Disney Genie and Genie+ at Walt Disney World

[Splash4eva]

These numbers get staggering quickly… if we assume 80% of total inventory using very basic guesstimates we get…

Value resorts, 10300 total rooms, 20% vacancy is 2060 rooms, at $200 a night = $412,000

Moderate resorts, 7000 total rooms, 20% vacancy is 1400 rooms, at $300 a night = $420,000

Deluxe resorts, 5000 total rooms, 20% vacancy is 1000 rooms, at $500 a night is $500,000

Losing $1.5 million a day from hotel rates alone is huge but even at 3 people per room those roughly 5000 empty rooms becomes 15000 lost ticket sales, food sales, drink sales, souvenir sales, etc a day, at $200 per person that’s another $3 million a day…

$5 million a day in overall loses, or $1.7 billion a year.

In a way with their park capacity issues this is a blessing in disguise

 

[bwr827]

I guess it depends on your vacation style.
To me Epic is a 4 day park on its own to really enjoy all it has to offer.

The park commandos who power through the rides and don't take time to enjoy the atmosphere wouldn't spend more than a week at WDW either.

We’re thinking 3 days for Epic in early 2026, especially with expectations of high crowd levels. Definitely want to have a chance to take our time experiencing the atmosphere.

 

[Cariad]

I sent an email to customer services about the international thing, and the reply came back:

"While we appreciate your concern, Lightning Lane Multi Pass and Lightning Lane Single Pass features will be available to Guests from other countries, they will be able to begin their pre-arrival planning on the My Disney Experience Mobile App after they reach the United States"

Great. They expect international visitors to do their pre-arrival planning AFTER they have arrived. I'm going to order a TARDIS...

What difference does it actually make as to whether we are physically in the US or not? Another head scratcher from Disney who just seem to want to make everything more complicated than it should be.

 

[bwr827]

What difference does it actually make as to whether we are physically in the US or not? Another head scratcher from Disney who just seem to want to make everything more complicated than it should be.

I’m awaiting reports of VPN success/failure in the last week of July.

If necessary, I’m driving across the border at my 7-day mark in late November. Ridiculous.

 

[ToTBellHop]

I’m awaiting reports of VPN success/failure in the last week of July.

If necessary, I’m driving across the border at my 7-day mark in late November. Ridiculous.

You’ll enjoy that fresh, American air.

 

[Dranth]

You are kidding right? Waiting lists over 3 years, waiting to have urgent cancer diagnostic tests over 3 months, can’t make an appointment with a doctor without an 8am scramble every day - like a VQ.

Partially. There are some aspects of it I would take but no matter what system you use there are always issues. We certainly have problems here from prescription costs to difficulty getting access for those with less money, etc.

Although, come to think of it, you all put it in your opening day ceremony for the Olympics, so it has to be awesome!

 

[DisneyCane]

I don't know, I think I'd still stick with our NHS after my wife had a two night hospital stay in Orlando on our honeymoon. She came out with a $46,000 bill...

 

[GoofGoof]

These numbers get staggering quickly… if we assume 80% of total inventory using very basic guesstimates we get…

Value resorts, 10300 total rooms, 20% vacancy is 2060 rooms, at $200 a night = $412,000

Moderate resorts, 7000 total rooms, 20% vacancy is 1400 rooms, at $300 a night = $420,000

Deluxe resorts, 5000 total rooms, 20% vacancy is 1000 rooms, at $500 a night is $500,000

Losing $1.5 million a day from hotel rates alone is huge but even at 3 people per room those roughly 5000 empty rooms becomes 15000 lost ticket sales, food sales, drink sales, souvenir sales, etc a day, at $200 per person that’s another $3 million a day…

$5 million a day in overall loses, or $1.7 billion a year.

