Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[ImperfectPixie]

Do they not have contact tracing? When our school district has a case, they identify close contacts and have them test and quarantine. They only had to close the schools for one day because a case came up late at night before they had time to complete the contact tracing, and they did remote learning for the week after Thanksgiving because of high community (non-school) spread. Other than that, they've been full time in person since September 1.

Yes, they do. They haven't closed once because of positive cases (even when transmission was known to be in school), but there have been students and employees quarantined off and on all year.

 

[Kevin_W]

Why wouldn't Bloomberg match CDC?

I'd guess CDC has a bit of lag in their data. Throughout the pandemic, their website has (sadly) been less useful than many others from university and news media.

 

[Chi84]

Sitting at an outdoor restaurant in Orlando right now. There’s two middle age ladies talking quite loud next to me. One of them seemed to have gotten the vaccine but got it begrudgingly. The other seems like an anti vaxxer saying “get it or don’t” etc etc.

First one claimed to have “Charlie horses” and “feels like she lost taste” since getting the vaccine. I’ve not heard of any of these as a side effect.
Second person shakes her head and literally says “I would rather die to covid than lose taste for life.”

These are the people I’m concerned about. Not only did one make up seemingly new side effects, but now she’s telling her friend that needed no extra convincing to not get it.

I ventured into a Macy's yesterday and overheard a woman say something like "Those vaccines don't work. Why do you think all you hear about is people getting COVID after being vaccinated." I just checked my local news this morning and found an article about the "shock" of getting COVID after being vaccinated - it gave numbers on how many people (tens of thousands) got sick in the two weeks after getting the second shot. If you read all the way to the end, it does say that the numbers were from a time when people were not considered fully vaccinated and that the vaccines become more effective over time. The media is doing all it can to create drama - I wish our leaders would start getting serious about clearing up the misperceptions they cause.

 

[GoofGoof]

I ventured into a Macy's yesterday and overheard a woman say something like "Those vaccines don't work. Why do you think all you hear about is people getting COVID after being vaccinated." I just checked my local news this morning and found an article about the "shock" of getting COVID after being vaccinated - it gave numbers on how many people (tens of thousands) got sick in the two weeks after getting the second shot. If you read all the way to the end, it does say that the numbers were from a time when people were not considered fully vaccinated and that the vaccines become more effective over time. The media is doing all it can to create drama - I wish our leaders would start getting serious about clearing up the misperceptions they cause.

Sadly I think some people just don’t want to get it so they look for any reason to justify that and show they know more than the masses. I have a friend who has switched reasons why they won’t get the vaccine. At first they said they weren’t getting it because there were old and sick people who needed it more, then once vaccines became more available they switched to the narrative that they were not worried about getting sick themselves and they would get the vaccine if it actually prevented you from spreading covid to others. Then studies came out showing that the vaccines are highly effective in preventing spread. Then the story I got is they aren’t getting the vaccine because they have high blood pressure and are worried about a reaction. To that I asked if they talked to their doctor because I hadn’t heard there was any higher risk with vaccines if you have high blood pressure. I‘m sure now they are focused on JnJ and blood clots. The fact of the matter is some people just won’t get vaccinated unless they are somehow forced to.

 

[mmascari]

They literally just dumped all our kids together in school full-time in person starting 2 weeks ago...right before vaccines are about to be approved for 12-15yo kids. Hybrid is completely off the table at this point. With teenagers and after school hang-outs being a big driver of new cases in our town, I really wish they'd been allowed to wait for the vaccines to be approved. (My oldest is 15)

MA required full return for all students statewide.. it could be interesting...

Are they doing any mitigations at all? Any distance or masking, extra ventilation, air cleaners, anything to make it safer at all? How "just dumped" is it?

