Did Entitled Guests Kill the Magic?

[crispy]

I don't start topics too often, but I keep seeing posts about how Disney is no longer the magical place it used to be. Fingers are always pointing to the powers that be, and I do understand those arguments. There are maintenance issues and WDW itself seems to be in a bit of a holding pattern. I would argue, though, that some of the magic has been lost because guests have unreasonable expectations.

Take the paintbrushes for instance. I visit many Disney websites and have seen people talk about how they would race to Tom Sawyer's Island so that their child could find a paintbrush first. Then I've seen threads where people were mad because someone else had raced to Tom Sawyer's Island and found all the paintbrushes so their children didn't get to find one. I've seen rants about not getting towel animals in the room even though they left Mousekeeping a tip in a personalized envelope. I've seen rants about how someone's child didn't get enough attention from the characters even though their child was wearing a customized Disney outfit that they paid $300 for. I've seen threads from people asking if they should request a room upgrade and the various strategies for getting one. I could go on and on and on and on.

It seems that when Disney does something nice and magical, there are always guests who hear about it and try to take advantage of it. They try to "create" magic for themselves, and by doing so they end up destroying it for everyone else. Why have paintbrushes when you have people fighting over them and probably abusing cast members in the process? Why would you give anyone a room upgrade when you are going to have other guests demanding them?

I have been to Disney about 15 times. I went for the first time as an adult, and I have been hooked every since. My husband and children now love it as much as I do. We have never gotten a room upgrade, we have rarely had towel animals, we have never found a paintbrush, and we didn't win a single thing during the Year of a Million Dreams except an ice cream (and I was buying it for someone else! ). You know what? We still go to Disney because it's fun and it's a wonderful place that my family loves. Disney doesn't create the magic for my family - we create the magic by having fun and appreciating what we are experiencing. The few times when something special has happened like getting special seating at The Lion King Show and watching my daughter's participate in the Princess Parade at Downtown Disney are just icing on the cake. Maybe if people stopped trying so hard to create "magic" they would be more likely to enjoy the magic that's already there.

To quote POGO, "We have met the enemy, and he is us."

 

[flynnibus]

That kind of behavior only kills it for those people and who they directly cross. That kind of thinking really doesn't justify taking things out of the product.

Basically what you describe is people trying to game the system for their advantage. You can tweak the system to minimize that and tou can stand up to people that try to demand perks as required services. But instead Disney just takes things away all together frequently rather than address issues.

You can't just pin the results on those people. It takes two to tango...

 

[crispy]

I am not saying that TPTB are without blame because they aren't, but I do think guests have to bear some responsibility as well.

 

[Britt]

I absolutely agree with you Crispy!

It gets very difficult to get on here as the trip comes closer, seeing so much negativity about the parks. This is the one place we go, that no matter what goes wrong, we feel like we TRULY get our money's worth. EVERYONE walks away happy, exhausted, and planning their next trip and what they want to do next time.

And there are posts, blogs, and tip books on how to take advantage of what's available and can't believe the levels people are willing to stoop to.

People say that the parks aren't Walts vision, but neither is the behavior of many of the guests.

 

[alissafalco]

Unfortunately that happens wherever you go not just in Disney. I do have to say that Disney is a little too quick to take things away without addressing the problem. Just yesterday Tikiman posted to his FB page that the Polynesian stopped giving out bottled water to club level because people were taking them back to their room for their families and taking other free food items leaving other guests with none. He said if this continues Disney will take it all away. Well, instead of Disney being so quick to just take things away, why don't they have a CM monitor what guests are taking so it's not abused?????

 

[Kramerica]

Ultimately, with of course rare exceptions, your Disney vacation is what you make of it. There are those people who have unrealistic expectations, and they're just setting themselves up for disappointment. Of course, this isn't to say that people like us shouldn't come onto these forums. Discuss what Disney can improve. Things that require attention, things like that. But in the end, you have to decide if you're going to have a good vacation. I always do.

 

[FettFan]

Too true. While a lot of the "magic is gone" complaints are legitimate and focused on neglected or broken rides and attractions (especially while the park continually raises admissions prices).....there are still a good number of "fast food nation" complaints by people who want everything on THEIR terms and if they don't get what they want, will go out of their way to and moan and make life miserable for the rest of us (and more importantly, they make life an absolute HELL for the cast members.)

 

[luv]

I do think that they've stopped some things, like the paint brushes, because it became more headache than magic for staff and gusts alike.

But many of the things they cut we're done just to save money. I think that one day they might realize that all the little cutbacks lead to people being less impressed with their time at WDW.

When people go home raving about all kinds of things, others want to go and see it. They want to have a vacation that leaves them feeling that way. But when people come back saying it was fun and that they really liked X and Y ride, but My God it was so expensive and HOT...people think they'll save their money for something else.

I've listened to co-workers before they go and when they come home. And I've noticed, over the years, what they talk more about.

Disney is hot in the summer. The lines are long. And we all know that it isnt a cheap vacation, lol. They need all those little extras to make people focus on how amazing every little thing is so they aren't focusing on heat, lines and expense. I think people who take business classes refer to it as Perceived Value, lol.