It doesn’t really work that way though. You can’t actually operate at 100% occupancy. People are animals and it amazes me what they can do to a hotel room. The 90% target is probably the sweet spot, maybe 90-95%. Even DVC resorts struggle above 95%. Things may peak at or near sold out for short periods but that is not sustainable. The national average for hotel occupancy hovers just over 60% but that obviously includes hotels in much less desirable locations. I’m sure TWDC is not thrilled if the real occupancy rates are in the low 80s but they also aren’t starting the due diligence to sell off the hotels.

The other factor is the room rates. I just stayed in suite at a hotel in Times Square with a private balcony and it was about 30% cheaper than the cheapest room at the Polynesian.

 

[GhostHost1000]

It doesn’t really work that way though. You can’t actually operate at 100% occupancy. People are animals and it amazes me what they can do to a hotel room. The 90% target is probably the sweet spot, maybe 90-95%. Even DVC resorts struggle above 95%. Things may peak at or near sold out for short periods but that is not sustainable. The national average for hotel occupancy hovers just over 60% but that obviously includes hotels in much less desirable locations. I’m sure TWDC is not thrilled if the real occupancy rates are in the low 80s but they also aren’t starting the due diligence to sell off the hotels.

The other factor is the room rates. I just stayed in suite at a hotel in Times Square with a private balcony and it was about 30% cheaper than the cheapest room at the Polynesian.

the problem isn't just room rates, its ticket prices, G+ prices, changes over the years/bad management decisions, no magical express, food prices, etc.etc.etc.

 

[Splash4eva]

It doesn’t really work that way though. You can’t actually operate at 100% occupancy. People are animals and it amazes me what they can do to a hotel room. The 90% target is probably the sweet spot, maybe 90-95%. Even DVC resorts struggle above 95%. Things may peak at or near sold out for short periods but that is not sustainable. The national average for hotel occupancy hovers just over 60% but that obviously includes hotels in much less desirable locations. I’m sure TWDC is not thrilled if the real occupancy rates are in the low 80s but they also aren’t starting the due diligence to sell off the hotels.

The other factor is the room rates. I just stayed in suite at a hotel in Times Square with a private balcony and it was about 30% cheaper than the cheapest room at the Polynesian.

So you had a great view of how lovely the city is now

 

[nickys]

You can book through the UK website because the Walt Disney Travel Company is registered in the UK.

We need to be badgering them to get this policy changed. Or asking them to book for us - bet they’ll love that!

Yeah, harassing the call center agents who have no control over this and are only implementing policy is a great way to treat them.

I know I’m quoting myself here, but several people are reporting that they have received replies from WDW guest services suggesting that they ask their travel agents to book for them. *

I guess that’s the go-ahead for UK guests to be calling WDTC.

*Obviously that advice is pure crap since UK travel agents aren’t based in the US.

 

[osian]

I know I’m quoting myself here, but several people are reporting that they have received replies from WDW guest services suggesting that they ask their travel agents to book for them. *

I guess that’s the go-ahead for UK guests to be calling WDTC.

*Obviously that advice is pure crap since UK travel agents aren’t based in the US.

Thing is, how would a travel agent get inside your head to know what you want to do in case you have to change plans?

Me: I want to book Thunder Mountain, Pirates and Haunted Mansion for the morning of the 10th.
TA: OK, I tried that but Thunder Mountain isn't available in the morning. There's a slot available at 2pm.
Me: But I have a reservation at Spice Road Table in EPCOT at 2.30pm.
TA: Well, there's a morning slot for BTMR in the morning of the 11th.
Me: I wasn't planning to be in MK that day, but I can change my plans. So yes, please book that.
TA: Just tried but the slot has gone.
Me: Can you try the 12th then?
TA: Got it. But there's no Haunted Mansion for that morning, what would you like to do?

etc

You very often have to box clever when doing these advanced reservations, came across this problem with FP+. You have to be prepared to swap things round and even change park days when you can't get things aligned properly.

