Bay Lake Tower - Top of the World Lounge

[biggy H]

Comsidering you need an actual physical card issued by DVC and not a paper print out or a digital one to gain access then how can a member who has only bought resale (not those with grandfathered rights) be able to gain access to TLotW?
And has been stated several times access is a membership perk which resale are not entitled to..

 

[JaxFLBear]

Comsidering you need an actual physical card issued by DVC and not a paper print out or a digital one to gain access then how can a member who has only bought resale (not those with grandfathered rights) be able to gain access to TLotW?
And has been stated several times access is a membership perk which resale are not entitled to..

Digital card is acceptable for TOTWL access. AND RESALE PURCHASERS DO HAVE ACCESS.

 

[biggy H]

Well not according to Disney TODAY...

So we will have to agree to dis-agree until someone with a non-ohysical card actually gets access and show proof such as a video of the actual check-in and trip up without any editing..

 

[GoofGoof]

Well like I said...it's confusing Even the CMs are confused.

 

[biggy H]

Well like I said...it's confusing Even the CMs are confused.

Actually is fairly simple, its a perk and therefore it's not available to resale only members., only to those with a physical DVC issued membershio card. Nothing confusing about that.
Whether the podium CMs gets it right is another matter though..

 

[correcaminos]

You don't have access. I just asked DVC and if you don't buy direct you don't get access...
View attachment 221515

Sorry but that CM is incorrect. They may have been confusing lounges but TOWL, pool hopping, and DVD rentals are all included with any resale purchase at this time. Unless they create another tier all are included at this time.

Well like I said...it's confusing Even the CMs are confused.

But really it is NOT confusing if you are a member and look at your own membership page. Just because someone gets something wrong doesn't mean it's really confusing to the group as a whole.

Well not according to Disney TODAY...

So we will have to agree to dis-agree until someone with a non-ohysical card actually gets access and show proof such as a video of the actual check-in and trip up without any editing..

Search on mouseowners, there have been pictures of those going to their own membership page and showing this exact perk. They can also report going to it and getting in. However a screenshot of their membership page should justify enough. Just because you don't want to believe it, doesn't mean it's true.

Comsidering you need an actual physical card issued by DVC and not a paper print out or a digital one to gain access then how can a member who has only bought resale (not those with grandfathered rights) be able to gain access to TLotW?
And has been stated several times access is a membership perk which resale are not entitled to..

You don't need an actual physical card to gain TOWL access. The digital card works in place of a real one. The cards differ in color. The ones with access to discounts and Epcot lounge are blue, the ones that do not have those perks are white.

 

[JaxFLBear]

The spaced is owned by members (part of the BLT condo association) and will be open to all members regardless of how they purchased their points. The TOTWL is open (on most nights) to all DVC members staying on-property because the leased bar operation needs to make money. The more people you restrict from accessing the TOTWL, the less likely it will remain open because it will not be able to make enough money to cover the lease payments.

All BLT owners pay the same per point rate for their annual dues. What if you are a BLT resale owner and were denied access to the TOTWL lounge, a space that your dues help to maintain? To me, that seems like it would be illegal.

 

[GoofGoof]

Actually is fairly simple, its a perk and therefore it's not available to resale only members., only to those with a physical DVC issued membershio card. Nothing confusing about that.
Whether the podium CMs gets it right is another matter though..

But really it is NOT confusing if you are a member and look at your own membership page. Just because someone gets something wrong doesn't mean it's really confusing to the group as a whole.

You can keep saying it's not confusing but this conversation really proves that it is for some people. Not confusing would be a simple disclaimer on an official DVC website explaining who is eligible. It may be clear in your mind but Disney has done nothing to make this a straight forward question for everyone else. Even their own CMs don't know the answer. I shouldn't have to go to mouseowners to see a screenshot of someone's membership page or take the word of a stranger on a discussion board (You both are pretty certain that you are correct and I have no reason to doubt that so don't take that statement as me questioning you, but it's still not the same thing as an official Disney website).

IMHO DVC is keeping the answer intentionally vague to help direct sales. After all the primary reason for restricting benefits of resale buyers is to make direct purchases more appealing. I could be completely wrong, but there's no other logical explanation.

