Changes in the last 2 years that burn your britches

UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
Chef Mickey said:
Riviera is awful? Gran Destino?

I’m not saying any of them are the Ritz...they aren’t, but awful? The EPCOT resorts are too convenient to be awful, although they all need refurbs.
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I haven't really seen much of Gran Destino, but yes, the Riviera is pretty awful.

It looks like any number of random generic mid to high level (not luxury) hotels; there are very similar looking hotels scattered around Atlanta. I'm not looking for a generic box tower when I'm at Disney.

The EPCOT resorts are not awful. They do need some work, but they're much much better than the Riviera. The Riviera is the last place I'd want to stay on Disney property outside of the value resorts.
 
MisterPenguin

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
ParkerLoLs said:
Is Disney different from the days of yore? Absolutely. We could all list hundreds of changes since our earliest visits. Thankfully, dear Martin gives us brilliant looks into the wonders of the past.

But focusing on just the last two years, I’ve seen changes that have repeatedly thrown my heart against the wall. Just the last 2 years. Yes there are changes all the time. WDW isn’t a museum. But I wanted to put all of my concerns in one place (asked and answered). I’m including presumably COVID-related things that I assume were on their last legs anyway:
  1. Illuminations: Reflections of Earth
  2. The Fountain of Nations
  3. The Harmonious barges destroying both the serenity of World Showcase and my views across the lagoon
  4. Impressions de France dwindling almost down to nothing
  5. Beauty and the Beast: LeFou’s Catastrophe
  6. Loss of the Great Movie Ride
  7. Gain of Minnie and Mickey’s Screen Spectacular
  8. The coming loss of Magical Express
  9. The coming loss of Splash Mountain for a ride that makes absolutely no sense in Frontierland (give me a better option and I MIGHT change my mind but pls don’t turn this into another thread about it)
  10. The removal of Extra Magic Hours
  11. The Riviera Marriott
  12. PRICES exponential for any recent era
  13. A lot of Galaxy’s Edge though I don’t miss the echoes of the decaying Backlot Tour
  14. Loss of Great Moments in History
  15. Rise of the Resistance’s operational nightmare
  16. THE PINK CASTLE
  17. DVC taking up more and more oxygen in the Disney machine
  18. The proliferation of Epcot festivals - more present than ever for longer and longer periods
  19. The Gran Destino Hyatt
  20. The Halloween Party beginning in August
  21. Club Cool
  22. The PeopleMover and its tenuous future
  23. The hopefully discarded joke of the Reflections Resident Inn (including this because god knows it could return)
  24. The loss of the lights on Cinderella Castle
  25. After hours holiday parties during after hours holiday parties
  26. The Electric Umbrella
  27. The ridiculous new “lands” arrangement at EPCOT
  28. Special limited-edition treats and the influencers who hock them
  29. The disrespect toward the Gran Fiesta Tour animatronics (they’re relics, yes, but deserve better)
  30. Muppets in Epcot (love them dearly but not in World Showcase)
  31. eBay reseller “entrepreneurs” who have gone more hardcore in the last 2 years than I have ever seen prior
  32. More and more YouTube streamers making the resort their soundstage
  33. The plight of Morocco
  34. If Finding Nemo: The Musical is truly gone forever
  35. MouseGear
  36. The FountainView
  37. The blight of the Skyliner mucking up the... sky
  38. Disney Springs and its continued banality
  39. GOTG Box
  40. Tron Box
But ask me how I really feel?
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Not going to say you don't have some valid critiques, but............

1. I:RoE was past due. It had issues. Not sure Harmonious is the answer.

2. FoN created a pinch point and had maintenance issues. It is being replaced by a brand new show fountain in the Hub.

7. MMRR: Haven't ridden it yet. But looks good to me. Don't know how anyone can call it a catastrophe.

17. I don't use DVC. I've never felt it encroaching in any way of my enjoyment of WDW. How has the existence of DVC negatively affected you?

18. The holiday festival is just a handful of booths added to the usual holiday trappings, and nothing much more to write home about. The Arts Festival was a great add. Best Festival, IMO.

