Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Jeff4272]

Someone want to check this? My phone shows no ILL available for Avatar, MMRR, RotR (of course), Remy & 7DMT.
Frozen is showing 8:40pm.

ToT too........Genie+ is not going to work during the busy times in HS.....

Wait until Thanksgiving week when ROTR and MMRR are sold out and MFSR, SDD, TOT and RNR are all gone when you go to book your second Genie+ ride......

I'm taking bets.......I will bet that these 6 rides will be gone less than 2 hours after park opening.......give me 10-1 odds, any takers?

**and those have been "sold out" for hours fyi

 

[hopemax]

Mike at BlogMickey has some allocation numbers but they strike me as way off, especially his phase 1 numbers. If during normal operations, 80% of the queue was going to LL with 67% of guests not buying it the standby queues would be hours long. Curious if the people who know park ops better (or work rides!) have some insight.

Disney World Allocates Up to 93% Of Ride Capacity to Lightning Lane

Ever wondered what the lightning lane to standby ratios were for rides at Disney World? We take a look at the actual numbers and ride phases

blogmickey.com

Or it just means that out of the 67% of guests who don't have LL, most of them ended up choosing to skip the attraction entirely vs entering the queue and waiting in line. People have to choose to wait to push standby waits out. Many people will wait 45-60, a lot fewer will wait 150+.

 

[mikejs78]

Or it just means that out of the 67% of guests who don't have LL, most of them ended up choosing to skip the attraction entirely vs entering the queue and waiting in line. People have to choose to wait to push standby waits out. Many people will wait 45-60, a lot fewer will wait 150+.

Then who are all those people in a 150 plus minute line?

 

[hopemax]

Then who are all those people in a 150 plus minute line?

Huh? My post doesn't mean no one is willing to wait 150 minutes?

Wait times are determined by the differential between "how fast people are being taken from standby" and "how fast people are entering the queue." You don't seem to understand if the "how fast people are being taken from standby" is so low, how come the lines aren't longer? I am answering: "Because people aren't entering the queue fast enough."

Even though the remaining pool of guests is 67% of park attendance and it feels like many people should be entering the queue all the time... they aren't. On busier days, the dynamic changes. Guests willing to visit the park at all on a busy day are also likely to be willing to wait longer on those days. "They know what they are signing up for." And BECAUSE the ratio coming from standby is so low, it doesn't take THAT many of them to get the line to start growing to reach those higher waits.

 

[mikejs78]

Huh? My post doesn't mean no one is willing to wait 150 minutes?

Wait times are determined by the differential between "how fast people are being taken from standby" and "how fast people are entering the queue." You don't seem to understand if the "how fast people are being taken from standby" is so low, how come the lines aren't longer? I am answering: "Because people aren't entering the queue fast enough."

Even though the remaining pool of guests is 67% of park attendance and it feels like many people should be entering the queue all the time... they aren't. On busier days, the dynamic changes. Guests willing to visit the park at all on a busy day are also likely to be willing to wait longer on those days. "They know what they are signing up for." And BECAUSE the ratio coming from standby is so low, it doesn't take THAT many of them to get the line to start growing to reach those higher waits.

This doesn't logically make sense. If only a third of the park is using Genie Plus, and 2/3 of the park isn't, then what are the remaining 2/3 of the park doing all day?

 

[CastAStone]

Disney has said Genie+ will never sell out. What that means, is even after all availability is gone, they will continue to allow people to purchase Genie+, even when they literally get nothing for their purchase. Nice, huh?

You always get the audio tours.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Disney has said Genie+ will never sell out. What that means, is even after all availability is gone, they will continue to allow people to purchase Genie+, even when they literally get nothing for their purchase. Nice, huh?

I have to agree. I would go so far to say we are not getting much for our money regardless of how many folks purchase DG+

Folks gotta remember they are now charging us for a worse system in DG+ than we got FOR FREE with FastPass +

 

[Disstevefan1]

Posted wait times are overestimated, but they have always been overestimated......


But the point is, the theory that people had that FP+ was inflating standby times is vastly overblown


Standby times are just as bad

The whole was bad and is still bad, the only difference is now they are charging us for it..