For us, they're barely back in school at all. Just 50% and only every other week. That's 25% of kids in school any week. They still close the school on Wednesday to "deep clean", and there is still to much surface worry and not enough ventilation focus. The high school is switching classes, but even so kids may end up in a room without the teacher who's remote. It's a simultaneous model, one teacher for both in the room and remote. In the middle school, its even worse. They mostly don't switch rooms at all. So, across 4 classes in a day, the teacher in the room may be for 1 of them. All the kids aren't even in the same class at the same time. They're all on zoom from the room to wherever. When it is the teacher in the room, they have to mute the zoom to prevent echo and then cannot hear any classmates from zoom. They switch for gym, and then do zoom class with the remote people. They switch for band half the time, but don't really play, for obvious exhalation reasons. Apparently, they cannot move the band outside to create enough distance for "reasons". Yesterday's school board meeting it became obvious that we're lucky for even this horrible disaster. Somehow being almost last to return we cannot learn from anyone else and it's not possible to do any better. That they didn't make any progress for the last 9 months on returning because all the focus was on remote support. One of my kids middle school friends has health instead of gym this quarter and isn't in band, they switched back to full remote because the in building was so much worse with quite literally no extra value for the effort.

There has to be some middle ground. Something in between "just go back and pretend it's all fine" and "returning is so bad, you'll want to stay remote".

 

[Chi84]

Sadly I think some people just don’t want to get it so they look for any reason to justify that and show they know more than the masses. I have a friend who has switched reasons why they won’t get the vaccine. At first they said they weren’t getting it because there were old and sick people who needed it more, then once vaccines became more available they switched to the narrative that they were not worried about getting sick themselves and they would get the vaccine if it actually prevented you from spreading covid to others. Then studies came out showing that the vaccines are highly effective in preventing spread. Then the story I got is they aren’t getting the vaccine because they have high blood pressure and are worried about a reaction. To that I asked if they talked to their doctor because I hadn’t heard there was any higher risk with vaccines if you have high blood pressure. I‘m sure now they are focused on JnJ and blood clots. The fact of the matter is some people just won’t get vaccinated unless they are somehow forced to.

That makes sense. It would explain the phenomenon of how only 74 people out of the 75 million fully vaccinated died - yet every second poster on the internet (not specifically here) knew one of them.

 

[mmascari]

The media is doing all it can to create drama - I wish our leaders would start getting serious about clearing up the misperceptions they cause.

I started to follow some media critique accounts on Twitter. Accounts that consistently point out how horrible headlines and media tweets are. How they so frequently ignore the context and reflect the opposite of the story. With those details buried 3+ paragraphs deep in the story that completely change the story. The NY Time is one of the worst, especially when it's supposed to have a better standard, but they're all bad.

It's made me look at news headlines and tweets very differently. Enough so, that I see almost all of them as horrible and feel a constant failure by our media reporting.

 

[Figgy1]

I started to follow some media critique accounts on Twitter. Accounts that consistently point out how horrible headlines and media tweets are. How they so frequently ignore the context and reflect the opposite of the story. With those details buried 3+ paragraphs deep in the story that completely change the story. The NY Time is one of the worst, especially when it's supposed to have a better standard, but they're all bad.

It's made me look at news headlines and tweets very differently. Enough so, that I see almost all of them as horrible and feel a constant failure by our media reporting.

TV has been a bit better because they usually have a medical expert on to explain the percentages

 

[Tony the Tigger]

What if a person gets vaccinated and then refuses to wear a mask? What category does that put them in, wants it to go away or not?

Unwise.

 

[Figgy1]

Unwise.

Uncaring

 

[Chi84]

The people who are still closely following the masking rules aren't the majority of ones hesitant to get the vaccine.

I have no complaint with vaccine incentives. I only objected to a specific bit of nonsense the anti-maskers have been pushing lately. "Get a vaccine and stop wearing a mask" is simply a way of dropping mask mandates altogether.

I think any ACTUAL incentives to get the vaccine (that aren't a shadow way of dropping Covid mitigations earlier than necessary) are a good thing, and I encourage them. Knock yourself out, Budweiser and Krispy Kreme!

I'm glad you clarified that. Because if those who won't get vaccinated aren't wearing masks anyway, then the only ones masking up are the vaccinated or soon-to-be vaccinated. If that's the case, the mask rules should be ended as soon as the latter group gets their shot at the shot. The others will take their own path to herd immunity.

 

[GoofGoof]

The people who are still closely following the masking rules aren't the majority of ones hesitant to get the vaccine.

I have no complaint with vaccine incentives. I only objected to a specific bit of nonsense the anti-maskers have been pushing lately. "Get a vaccine and stop wearing a mask" is simply a way of dropping mask mandates altogether.

I think any ACTUAL incentives to get the vaccine (that aren't a shadow way of dropping Covid mitigations earlier than necessary) are a good thing, and I encourage them. Knock yourself out, Budweiser and Krispy Kreme!