19. Gran Destino is fine. Don't know how it can be labeled as ruinous. Now, the Riviera... yuck.

21., 22., 24., 26., 35., 36. Club Cool, PeopleMover, EU, Castle D-Lights, FountainView, MouseGear are all coming back.
​
And furthermore... you're complaining about missing EU and MouseGear, and a Starbucks, and a Coke advertising gimmick? Your taste level leaves a lot to be desired.​
​
29. What disrespect for Gran Fiesta?

32. How have vloggers negatively impacted you?

33. Morocco's plight was caused by a pandemic, not some sort of malaise on the part of Disney.

37. I like the look of the Skyliner.
 
NickMaio

NickMaio

Well-Known Member
macefamily said:
When DisneyQuest was replaced with the NBA Experience. DisneyQuest needed a makeover; not a shutdown. When we walk by the new NBA place there's more workers than customers. DisneyQuest was a great escape for adults and kids.
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Yes it was.
Quest was a fun place to spend a few hours.
 
Parker in NYC

Parker in NYC

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
MisterPenguin said:
Not going to say you don't have some valid critiques, but............

1. I:RoE was past due. It had issues. Not sure Harmonious is the answer.

2. FoN created a pinch point and had maintenance issues. It is being replaced by a brand new show fountain in the Hub.

7. MMRR: Haven't ridden it yet. But looks good to me. Don't know how anyone can call it a catastrophe.

17. I don't use DVC. I've never felt it encroaching in any way of my enjoyment of WDW. How has the existence of DVC negatively affected you?

18. The holiday festival is just a handful of booths added to the usual holiday trappings, and nothing much more to write home about. The Arts Festival was a great add. Best Festival, IMO.

19. Gran Destino is fine. Don't know how it can be labeled as ruinous. Now, the Riviera... yuck.

21., 22., 24., 26., 35., 36. Club Cool, PeopleMover, EU, Castle D-Lights, FountainView, MouseGear are all coming back.
​
And furthermore... you're complaining about missing EU and MouseGear, and a Starbucks, and a Coke advertising gimmick? Your taste level leaves a lot to be desired.​
​
29. What disrespect for Gran Fiesta?

32. How have vloggers negatively impacted you?

33. Morocco's plight was caused by a pandemic, not some sort of malaise on the part of Disney.

37. I like the look of the Skyliner.
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Oh, my taste level is very questionable. That is clearly one of my many shortcomings (I occasionally order Domino’s for their thin crust pepperoni IN NYC! Can you imagine?). All credibility out the window. With that out the way, I’ll comment on your comments.

This list isn’t the most scientific and I completely agree with most of what you’ve said. The heart wants what it wants and I can’t really control that but I can go into WDW therapy and make the best of it. I was just so hyper-aware of so many changes in such a short period of time. Maybe compounded by our current state of the world where I’ve been looking for constants, I couldn’t even look to Disney for... succor. Suckers, perhaps. Again, that’s on me.

I really don’t have any fundamental explanations for my sadness over a Starbucks, though I did love buying a cupcake and sitting by the fountain for a lovely afternoon break. I did enjoy walking around the park without streamers broadcasting their totally respectable career choices (no sarcasm there whatsoever). I do miss little things like going into Club Cool and watching unsuspecting folks try Beverly. Though my friends had to be THOSE people who found it absolutely delicious. Ok, I did too. But I’m an arrogant “pair of docks.”

Those are completely arbitrary to you and probably to most but it’s just so much change is such a short period of time. They may be the least of my gripes but all together, it’s a lot with which to make peace.

Also, I really respect you MisterPenguin and humbly ask for a mea culpa for my current state of mind.
 
JohnD

JohnD

Well-Known Member
Chef Mickey said:
Riviera is awful? Gran Destino?

I’m not saying any of them are the Ritz...they aren’t, but awful? The EPCOT resorts are too convenient to be awful, although they all need refurbs.
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I think the point is there is basically no theming. They could be any hotel anywhere.
 
MisterPenguin

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
ParkerLoLs said:
I occasionally order Domino’s for their thin crust pepperoni IN NYC!
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Chef Mickey

Chef Mickey

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
I haven't really seen much of Gran Destino, but yes, the Riviera is pretty awful.