Another reason why "pre-planning" can't be done on the bus between the airport and the resort...and what happens if you've got a hire car and are actually driving it. By the time I've boarded the plane, I would expect to have all my planning done and know exactly what's happening. With Genie+, MaxPass and FastPass, there's no planning as everyone starts off from scratch on equal footing on the day, and it's up to you how much effort to put into getting there early to make sure your plans work if that's important to you.

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

Are other people as upset about this new system as I am? I think it stinks bad

Or is it more of, "oh well, there's nothing we can do about it and we will figure it out"

 

[Dranth]

Are other people as upset about this new system as I am? I think it stinks bad

Or is it more of, "oh well, there's nothing we can do about it and we will figure it out"

I hate it and think it is a borderline travesty but like all other changes they make, we will need to see how it works in practice before making any real conclusions.

I do think if it stinks as bad as I expect it will they will tweak things just like they did with previous systems.

 

[Bastet]

I suppose it depends on how many people decide to prebook when confronted with the price tag for doing so

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

I hate it and think it is a borderline travesty but like all other changes they make, we will need to see how it works in practice before making any real conclusions.

I do think if it stinks as bad as I expect it will they will tweak things just like they did with previous systems.

I read genie+ was tweaked 15 times in the 2+ years of it's existence

 

[yensid67]

OK...this is a SMALL STEP in the right direction, but there is still room for improvement that will make Disney and guests happy!
First, Disney should make the LLMP a price that is permanent. even at $25/person per day they are still making money. Secondly, they need to figure out a way to make it like FP and have to go to the attraction and get a paper ticket with a return window...this will eliminate the guests using their phones all day on vacation!
IDEA: LLMP is purchased in advanced and you add the 3 selections at the time of advanced purchase. Then, when you use your first LLMP selection, you go to the attraction and pick up a FP return time and go from there. This way there is no being on your cell phones all day long ONLY IF YOU NEED TO MODIFY something! Thirdly, LLMP should only be $25-$30 due to the fact you will be paying extra for SLLP!
I just wished they would post the prices now, so people can plan and see how much EXTRA money they will be spending! The GENIE+/LLMP is the reason why we are not planning a DAY in the parks! We will be going to the MNSSHP instead...more bang for your buck!

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

OK...this is a SMALL STEP in the right direction, but there is still room for improvement that will make Disney and guests happy!
First, Disney should make the LLMP a price that is permanent. even at $25/person per day they are still making money. Secondly, they need to figure out a way to make it like FP and have to go to the attraction and get a paper ticket with a return window...this will eliminate the guests using their phones all day on vacation!
IDEA: LLMP is purchased in advanced and you add the 3 selections at the time of advanced purchase. Then, when you use your first LLMP selection, you go to the attraction and pick up a FP return time and go from there. This way there is no being on your cell phones all day long ONLY IF YOU NEED TO MODIFY something! Thirdly, LLMP should only be $25-$30 due to the fact you will be paying extra for SLLP!
I just wished they would post the prices now, so people can plan and see how much EXTRA money they will be spending! The GENIE+/LLMP is the reason why we are not planning a DAY in the parks! We will be going to the MNSSHP instead...more bang for your buck!

I think the worst thing they could do at this point from a guest perspective is remove the system from the app/mobile phones. That is one of the biggest improvements over paper FP. I would hate to have to physically go to each attraction again without the upsides of paper FP.

Being on your phone all day long is a choice for people who want to maximize, you can be on your phone for 30 seconds or less if all you want to do is snag an available ride time and leave it alone.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

Maybe it's because I'm a part of Gen Z, but I'm on my phone all the time either way. Having the ability to modify/get new FastPass(or whatever they're choosing to call it this week) selections is a huge plus from running to attraction to attraction.

 

[m steve]

This just keeps getting worse. Now you have to buy the Genie + equivalent and, on top of that, single lightning lane purchases for the top attractions?! Plus you have tier restrictions?! I guarantee you that prices will continue to soar. This type on anti guest behavior is precisely why we stopped going to WDW three years ago.