morningstar
Well-Known Member
Intellectual Property. Meaning they own the trademarks, copyrights, etc. to make something based on a movie.
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Epcot and IPs: Good or Bad?
- Thread starter DisneyManOne
- Start date
Bluewaves
Well-Known Member
Does Frozen teach us anything about Norway? Figment is an example of creating a learning experience with having fun. If they can't do that than they shouldn't add an IP to it. Nemo and turtle talk are relatively good uses of an ip to updated a tired attraction. Even though I miss the old movie from the original ride.
The thing with Figment was that he was an IP created specifically for the park, not just something shoehorned in because Disney wanted to cash in on their latest success (then again, by the time the original JII opened, Disney didn't have any big recent hits until Little Mermaid in 1989).
morningstar
Well-Known Member
It has fjords, reindeer, trolls are a traditional Norwegian folk tale element. I think I heard Kristoff's costume is based on traditional Sami dress, the coronation hall was based on Nidaros Cathedral. They like saunas, ride around in sleighs, etc.
Make EPCOT, Not IPCOT.
Matt in the Hatt
Well-Known Member
I am all for a mix of original content and ips. The ips can serve as a gateway to put butts in the seats and then teach them something, but Figment, Dreamfinder, and the crew from kitchen kaberet all have special places in my heart
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
Response in general:
Wouldn't something created by Disney still be an IP? What is the difference in the terms of entertainment value? Why does it matter if it was an IP that Disney paid an imagineer to come up with or one that Disney paid to someone else for their idea? Don't we still benefit from it? And once Disney purchases it, isn't that IP now a Disney IP? Muppets, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Pixar are all currently properties of Disney, it is theirs. Why can't the entertain us with them? Isn't that why they bought them? Weren't Mary Poppins, Snow White, Cinderella, Peter Pan, Pooh, Br'er Rabbit all someone's idea before Disney made it their own? Much ado about nothing!
orlando678-
Well-Known Member
i think the difference is that the characters made for the park are designed specifically with the goal to educate and entertain guests on a certain topic, while if we would let Indiana Jones or Mary Poppins teach us about topics such as ocean observation, energy and science, transportation etc. just to attract guests, would make a distorted image of what Disney was once aiming for.
Captain Neo
Well-Known Member
Bad. IP should be leveraged where it's appropriate (Magic Kingdom, Studios, etc.) not in Epcot which has always been a uniquely designed park. It should stay focused on science, world cultures, and journeying into the realms of technology, transportation, energy imagination, etc.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
Yes, I suppose if one is still stuck in a 1980's time warp, they don't fit. Sometime we are all going to have to accept that education is no longer the mission of Epcot. Secondary perhaps, but, not primary. It didn't work, the park was slowly dying. Great concept in motive, but, Disney is primarily an entertainment venue. Schools are educational venues. To a minor degree those two can mesh. However, as an in your face situation, it obviously didn't.
Why couldn't those characters that you mentioned teach us. Didn't we get quite a charge about being taught by a weird looking red bearded guy wearing a tux and spats along with a purple dragon? Of course they can if they blend it in correctly. The problem was and still is that people don't go on vacation to be lectured, they want to be entertained. If you can combine the two you will be further ahead then just in your face education will ever amount too. Some have said that they taught without people being aware that it was happening. In things such as Imagination, that statement is correct, however, the rest were either a promotion for a particular business or dry education. Those days were different and fun, but, their time quickly passed. If adding IP's means that we can still enjoy Epcot for years to come... bring them on.
orlando678-
Well-Known Member
they can if they actually fit the topic, for example Inside Out and even Ratatouille would work, because those characters are designed to be connected with the topic which is also discussed in Epcot. But for example having Alice discussing i dont know, the history of London just because it is the same country doesn't make any sense. It would ruin the whole thematic side to the park, which it already slowly is by Nemo and Frozen.( Btw, I think they could have used this IP, but in a better way at least combining storytelling with some kind of educational message to get back the edutainment, which started to become rusty in the past but could, if done right, come back and actually become quite popular again)
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
But, they haven't done that or even close to it, so why be concerned until they do. Donald Duck isn't exactly Mexican either, but, no one seems to mind that inclusion anymore. As long as the areas in World Showcase are still named after the country they represent, the theme hasn't died. The educational aspect might have changed because that got old quickly, but, the theme has not. It was never a situation that they did it wrong wrong, it was more that when the public saw it, eventually it sunk in that they were being preached at and rejected it as a concept. They can take it in small doses, but, not in the commendable degree that it started out at. If they can't do it right, why even make a half hearted attempt at it. It will just fail.
Everyone seems to back Ratatouille for France and conveniently forgetting how great that their movie is. I'd take that anytime over running around in a rats eye view of a kitchen. French kitchen or not! However, it would fit the theme. In my mind that would be a step backwards from the original intent, with Norway, I didn't learn anything from the ride, nor do I with Frozen so net gain or loss = zero!
morningstar
Well-Known Member
Why is the book better than the movie? Why should musicians write their own songs? Because when artists aren't constrained to mimic what's come before, they can make the creative decisions that are right for the medium and the message.
morningstar
Well-Known Member
It did work, but the park was left to die of neglect.
morningstar
Well-Known Member
If you didn't learn anything, that's on you. There was plenty there to learn.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
Believe me, if it had been working it would still be there. Since everyone insists that Disney only does things for the money, it wouldn't be within their character to change it if it were working. The original concept was not a cheap one to maintain. It required a return of numbers to justify keeping it the way it was. It required daily changing to keep up with technology, something that was not a problem when it was first built and people with the imagination to continue to either keep up with or be one step ahead. If they did just neglect it like you say, it was because they couldn't figure out what to do with it. They are still neglecting it almost as much as they did back then, but, are, at least, thinking about changes that will revitalize Epcot again and make it a must do park once more.
A book is better then the movie because a book allows for more detail, but, that is not comparable to a theme park. When did anyone think that musicians should write their own songs? Almost all songs have been written and performed by different people. The musician then interprets the creation of others. Sometimes the person that writes music also performs it, then along comes someone that takes it even further then the original author did. Disney can be looked at like that. Yes, they can and should create some of it's own stuff and when they do, they can do it well. However, they can and do take the idea of others and create great stuff with it. I believe some of Walt's greatest successes were from the ideas (IP's) of others and expressed in a way that the original creator could not. It is the very history of Disney. IP's are not a new idea that someone on this board just came up with. IP's have been used by storytellers since storytellers have existed.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
Name one thing!
morningstar
Well-Known Member
The North Sea is a very stormy place.