It’s possible that in private setting that are more easily enforceable a no mask needed if you are vaccinated plan will work. Not right now while community spread is still too high and not enough are vaccinated but in a few months it should be possible. I posted this a while back, but still relevant. I work in an office environment where anyone who goes in to the office needs to wear a mask. Once we have reached a point where anyone who wants a vaccine has gotten one and community spread has come down but not enough to get rid of masks altogether, the company could make the policy that everyone still needs to wear a mask to work but if you are vaccinated you can get an exemption. That exemption requires you to share proof of vaccination with the company. If you chose to not get vaccinated or chose to not share your vaccine status that’s your right but you get no exemption from mask wearing. This could apply to places of work or schools, really anywhere with a structured system and rules that are enforced.

If that was the policy I would expect close to 90% of employees would get the vaccine. My company did a recent employee poll and around 70% said they already had or were going to get the vaccine another 15% said they would not get it no matter what and 15% said they would get it if it was required by work. I’m not in favor of flat out requiring it yet due to EUA, but a mask exemption could be a way to strongly encourage vaccination without requiring it. In public settings like a grocery store or a theme park it’s logistically challenging to establish someone’s vaccine status but much easier in a private setting.

 

[GoofGoof]

That makes sense. It would explain the phenomenon of how only 74 people out of the 75 million fully vaccinated died - yet every second poster on the internet (not specifically here) knew one of them.

Just like how almost everyone in the Covid denier crowd personally knows someone who died from something other than Covid but the doctors put Covid on the death certificate anyway.

I'm glad you clarified that. Because if those who won't get vaccinated aren't wearing masks anyway, then the only ones masking up are the vaccinated or soon-to-be vaccinated. If that's the case, the mask rules should be ended as soon as the latter group gets their shot at the shot. The others will take their own path to herd immunity.

This actually makes a lot of sense. I’d prefer that we just get enough people vaccinated so cases drop and masks become unnecessary for all but at some point if that doesn‘t happen even if we try to keep covid protocols around the only ones likely to be following them will be people already vaccinated which isn’t really helping very much.

 

[sullyinMT]

Are they doing any mitigations at all? Any distance or masking, extra ventilation, air cleaners, anything to make it safer at all? How "just dumped" is it?

For us, they're barely back in school at all. Just 50% and only every other week. That's 25% of kids in school any week. They still close the school on Wednesday to "deep clean", and there is still to much surface worry and not enough ventilation focus. The high school is switching classes, but even so kids may end up in a room without the teacher who's remote. It's a simultaneous model, one teacher for both in the room and remote. In the middle school, its even worse. They mostly don't switch rooms at all. So, across 4 classes in a day, the teacher in the room may be for 1 of them. All the kids aren't even in the same class at the same time. They're all on zoom from the room to wherever. When it is the teacher in the room, they have to mute the zoom to prevent echo and then cannot hear any classmates from zoom. They switch for gym, and then do zoom class with the remote people. They switch for band half the time, but don't really play, for obvious exhalation reasons. Apparently, they cannot move the band outside to create enough distance for "reasons". Yesterday's school board meeting it became obvious that we're lucky for even this horrible disaster. Somehow being almost last to return we cannot learn from anyone else and it's not possible to do any better. That they didn't make any progress for the last 9 months on returning because all the focus was on remote support. One of my kids middle school friends has health instead of gym this quarter and isn't in band, they switched back to full remote because the in building was so much worse with quite literally no extra value for the effort.

There has to be some middle ground. Something in between "just go back and pretend it's all fine" and "returning is so bad, you'll want to stay remote".

Yeesh. Roughly 2/3 of our students elected for in-school learning from day 1. Teachers were thrilled to be back in class from the ones I spoke with; of course they had plenty of volunteers in the ranks to provide remote instruction, as well.

My oldest is in orchestra, so no worries for masks with strings. Friends in band actually wear masks when their section isn’t practicing, and there are bell guards that effectively work as masks for the instrument. Flutes have a spit shield of sorts that look like plexiglass dividers on the in flute itself. Of course it isn’t perfect, but I’m proud of the effort to provide some level of instruction to those kids.

Block scheduling has helped with contact tracing, but most of the spread has been shown to occur with sports and non-school gatherings.