 

[Disney Dad 3000]

This doesn't logically make sense. If only a third of the park is using Genie Plus, and 2/3 of the park isn't, then what are the remaining 2/3 of the park doing all day?

Visiting the Swiss Family Robinson Treehouse and riding the Carousel

 

[JAB]

You always get the audio tours.

And the AR filters. Don't forget about the AR filters.

 

[hopemax]

This doesn't logically make sense. If only a third of the park is using Genie Plus, and 2/3 of the park isn't, then what are the remaining 2/3 of the park doing all day?

Bingo. You wonder where the stories come from about how people went to Disney and had a bad time because they didn't get to do anything good come from?

They are doing the non-headliners with shorter lines, watching shows, eating, shopping, meeting characters, watching parades and fireworks and a lot of wandering around (but the scenery and area music is nice), app games, and as just mentioned the AR filters for taking photos. The number of people in a park that actually gets to experience all the best rides... it's really only a small percentage of the daily total. Everyone else is picking, choosing and compromising. Which is why Disney offers all those other types of things. It should be obvious that if AK averages 38K per day like they did in 2019, and FOP only handles 14K per day, most people aren't riding FOP. Same goes for all the other rides. Some is by choice. Kid is too short, don't like coasters, have an AP you'll ride next week, but a lot of it is people don't like waiting.

 

[mikejs78]

Bingo. You wonder where the stories come from about how people went to Disney and had a bad time because they didn't get to do anything good come from?

They are doing the non-headliners with shorter lines, watching shows, eating, shopping, meeting characters, watching parades and fireworks and a lot of wandering around (but the scenery and area music is nice), app games, and as just mentioned the AR filters for taking photos. The number of people in a park that actually gets to experience all the best rides... it's really only a small percentage of the daily total. Everyone else is picking, choosing and compromising. Which is why Disney offers all those other types of things. It should be obvious that if AK averages 38K per day like they did in 2019, and FOP only handles 14K per day, most people aren't riding FOP. Same goes for all the other rides. Some is by choice. Kid is too short, don't like coasters, have an AP you'll ride next week, but a lot of it is people don't like waiting.

Most people I talk to, even if they have no clue, end up having a good time. Sure, do they get to go on every headliner? No. But they heard about FoP or Safari. People will wait in lines because it's perceived that it's what you do.

 

[matt9112]

They would have had to raise AP prices by $5 per day to get the same revenue bump.

the point of this change was not to make money. They also wanted to change behavior. This system spreads a lot more of the headline capacity from local APs to people willing to pay extra, which is more likely to be infrequent visitors. In the past, locals could binge the new rides over and over. Boarding groups limited them to once per day. This further limits them to how often they’re willing to pay.

What? Locals...like who? Just people that live in orlando? I never once drove the hour to be there for the lottery. I legitimately never rode rise to this day.

 

[disneygeek90]

What? Locals...like who? Just people that live in orlando? I never once drove the hour to be there for the lottery. I legitimately never rode rise to this day.

People grossly overestimate the local effect specifically for WDW. While I did ride ROTR a lot during BG days, I was absolutely an exception to the rule. In some ways the new format is actually better for me. I can sleep in (or go to work) and hop into the queue right before close.

 

[DisneyDodo]

ToT too........Genie+ is not going to work during the busy times in HS.....

Wait until Thanksgiving week when ROTR and MMRR are sold out and MFSR, SDD, TOT and RNR are all gone when you go to book your second Genie+ ride......

I'm taking bets.......I will bet that these 6 rides will be gone less than 2 hours after park opening.......give me 10-1 odds, any takers?

**and those have been "sold out" for hours fyi

On busy days, G+ users may only get something like 2 LLs at DHS. But those LLs may each save over an hour of waiting, so the $15 would still be similarly beneficial to a less crowded day.

