ELI5 the benefit of more rides vs. another theme park

[rawisericho]

So this has been talked about endlessly on here but I simply don't understand the fundamental principles behind it. Why is it that a new theme park wouldn't ease capacity issues in WDW but more rides at parks would?

The argument is always that a new theme park would bring more attendance than it would disperse the current populace. But if that's true, then why wouldn't more rides in lieu of a new park do the same?

 

[Nordic4tKnight]

Americans get terrible vacation time off so you are already at a disadvantage in that most people will cut a park out rather than extend their vacations out a day or so to accommodate a new 5th gate. There are so many parks that would benefit by having new attractions (not replacements) such as Epcot and Animal Kingdom.

 

[mysto]

Both new rides or a 5th gate will help ease crowding.

People argue against a 5th gate because the existing parks aren't "done", they need more stuff and attention. But every little bit would help regardless of how it's arranged. I kinda don't care about gate or no gate, more stuff is more stuff.

Sometimes people argue against it because they don't expect it to happen.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

But if that's true, then why wouldn't more rides in lieu of a new park do the same?

Depends on the ride.

E-tickets draw more people into the parks than they're able to absorb, making the parks more crowded, not less. The way to make the parks less crowded is to add things like Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy, Na'vi River Journey, Alien Swirling Saucers, meet-and-greets, and dance parties. Put in things that distract people for 20 minutes here and there so they're not rushing from E-ticket queue to E-ticket queue.

 

[Club Cooloholic]

Depends on the ride.

E-tickets draw more people into the parks than they're able to absorb, making the parks more crowded, not less. The way to make the parks less crowded is to add things like Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy, Na'vi River Journey, Alien Swirling Saucers, meet-and-greets, and dance parties. Put in things that distract people for 20 minutes here and there so they're not rushing from E-ticket queue to E-ticket queue.

Especially if it is an E-ticket that has decent down time. For those that insist we need a 5th gate, I point to how they do things in California, where they somehow managed to have more rides than the Florida cousin, even though it has much less space and 2 less gates.

 

[rawisericho]

Especially if it is an E-ticket that has decent down time. For those that insist we need a 5th gate, I point to how they do things in California, where they somehow managed to have more rides than the Florida cousin, even though it has much less space and 2 less gates.

So is the capacity solution for WDW to add more C and D tickets?

 

[Club Cooloholic]

So is the capacity solution for WDW to add more C and D tickets?

Maybe. I am not one that studies the maps of all the parks, but I would think there is room for expansion. Lets take a look at Galaxies Edge for instance. They put in two rides, a tiny lounge instead of a real sit down restaurant. Add another ride, heck maybe a more child oriented spinner(HS could use one considering MK has Four(yes lets count 2 dumbos). Those rides due suck up people. Same with Toy Story, they should have put in a parashoot drop ride for the kids, it would have done great and sucked up more folks with a minimal footprint.

 

[lazyboy97o]

The cost to add capacity in the form of an additional park is significantly greater than as individual attractions. A new park needs all of the infrastructure that goes with a park, something that already exists at the existing parks. The only advantage to building a new park is it is easier to include the sort of small scale experiences that the Walt Disney World parks really need that will increase capacity while not inducing too much new demand.

 

[Djsfantasi]

But another viewpoint is that adding new rides in a park that doesn’t have the infrastructure to support them is also a profit sucker.

If the pathways can’t support the additional traffic, if people still can’t get to new rides, if poor organization caused by add-ons without the necessary engineering… Then people will be frustrated and the return on investment will be affected.

But add a 5th (or 6th or 7th) gate allows for better planning. And as a last minute thought, once a critical mass of parks exists, why not close an entire park down for reimagineering.

Someone mentioned a reimagineered HS, where the lands are themed after the major studios Disney owns. Disney, Pixar, Muppet, Marvel and other(s)!

With a 5th gate, you could shut down HS (or parts of HS) and reconfigure it with this theming.

 

[lazyboy97o]

But another viewpoint is that adding new rides in a park that doesn’t have the infrastructure to support them is also a profit sucker.

If the pathways can’t support the additional traffic, if people still can’t get to new rides, if poor organization caused by add-ons without the necessary engineering… Then people will be frustrated and the return on investment will be affected.

But add a 5th (or 6th or 7th) gate allows for better planning. And as a last minute thought, once a critical mass of parks exists, why not close an entire park down for reimagineering.

You’re still talking about orders of magnitude of difference. You can also phase dealing with issues of physical space as additions progress. Part of the problem with walkways at Walt Disney World is the lack of capacity to absorb all of those people (which is exacerbated by virtual queues) and poor design decisions (ie. dropping everything onto World Showcase Promenade).

 

[rawisericho]

You’re still talking about orders of magnitude of difference. You can also phase dealing with issues of physical space as additions progress. Part of the problem with walkways at Walt Disney World is the lack of capacity to absorb all of those people (which is exacerbated by virtual queues) and poor design decisions (ie. dropping everything onto World Showcase Promenade).

Okay, so let's forget about the cost for WDW. What makes the most sense from a "Reduce capacity in the four parks" perspective. Adding a 5th gate or adding more rides to the other 4 gates?

 

[lazyboy97o]

Okay, so let's forget about the cost for WDW. What makes the most sense from a "Reduce capacity in the four parks" perspective. Adding a 5th gate or adding more rides to the other 4 gates?

I don’t follow. Why would you want to reduce capacity? The exist parks already lack sufficient capacity. Do you mean reduce attendance?

 

[rawisericho]

I don’t follow. Why would you want to reduce capacity? The exist parks already lack sufficient capacity. Do you mean reduce attendance?

Yes, my bad, reduce crowding.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Yes, my bad, reduce crowding.

Crowding is relative perception of space rooted in many variables. Even from a purely guest experience perspective, making people go off to another location is not necessarily a positive nor does it address gaps in the existing facilities.

 

[Brer Panther]

Disney's Hollywood Studios, EPCOT, and Disney's Animal Kingdom all desperately need more to do.

 

[Nordic4tKnight]

Disney's Hollywood Studios, EPCOT, and Disney's Animal Kingdom all desperately need more to do.

Yeah, like get rid of the Bugs Life torture chamber and use the huge space for a Nocturnal Animal Ride/Experience.

 

[Djsfantasi]

Yeah, like get rid of the Bugs Life torture chamber and use the huge space for a Nocturnal Animal Ride/Experience.

A Bugs Life what? When I bring a guest to AK, ABL is an attraction that is memorable…

 

[Naplesgolfer]

Here is a possible outline for Epcot. Fix /up grade Journey into imagination . Overlay Coco in Mexico and add a simple queue addition to side of the pyramid entering through the glass blowing shop area (themed to blend in ). Add ride as planned long ago in Germany and Japan both with large enough queue so there are no lines in the walkways. ( some ride buildings/queue area's already exist) Add Mary Poppins dark ride to England . Fix the track and last third of Spaceship Earth and repair the rest of the ride. eventually you would need to fix /overlay test track as well.

This plan or variations would make would make Epcot a full day park able to handle 7-10 thousand more people and feel less crowded than today. Similar plans but with all new construction is needed in Animal kingdom.

 

[Naplesgolfer]

I also should have stated that rides need to be as high a hourly capacity as feasible to soak up the crowds. Theme park 101 really. I don't know why them ignore this. Happier guests and more genie+ slots they can sell.