

 

[Jon81uk]

But that's a CM position that doesn't usually exist... and isn't automated. And you have people that are not yet 'trapped' in the queue..

Even with the red cards the entrance CM would have to walk out to the end of the line to hand the card to the end of the actual line. It won't change the number of CMs.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Replacing what token is used to measure doesn't change the problem you outlined. The flik cards measured what the line USED to be.. just like any system that measures at the END of the line. More frequent measurements reduces lag.. but the lag never can not be eliminated because it's a measurement taken at the end. If things change dramatically in the time that user was waiting, the measurement doesn't reflect what happened BEHIND the person being measured.

The only system that can really measure the current wait time would be a system that could count how many people are in line right now.. which means counting everyone getting in line.. and everyone exiting the line.

The wait is a function of two things... the current capacity of the attraction, and how many people are in line. The attraction capacity can be pretty easily estimated without a hard count if the grouper is able to function effectively. If you could people entering the queue.. and exiting the queue.. you have a pretty good estimate.

The problem is still that such a system must count people at the start of the queue.. and on busy attractions, the line itself can often extend well beyond the fixed queue. In which case, a count doesn't include the people in the extended queue..

While not everyone in a queue has a MagicBand, I think enough people do so that a an accurate picture can be gathered based on their location. The location data can be combined with the merge counters and design data to compare the flow rate with the design capacity.

 

[PuertoRekinSam]

When I was down back in Early December I was talking to a manager over at Everest about this... I assume a manager, he was wasn't in a costume and had the pickers. He told me that against popular belief the wait times are not purposely over inflated, but instead they try to be within 10 minutes on either side. Things happen that cause them to be less than perfect, slow load, sudden need to take a train off or put it back on; but relatively speaking it's pretty good.

Since the electronic wait time for Guest with disabilities are based upon the current standby line, if they purposely over inflated the wait times it could lead to a huge class action lawsuit. Those Guest are told they will wait a similar amount of time as if ty were standing in the queue itself.

 

[wdrive]

When I was down back in Early December I was talking to a manager over at Everest about this... I assume a manager, he was wasn't in a costume and had the pickers. He told me that against popular belief the wait times are not purposely over inflated, but instead they try to be within 10 minutes on either side. Things happen that cause them to be less than perfect, slow load, sudden need to take a train off or put it back on; but relatively speaking it's pretty good.

Since the electronic wait time for Guest with disabilities are based upon the current standby line, if they purposely over inflated the wait times it could lead to a huge class action lawsuit. Those Guest are told they will wait a similar amount of time as if ty were standing in the queue itself.

They 100% inflate wait times. Ever been on the Mine Train minutes before closing? Wait time will be shown as a lengthy wait yet it will most likely be a walk on or close to it.

 

[Rider]

They 100% inflate wait times. Ever been on the Mine Train minutes before closing? Wait time will be shown as a lengthy wait yet it will most likely be a walk on or close to it.

Or is it just a sample size error because it's the end of day and the cast members don't hand out enough / any cards to get a good estimate?

And remember the cards only know how long a person waited previously. They can't tell if the wait has changed since then. If no one gets in line behind a card carrier and they wait 90 mins it will say they wait is still 90 even if it's 0.

From personal experience I once was given a card for Test Track single rider when the wait was posted as 45 mins. There were 0 people in the line and I walked right on after handing over the card. When I got back to the entrance after the ride the wait was now posted as 5 mins.

 

[wdrive]

Or is it just a sample size error because it's the end of day and the cast members don't hand out enough / any cards to get a good estimate?

And remember the cards only know how long a person waited previously. They can't tell if the wait has changed since then. If no one gets in line behind a card carrier and they wait 90 mins it will say they wait is still 90 even if it's 0.

From personal experience I once was given a card for Test Track single rider when the wait was posted as 45 mins. There were 0 people in the line and I walked right on after handing over the card. When I got back to the entrance after the ride the wait was now posted as 5 mins.

No they do it to stop a rush of people getting in line minutes/seconds before closing. If the Mine Train posted a 5 minute wait the line certainly wouldn't be 5 minutes for very long as the amount of people the pile into the line would substantially raise the wait time.

Not saying this is the only reason wait times may be inaccurate but it's a very regular occurrence to push up wait times at the most popular attractions in the closing hour to deter people from riding.

Likewise if you're the very first person to arrive at the Mine Train at rope drop the wait time certainly won't be at 0, it's usually at least 40 minutes before anyone can even reach the attraction.

 

[MinnieWaffles]

I'm waiting for people on the other Disney forum to complain that it was always a family tradition to get the FLIK cards and that they're now cancelling their trips

 

[larryz]

I'm waiting for people on the other Disney forum to complain that it was always a family tradition to get the FLIK cards and that they're now cancelling their trips

Now that you mention it, WDW would be giving up a great upsell opportunity -- the "Be Our Clock Experience," where for $24.95, a guest can play a key role in determining the actual time it takes for standby guests to experience an attraction by becoming a "special courier" charged with personally supervising the delivery of a critical piece of automated infrastructure to a specially designated Cast Member. The results computed by this special task will help guide thousands of Walt Disney World guests in making crucial decisions on how to spend their day in the Magic Kingdom and other parks in the resort, and will enhance the participating guest's stature from merely being a passive line member to becoming a purposeful participant. Important information: theme park admission required. Walt Disney World will not be responsible for any injuries or deaths suffered as a result of participating in this experience. Minimum age to participate is four years and guests will not be entitled to any other consideration as a result of participating. Guests must be capable of sustained lifting and carrying of specialized equipment weighing up to one pound and must not be allergic to plastic or nylon.

 

[MaryJaneP]

Could the signs ever accuracy predict the wait? Seems like there are too many variables to have any reliability and many posters here have confirmed that the signs are really more useful to park operations to encourage/discourage joining a line outside a ride.