Topiaries, Lights of Winter, Four for a Dollar, cleanliness, friendliness...and even the napkins, lol...all those gazillions of big and little things...that stuff impresses people. It makes a difference.

Disney can't cut thing after thing after thing and then wonder why attendance drops. And especially when Uni just keeps getting better and better! I don't mean to turn it into a Disney v Uni thing...but Uni is a short ride away and they do keep adding and improving. Can't ignore that!

Disney focuses on how they should change when they should focus on going back to what they were good at doing! They had the winning, magical formula. It worked. It would continue to work. Good, up-to-date rides. Clean and attractive grounds. Polite and friendly staff. Lots of little touches. Keep that stuff in order and attendance will take care of itself. Quality always outs. Every single time.

They built hotels with small rooms so that they could cram people in and make extra money. They dont give service like real luxury hotels do...or like Uni does. So, people decided to stay in hotels with bigger rooms that cost less. And Disney looks at occupancy and wonders why. They have a ton of small rooms, ready to cram people in...but they find out that having a bunch of small rooms and skimping on staff doesnt raise money...the rooms sit empty. They need people in the rooms.

They've decided to re-vamp the FP system to bribe people into staying in their hotels. All they had to do was have decent room sizes and good service. Once Upon a Time, Disney knew that.

 

[ParentsOf4]

If I correctly understand your premise, it suggests that "entitled guests" are a relatively new phenomenon. Based on my limited experience in the 1970s and 1980s, it's nothing new. There always have been guests coming to WDW with high expectations. WDW travel guides were published from the start and the "inside secrets" (e.g. TSI paintbrush or towel animals) were known to anyone who read these books.

What has changed a lot are prices. As I recently posted elsewhere, my 3-day hopper ticket in 1983 cost about $35 or $80.51 in today's dollars. The actual price of this ticket today is $299. There's a huge difference between $80.51 and $299. It's understandable that someone who pays $299 should reasonably expect more. If anything, it's WDW that needs to live up to people's expectations, given the prices they currently charge.

 

[bethymouse]

The prices are outrageous, and they're getting worse. It's a shame. I like going every year, but we may have to go every other year or so. Then it will be just horrible. But, we save for it, we go, and we enjoy the heck out of our vacation! There's never any trouble as far as I'm concerned w/ service and the cast members. You can never go wrong w/ Disney! IMHO.

 

[FettFan]

What has changed a lot are prices. As I recently posted elsewhere, my 3-day hopper ticket in 1983 cost about $35 or $80.51 in today's dollars. The actual price of this ticket today is $299. There's a huge difference between $80.51 and $299. It's understandable that someone who pays $299 should reasonably expect more. If anything, it's WDW that needs to live up to people's expectations, given the prices they currently charge.

A three-day hopper ticket in 1983 was only good for two parks. (technically one and a half parks, since Epcot did not have Maelstrom, Living Seas, Journey into Imagination or Horizons when it first opened.)

A three-day hopper ticket is only $299, gets you into FOUR parks, and if you add the $22 water park option, you can throw in Blizzard Beach and Typhoon Lagoon.

$321 for six parks. That's really not that bad in comparison, given the size of the parks and how much there is to do today than there was in 1983.

 

[alissafalco]

I do think that they've stopped some things, like the paint brushes, because it became more headache than magic for staff and gusts alike.

But many of the things they cut we're done just to save money. I think that one day they might realize that all the little cutbacks lead to people being less impressed with their time at WDW.

When people go home raving about all kinds of things, others want to go and see it. They want to have a vacation that leaves them feeling that way. But when people come back saying it was fun and that they really liked X and Y ride, but My God it was so expensive and HOT...people think they'll save their money for something else.

I've listened to co-workers before they go and when they come home. And I've noticed, over the years, what they talk more about.

Disney is hot in the summer. The lines are long. And we all know that it isnt a cheap vacation, lol. They need all those little extras to make people focus on how amazing every little thing is so they aren't focusing on heat, lines and expense. I think people who take business classes refer to it as Perceived Value, lol.

Topiaries, Lights of Winter, Four for a Dollar, cleanliness, friendliness...and even the napkins, lol...all those gazillions of big and little things...that stuff impresses people. It makes a difference.

Disney can't cut thing after thing after thing and then wonder why attendance drops. And especially when Uni just keeps getting better and better! I don't mean to turn it into a Disney v Uni thing...but Uni is a short ride away and they do keep adding and improving. Can't ignore that!

Disney focuses on how they should change when they should focus on going back to what they were good at doing! They had the winning, magical formula. It worked. It would continue to work. Good, up-to-date rides. Clean and attractive grounds. Polite and friendly staff. Lots of little touches. Keep that stuff in order and attendance will take care of itself. Quality always outs. Every single time.