Elementary schools have it easier. One classroom that also doubles as their cafeteria. Art moved to the gymnasium, and the general music room is pretty large. They did ukelele this year instead of recorder, which was an unintended benefit to every parent in the city .

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Why wouldn't Bloomberg match CDC?

View attachment 551188

bloomberg has always prided itself on its own data collection and modeling...

can’t argue with a guy worth $75 billion much either

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

That makes sense. It would explain the phenomenon of how only 74 people out of the 75 million fully vaccinated died - yet every second poster on the internet (not specifically here) knew one of them.

I’m not sure how you want it?

you don’t want the media to sensationalize...which I agree

but you’ve also said for a year that the general public can’t be “expected” to be patient, wait for things and expected to follow mandates.

so does everyone need to act like intelligent adults or not?

edit: I quoted the wrong post...you said something about media sensationalization?

 

[Disorbust]

Most hospitals require the FLu vac. If you can't get it, ie your allergic, you are required to wear mask the entire flu season. If I were king this would be my requirement.

FYI: My co-worlers and I have been fully Vacs since Early March. Two who are young, healthy and skinny, got COVID and were knocked on their butts for 2 weeks.

 

[sullyinMT]

It’s possible that in private setting that are more easily enforceable a no mask needed if you are vaccinated plan will work. Not right now while community spread is still too high and not enough are vaccinated but in a few months it should be possible. I posted this a while back, but still relevant. I work in an office environment where anyone who goes in to the office needs to wear a mask. Once we have reached a point where anyone who wants a vaccine has gotten one and community spread has come down but not enough to get rid of masks altogether, the company could make the policy that everyone still needs to wear a mask to work but if you are vaccinated you can get an exemption. That exemption requires you to share proof of vaccination with the company. If you chose to not get vaccinated or chose to not share your vaccine status that’s your right but you get no exemption from mask wearing. This could apply to places of work or schools, really anywhere with a structured system and rules that are enforced.

If that was the policy I would expect close to 90% of employees would get the vaccine. My company did a recent employee poll and around 70% said they already had or were going to get the vaccine another 15% said they would not get it no matter what and 15% said they would get it if it was required by work. I’m not in favor of flat out requiring it yet due to EUA, but a mask exemption could be a way to strongly encourage vaccination without requiring it. In public settings like a grocery store or a theme park it’s logistically challenging to establish someone’s vaccine status but much easier in a private setting.

My wife starts work travel in 3 weeks. She was required to show her vaccine status before the home office would approve her expenses (no problem as she was vaccinated before they even made the announcement). The home office in Frankfort, KY, reopens May 1 and is requiring vaccines to get in the door. Employees have until the 17th to report to the office. No word on if they’ll have a mask free, fully vaccinated, environment, but I’m sure that wouldn’t be far behind if the daily office employees felt it was safe to do so.

 

[danlb_2000]

Sadly I think some people just don’t want to get it so they look for any reason to justify that and show they know more than the masses. I have a friend who has switched reasons why they won’t get the vaccine. At first they said they weren’t getting it because there were old and sick people who needed it more, then once vaccines became more available they switched to the narrative that they were not worried about getting sick themselves and they would get the vaccine if it actually prevented you from spreading covid to others. Then studies came out showing that the vaccines are highly effective in preventing spread. Then the story I got is they aren’t getting the vaccine because they have high blood pressure and are worried about a reaction. To that I asked if they talked to their doctor because I hadn’t heard there was any higher risk with vaccines if you have high blood pressure. I‘m sure now they are focused on JnJ and blood clots. The fact of the matter is some people just won’t get vaccinated unless they are somehow forced to.

Once the vaccines get full approval from the FDA, a lot of people will have to come up with a new excuse to replace that one.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Most hospitals require the FLu vac. If you can't get it, ie your allergic, you are required to wear mask the entire flu season. If I were king this would be my requirement.

FYI: My co-worlers and I have been fully Vacs since Early March. Two who are young, healthy and skinny, got COVID and were knocked on their butts for 2 weeks.

because all the “hoax” talk was BS

And all the “it only affects old people” was BS

and now the “kids aren’t at risk” and “we’ve all probably already had it and are immune” stuff is crap.

And yet...we’re still getting spin from people round these parts that have backed those things...for this Unending round Robin