Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Nubs70]

There’s nothing wrong with preparing for the future but it 1) does nothing for the problem that exists now and 2) such preparations have to be maintained. The US had pandemic plans and they were allowed to languish and be ignored. A big part of any plan is going to be avoiding that big influx of patients in the first place, something many don’t want to hear or do.

One thing that can be done now is to ship patients to facilities with no capacity to facilities with capacity. For example, since Florida has open capacity, ship patients to Florida.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Okay, then let's just worry about now and not later.
Man, you have your foot set on one side and can't possibly even look out to the future can you. How can you argue the need to be better prepared for future pandemics?

This is an example of preparing for future infectious disease outbreaks.

‘This Is What Rush Was Built For’

www.rush.edu

Another article discussing more out of the box ways to prepare, not just building a new hospital:

Preparing Hospitals for the Next Pandemic

The Covid-19 epidemic response has shown that the U.S. is blessed with heroic physicians and other health care providers, researchers, and facilities. But it has also revealed a health care system that was woefully unprepared for the surge of pandemic patients. In the authors’ analysis, the...

hbr.org

I’m not against preparing, but I doubt the sincerity from those who openly oppose what those preparations will inevitably entail. It’s easy to say you’ll prepare than to actually prepare and act on those preparations, which is exactly what happened.

 

[Heppenheimer]

One thing that can be done now is to ship patients to facilities with no capacity to facilities with capacity. For example, since Florida has open capacity, ship patients to Florida.

Long distance medevacs are neither cheap nor logistically easy. Only the military really has an efficient system for this, and their infrastructure is more geared towards getting injured sick and injured soldiers first to Landstuhl, Germany, then back to a few designated medical centers in the US. It works when you have a few large hubs that are directly connected to each other and you gain from efficiencies of scale, but this system wouldn't work for point-to-point long distance transportation within the US.

 

[lazyboy97o]

One thing that can be done now is to ship patients to facilities with no capacity to facilities with capacity. For example, since Florida has open capacity, ship patients to Florida.

Moving people is not something undertaken lightly when it is to the hospital down the street. Even more so for patients in intensive care. You also assume Florida has no backlog or will not need that capacity in the future.

 

[DisneyCane]

Paying $250US dollars a month as RN in the Phillipines? No brainer wanting to work in USA.

That goes a lot further in the Philippines then in the US. I mean you couldn't possibly live on that in the US without all kinds of government assistance.

 

[Andrew C]

Flying back to the USA requires an antigen test which is in the $80 CAD range and can be done at the airport. Unless I'm mistaken.

Honestly, at this point I was there was a way to incorporate the costs of these tests into airline tickets and have them available close to at cost.

I know flying is an optional activity, but it's a pricey addition especially for families.

Correct, it doesn't have to be a PCR test. We've got at home antigen tests to do the evening before we fly from the UK to the US which are accepted, they just have to be observed via a telehealth consultation. Then if it's a negative test we'll get a verified result and fit to fly certificate within 3 hours. They cost us £27 each, which is about $36.

Ahh. Thanks for this. I didn’t know it could be a different test type. This should make things a bit easier for us when we travel back to the US.

 

[Heppenheimer]

I'm not sure if it's been brought up, but I was surprised that a negative test result is not required for people entering the US from Canada or Mexico by land. Only proof of full vaccination.

 

[hopemax]

Aren't those RNs needed in their home county as well?

Certainly in this new reality where Covid sucks up health care resources forever. The effect of a worldwide shortage of qualified doctors, nurses and facilities will be devastating for countries that already have inadequate resources. People think the vaccination distribution inequity was a geopolitical problem, try lack of everything healthcare if the US plan for itself is to simply import what they need, including the people, as we do for everything else.

Like I’ve been saying this whole time, we’re choosing the path that is more costly and leads to more suffering than people can imagine. But the realization won’t be there until after the bills come in.

 

[hopemax]

I'm not sure if it's been brought up, but I was surprised that a negative test result is not required for people entering the US from Canada or Mexico by land. Only proof of full vaccination.

There is a post on the DIS of a Canadian family whose daughter tested positive before flying home from WDW. They rented a car since they could no longer fly home. But had no problem crossing the border going the other way after they declared the positive test result. They were allowed to continue driving home. This family was careful, but any contact for food, gas, hotel is not a full quarantine and the next family might not be so mindful. This would certainly not fly in countries with mandatory quarantine for any arrivals.

 

[Lilofan]

That goes a lot further in the Philippines then in the US. I mean you couldn't possibly live on that in the US without all kinds of government assistance.

It is not difficult to figure out why foreign nurses want to work and do work in the USA earning US wages, sending back home money Western Union to support family. Some nurses we know live in a 1 bed room apt with (5) living there working different shifts.

 

[DisneyCane]

I'm not sure if it's been brought up, but I was surprised that a negative test result is not required for people entering the US from Canada or Mexico by land. Only proof of full vaccination.

One of the many contradictions of this whole thing. Even if you are double vaccinated and boosted you should be wearing a mask because you can still be infected and spread the virus but if you are entering the country (at least legally) all we care about is that you are vaccinated.

Of course, testing wouldn't be anywhere near perfect either because people can be infected but not be at the point yet where they test positive.