 

[aaronml]

YouTube is removing the dislike count on all videos across its platform | TechCrunch

YouTube today announced its decision to make the "dislike" count on videos private across its platform. The decision is likely to be controversial given

techcrunch.com

Good news for Disney given the dislike count on the Genie / Lighting Lane announcement video…

 

[Jviera1298]

I just wanted to throw this in here as a casual observer of this forum but someone who doesn't post often.

We go to Disney anywhere from 2-4 times a year from Massachusetts. Each time we go its usually 1-2 weeks long. We go to parks almost every day of the vacation (maybe 10 days on a 2 week trip). We just got back last week from a 2 week vacation with my in-laws (so 4 adults, 2 children) and I can honestly say we LOVE Lightning Lane. Yes, I realize its just paid Fastpass+, but the exception is fewer people are using it because its paid and the limits are fewer than they were with FP+. We have 2 little ones (5 and almost 4) - and they have each been to WDW no less than 2-3 months of their lives. Until this this trip, they had never been on Peter Pan, SDMT, or Jungle Cruise to name a few. If not for LL, they wouldnt have done them this trip either. We generally dont wait more than 20-30 minutes for any ride during our trips - so LL really is a gamechanger for us.

I understand, its expensive, not everyone can afford it. But when you think about it, it's kind of genius for Disney. My family and I are lucky enough that we dont need to worry about the cost of things while on vacation. So, Disney whacks us for the cost of Genie+, and the cost of Individual LL (we did Remys, Frozen 3x, Everest, and MMRR) - but for those of us with more discretionary income, they get us in and out of the ride so we can spend more money on other things. People not willing or able to spend extra money above and beyond getting into the parks for such perks, well, Disney probably doesn't mind them stuck in a queue all that much. I know this is probably not a popular opinion, but from a pure business sense, I get it and I think Disney probably ran the math on all of this. Lets face it - for the last handful of years Disney has been collecting insane amounts of data from our little wristbands - they know who they want stuck in lines and who they want spending more of their day free to visit food stands and gift shops. Is it "fair"? No. Is it good business? Yes. No different than how every resort or addition Disney builds now is a Deluxe - they want capacity for those who have more money. That's their target audience.

Anyhow - put me in the group that found LL to be awesome, however small that group may be. We got to experience far more rides this trip than we had in years (even counting a few of the previous Covid trips weve done with lower crowd levels).

 

[CAV]

What? Locals...like who? Just people that live in orlando? I never once drove the hour to be there for the lottery. I legitimately never rode rise to this day.

The one time I got on it, it broke down when we got to the room with all the stormtroopers. As AP holders, I can't see myself paying $15 or more to ride it. So, I dont imagine I'll ever get on it.

 

[Jeff4272]

Today at HS is a non holiday weekday with a crowd calendar of 5 from Len Testa..........

9:45am today and here are HS Genie+ and ILL return times:

ROTR - gone
MMRR - 5:40pm

SDD - gone
MFSR - 6:35pm
RnR - 2:15pm
ToT - 4:05pm
TSM - 1:25pm



What will these be a week from tomorrow when Thanksgiving week begins? All rides will be gone by the time you go to book your second ride

You will get 1 ride for your $15


So im paying $15 for the 1 ride?..........Some people will think it's worth it, I certainly do not

 

[pdude81]

Today at HS is a non holiday weekday with a crowd calendar of 5 from Len Testa..........

9:45am today and here are HS Genie+ and ILL return times:

ROTR - gone
MMRR - 5:40pm

SDD - gone
MFSR - 6:35pm
RnR - 2:15pm
ToT - 4:05pm
TSM - 1:25pm



What will these be a week from tomorrow when Thanksgiving week begins? All rides will be gone by the time you go to book your second ride

You will get 1 ride for your $15


So im paying $15 for the 1 ride?..........Some people will think it's worth it, I certainly do not

When I've been at WDW on 2 and 3 days they seem more like the old 7 or 8 to me, but in FP time I didn't ride standby all that often except for EMH. Today as a five between three days at a 6 is essentially flatlined. i.e. still a holiday weekend for all intents and purposes

You're right about Thanksgiving though. It's going to be vastly more crowded than this. We'll have to see whether they increase the LL availability based on crowds and purchases, or if most passes are gone by park open.