It looks like any number of random generic mid to high level (not luxury) hotels; there are very similar looking hotels scattered around Atlanta. I'm not looking for a generic box tower when I'm at Disney.

The EPCOT resorts are not awful. They do need some work, but they're much much better than the Riviera. The Riviera is the last place I'd want to stay on Disney property outside of the value resorts.
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Have you stayed at Riviera? Again, you can’t compare Atlanta to on property at Disney.

None of the resorts at Disney are good enough to be THE destination, but Riviera on Disney property, with Skyliner, Disney Transport, Disney service, in the bubble, etc make it significantly better than some random resort in Atlanta Or Orlando.

Disney doesn’t have the Ritz, but I’d rather stay there than a random Ritz in a nice city. It’s the whole package and Disney hotels are more than adequate...not awful. I’ve stayed at 5 star resorts all over the world...all of them have some issues.
 
Chef Mickey

Chef Mickey

Well-Known Member
JohnD said:
I think the point is there is basically no theming. They could be any hotel anywhere.
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Yet they aren’t...you’re still getting tons of Disney benefits without the characters plastered everywhere. They have resorts with more Disney theming if that’s your thing.
 
UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
Chef Mickey said:
Have you stayed at Riviera? Again, you can’t compare Atlanta to on property at Disney.

None of the resorts at Disney are good enough to be THE destination, but Riviera on Disney property, with Skyliner, Disney Transport, Disney service, in the bubble, etc make it significantly better than some random resort in Atlanta Or Orlando.

Disney doesn’t have the Ritz, but I’d rather stay there than a random Ritz in a nice city. It’s the whole package and Disney hotels are more than adequate...not awful. I’ve stayed at 5 star resorts all over the world...all of them have some issues.
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Why would I want to? There's absolutely nothing about it that makes me want to stay there.

I think you missed the point -- the issue with the Riviera is that it's generic, hence the comparison to a hotel in Atlanta. Yes, there are Disney transportation options, but those options also exist at every other Disney resort (other than the Skyliner, which I do not like and thus is not a selling point for me). Again, as I said, it is easily the least appealing Disney resort outside of the values.

Other Disney hotels are fine. It's the Riviera specifically that is bad because of how generic it is.
 
Chef Mickey

Chef Mickey

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
That's not what theming is. Plastering Disney characters on stuff isn't theming. The Animal Kingdom Lodge has theming; the Riviera doesn't.
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I’ve stayed at both. AKL is significantly worse, preference in theming aside. “No theming” at Riviera is unfair and is more perhaps not your taste.

AKL has several issues, for me.
  • Not ideal location
  • Too dark, everywhere
  • No transportation options besides bus
  • Lacking in decor and finishes aren’t as nice
  • Not nearly as clean as Riviera
You started by calling Disney hotels awful. Now you say they are fine and really just don’t like Riviera. That’s fine, but I challenged your general “awful” claim more than I’m challenging your Riviera claim, although I think you’re wrong on that too.
 
JohnD

JohnD

Well-Known Member
Chef Mickey said:
Yet they aren’t...you’re still getting tons of Disney benefits without the characters plastered everywhere. They have resorts with more Disney theming if that’s your thing.
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The benefits are fine. It’s just that the recent trend has been generic hotels, hence the reference to Riveria Marriott and Grand Destino Hyatt. I would also add Dolphin and Swan Hilton expansion.
 
Little Green Men

Little Green Men

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
Why would I want to? There's absolutely nothing about it that makes me want to stay there. I think you missed the point -- the issue with the Riviera is that it's generic, hence the comparison to a hotel in Atlanta. Yes, there are Disney transportation options, but those options also exist at every other Disney resort (other than the Skyliner, which I do not like and thus is not a selling point for me). Again, as I said, it is easily the least appealing Disney resort outside of the values.
Other Disney hotels are fine. It's the Riviera specifically that is bad because of how generic it is.
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As someone who stayed at the Riveria it was perfectly Disney. I stayed at The Beach a club first and thought the Riviera was better personally. The food options were phenomenal, the views were amazing, we had a one bedroom villa and it was beautiful. No less themed than Kidani Village or Bay Lake Tower either. The skyliner access is very convenient. Could the exterior be themed a bit more? Sure, but it’s no worse than BLT
 

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