 

[Ayla]

By starting the process of adding to Healthcare facilities. Increasing available seats in nursing programs. I hope you do realize that there is a severe shortage of available seats in nursing schools. By which, to be accepted Into nursing school, one needs to have a better GPA than one needs to get into med school.

There is no reason to add additional capacity if there is no one to fill it. Nursing shortages have been going on for years and Covid has only made it worse (my sister is an ID BSN RN and my Mother is a retired MSN).

 

[MisterPenguin]

Rather than implement plans for more health care workers that won't come to fruition for the next three or four years from now, there is a simpler and quicker solution: vaccine mandates.

 

[correcaminos]

One of the many contradictions of this whole thing. Even if you are double vaccinated and boosted you should be wearing a mask because you can still be infected and spread the virus but if you are entering the country (at least legally) all we care about is that you are vaccinated.

Of course, testing wouldn't be anywhere near perfect either because people can be infected but not be at the point yet where they test positive.

Because risks for spread are lower for vaccinated and by driving you are not risking others as much.

I'm very much in favor of treating vaccinated completely different than unvaccinated

Rather than implement plans for more health care workers that won't come to fruition for the next three or four years from now, there is a simpler and quicker solution: vaccine mandates.

Every day that passes I get closer to pushing for them. Though I am seeing an increase in vaccinations in my state but not sure if it is kids or not. Adults suck. I'm working with a group of parents to run religious ed for our kids only next fall. Mostly because the new head is a total anti-vaxxer who goes against Pope teachings. Don't want unmasked unvaxxed near my kid or others tbh and I don't want the head going against Pope either. What else will they go against? I opted not to have them teach this year for other reasons and I'm glad for it.

 

[Andrew C]

Just got the moderna boost at CVS. Pharmacist told me to hang out for 5 minutes before leaving.

 

[networkpro]

Just got the boost at CVS. Pharmacist told me to hang out for 5 minutes before leaving.

I got mine at Walgreens last Wednesday... they told me I could leave right away. Moderna x3

 

[Heppenheimer]

One of the many contradictions of this whole thing. Even if you are double vaccinated and boosted you should be wearing a mask because you can still be infected and spread the virus but if you are entering the country (at least legally) all we care about is that you are vaccinated.

Of course, testing wouldn't be anywhere near perfect either because people can be infected but not be at the point yet where they test positive.

As I posted earlier, I think the rules are more about not overtaxing US healthcare capacity rather than trying to keep the virus out. At this point, anything brought into the country from abroad is really a tiny drop in the larger ocean of circulating domestic virus. But at least if a foreign visitor is fully vaccinated, their chances of ending up in a US hospital drops substantially. The logistics, man-hours and cost of treating, discharging and setting up follow up care for a foreigner without travel insurance can be a nightmare if they end up in a US hospital. Maybe not so bad for something simple, like a broken leg, but for a prolonged illness like COVID, those patients will consume a disproportionate amount of already strained human resources.

 

[correcaminos]

IMF chief says Omicron could dent global economic growth

The International Monetary Fund is likely to lower its global economic growth estimates due to the new Omicron variant of the coronavirus, the global lender's chief said at the Reuters Next conference on Friday in another sign of the turmoil unleashed by the ever-changing pandemic.

www.reuters.com

Why vaccination here has become such a sticking point bugs me. I think at this point all should push for this vs other means at this time. Protect those who cannot and help reduce spread. I know the US does share vaccines with other countries so push here and help elsewhere.

 

[Nubs70]

There is no reason to add additional capacity if there is no one to fill it. Nursing shortages have been going on for years and Covid has only made it worse (my sister is an ID BSN RN and my Mother is a retired MSN).

Nursing shortages are a product of the accreditation process. Preceptors need to be Masters prepared to teach. My wife is an RN BSN who was a preceptor in addition to frontline nursing until the Masters prepared mandate was enforced. So an RN BSN with 25 years experience in ER, PACU, PICU, etc was deemed "not educated enough" to teach. She started to go for an MSN but realized that the investment in money and time with no increase in pay was not economically justified. If advance education was on the table then it was going to be an NP as there is an actual increase in pay.

Now your nursing preceptors are Masters prepared with no clinical experience as opposed to RN BSN with 25 years experience in many aspects of nursing. Who is going to provide the best practical education?

Additionally, to be accepted into a RN BSN program, you need to have a higher grade point than to takes to get into Med School. If you have the GPA to get into a RN BSN program and sufficient MCAT to get into Med School, which path are you going to choose?

Finally, in Appeal to Authority, my wife is RN BSN, my mother is RN BSN, my father is MD Anethesiology Northwestern University.

 

[dreday3]

Rather than implement plans for more health care workers that won't come to fruition for the next three or four years from now, there is a simpler and quicker solution: vaccine mandates.

I just have to ask - Why can't we do both? Why can't we continue the vaccine push for now, but also work on future ideas/plans for the upcoming pandemics?
It may end unfortunately up a political issue but the ideas don't have to start as one.

(also it's not just limited to building more hospitals or hiring more people - there are a lot of exiting new approaches to patient care that can be utilized in pandemic planning - just for example - telehealth has EXPLODED this past year, in part due to waivers for what's allowed to be considered telehealth granted by CMS for duration of pandemic - but providers already working on how to make some of those waivers permanent policy. An interesting read: https://healthtechmagazine.net/article/2021/10/hospital-home-future-healthcare )