They built hotels with small rooms so that they could cram people in and make extra money. They dont give service like real luxury hotels do...or like Uni does. So, people decided to stay in hotels with bigger rooms that cost less. And Disney looks at occupancy and wonders why. They have a ton of small rooms, ready to cram people in...but they find out that having a bunch of small rooms and skimping on staff doesnt raise money...the rooms sit empty. They need people in the rooms.

They've decided to re-vamp the FP system to bribe people into staying in their hotels. All they had to do was have decent room sizes and good service. Once Upon a Time, Disney knew that.

I totally agree with everything you are saying. I just didn't know what FP stands for?

 

[Avenger117]

I don't feel like the rooms at Disney are that much smaller than the norm. I stayed at a Hilton hotel and conference center a few weeks ago. It was about $110 for the room and it was smaller than most Disney rooms I've stayed at. Also it wasn't in the middle of a popular vacation destination and did not have theming. I think Disney is becoming a bit expensive, but I don't think the rooms are too small. I think most hotels build them with the idea that you won't spend much time in them any way.

 

[FrankLapidus]

I don't think the magic is dead by any means, but that a little work needs to be done to bring the resort back to the level it was at a few years ago. That's just my opinion and while I love WDW, I don't feel any sense of entitlement; I've been to WDW enough times now to know what I'm getting for my money and I'm still happy with that. That doesn't mean that there aren't areas of the resort that I feel could do with a change or need to be improved however.

 

[Tomi-Rocket]

. Well, instead of Disney being so quick to just take things away, why don't they have a CM monitor what guests are taking so it's not abused?????

Because people who take things like that for their family believe they have EVERY RIGHT to do so. If there's none left for someone else, too bad, they should've gotten there earlier. And people who behave this way have no problem whatsoever arguing or screaming about it till they get their way anyway and then it's not the system being abused but CM's.

I do wish things could be monitored, too, like taking pictures on a ride that specifically asks you not to or line jumpers. I wish people followed rules that are meant for everybody (like I do) not for the family or people in front or behind you.

It's unfortunate there are so many, many selfish and entitled people out there, they ruin a lot for others.

 

[FettFan]

A 5-day ticket with hopper & water parks costs $347 or $69.40/day. A 3-day ticket for WDW in 1983 costs (in inflation adjusted dollars) $80.51, or $26.84/day. Even taking into account park additions and adjusting for inflation, a day at WDW is now more than 2 1/2 times more expensive than it was in 1983.

Thanks for correcting me on Journey. That's what I get for using google.

As for the comparison of ticket prices, I think we will simply have to agree to disagree. While more expensive than the adjusted 1983 prices, WDW tickets are really not that bad given what you get out of them; a three-day hopper amounts to $100 a day, giving you access to any of the four parks at any time, which includes Disney transportation via monorail, bus or boat between them.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Thanks for correcting me on Journey. That's what I get for using google.

As for the comparison of ticket prices, I think we will simply have to agree to disagree. While more expensive than the adjusted 1983 prices, WDW tickets are really not that bad given what you get out of them; a three-day hopper amounts to $100 a day, giving you access to any of the four parks at any time, which includes Disney transportation via monorail, bus or boat between them.

But is there anyone who actually vists all 4 parks on the same day, every day? More than 2 is hard enough with WDW's transportation.

A 3-day "hopper" at Universal is $51/day online. Disneyland is $83/day. Tokyo Disney is $179 for a 3-day "Magic Passport". IMO, $100/day at WDW, is overpriced.

 

[Mrs Potato Head]

I see so many people talking about costs today vs 1983 but that was 30 years ago. Minimum wage was probably half what it is today. Prices change and we can't be angry at Disney for what it charges. I feel like it is what it is and if you don't feel the price justifies the experience then that is your opinion and you don't have to go. I happen to think that a trip is a fantasic deal compared to the memories we make. I too have never gotten a towel animal nor a room upgrade. And I haven't been to TSI in years. But I can tell you where I'll be every January - at WDW!

 

[FettFan]

But is there anyone who actually vists all 4 parks on the same day, every day? More than 2 is hard enough with WDW's transportation.

A 3-day "hopper" at Universal is $51/day online. Disneyland is $83/day. Tokyo Disney is $179 for a 3-day "Magic Passport". IMO, $100/day at WDW, is overpriced.

My family does. We generally only spend a whole day at the Magic Kingdom on our first day, then the rest of our vacation is spent hopping between parks as we see fit, and the last day we go through all four.
Last trip out, we went early to AK for Everest and Dinosaur, then hit Epcot for lunch (I took everyone's tickets over to Soarin' for FP. After we ate, we just walked over), and then closed the day at DHS for Fantasmic.


$100 a day works for us (actually $65 because we get the 5-day ticket) and we get the added bonus of being nowhere near Harry Potter.

And I also have to add that one of the the reasons Universal is much cheaper is that they have historically always lagged behind Disney in turnstile numbers....so much so that earlier this year, they have added a nighttime fireworks/projection waterscreen show in order to boost attendance.
If they keep adding like that, their ticket prices will eventually HAVE to be closer to WDWs in order to stay profitable.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

My family does.

Based on your description, you don't. I asked did anyone go to all 4 every day.