 

[correcaminos]

You can keep saying it's not confusing but this conversation really proves that it is for some people. Not confusing would be a simple disclaimer on an official DVC website explaining who is eligible. It may be clear in your mind but Disney has done nothing to make this a straight forward question for everyone else. Even their own CMs don't know the answer. I shouldn't have to go to mouseowners to see a screenshot of someone's membership page or take the word of a stranger on a discussion board (You both are pretty certain that you are correct and I have no reason to doubt that so don't take that statement as me questioning you, but it's still not the same thing as an official Disney website).

IMHO DVC is keeping the answer intentionally vague to help direct sales. After all the primary reason for restricting benefits of resale buyers is to make direct purchases more appealing. I could be completely wrong, but there's no other logical explanation.

Okay here's the issue. Not all DVC members have the same level of benefits. That part is fact. DVC cannot make one claim of benefits for ALL members the way you want it to be.

You are the one making it difficult and complex by trying to argue this to death. And using people giving wrong information is not "proof" it simply just shows that people don't know the facts. I could read a lot of stuff about Disney that isn't true and then complain that it's confusing even though it's simply just wrong info.

DVC also will never put a list on a public site for all to see because in their own words "You should not purchase or add on a real estate interest in a Disney Vacation Club Resort in reliance upon the continued availability or renewal or extension of these offers. These offers may only be available to Members at various times and may or may not be renewed or extended. Membership Extras, such as vacation options in the Disney and Concierge Collections, certain discounts, offers, and special events are incidental benefits. These incidental benefits are subject to change or termination without notice, may require the payment of a fee and cannot be combined with any other offers or promotions. Membership Extras are also subject to availability and block–out dates may apply, including high periods of demand such as Christmas and New Year’s Day. To receive any Membership Extras, purchasers must present a valid Disney Vacation Club Membership Card along with a corresponding valid photo ID. Disney and Concierge Collections options are not available for ownership interests not purchased directly from Disney Vacation Development, Inc. after March 21, 2011, and, effective April 4, 2016, Members who do not purchase an ownership interest directly from Disney Vacation Development Inc. will not have access to Membership Extras."

So they would be stupid to spell it out in public for just anyone to see, as those perks can be changed. You may view YOUR perks when logged into YOUR DVC account for that very reason. Membership extras are whatever they decide are perks at the time. T Those perks have changed significantly over time so they will not say what they are.

They are not being vague just to help sales, they are doing it because they don't want to have written down anywhere for just anyone to see because the perks can change at any time. I know this because as an owner for 13 years we've had more perks (like now) and nearly no perks at all really (when I first bought).

That said DVC is likely to promote perks to those wanting to buy, but since they can and will change they will be vague so if they decide to end a perk it's not a disappointment.

I am sorry if you find this difficult, but honestly I think you are making it more than it should be for some reason. I think every member out there gets it. Even my friend who is closing on a resale gets it. It's really not complex or rocket science here.

Now that the horse is long dead and beaten I'll bow out.

 

[GoofGoof]

Okay here's the issue. Not all DVC members have the same level of benefits. That part is fact. DVC cannot make one claim of benefits for ALL members the way you want it to be.

You are the one making it difficult and complex by trying to argue this to death. And using people giving wrong information is not "proof" it simply just shows that people don't know the facts. I could read a lot of stuff about Disney that isn't true and then complain that it's confusing even though it's simply just wrong info.

DVC also will never put a list on a public site for all to see because in their own words "You should not purchase or add on a real estate interest in a Disney Vacation Club Resort in reliance upon the continued availability or renewal or extension of these offers. These offers may only be available to Members at various times and may or may not be renewed or extended. Membership Extras, such as vacation options in the Disney and Concierge Collections, certain discounts, offers, and special events are incidental benefits. These incidental benefits are subject to change or termination without notice, may require the payment of a fee and cannot be combined with any other offers or promotions. Membership Extras are also subject to availability and block–out dates may apply, including high periods of demand such as Christmas and New Year’s Day. To receive any Membership Extras, purchasers must present a valid Disney Vacation Club Membership Card along with a corresponding valid photo ID. Disney and Concierge Collections options are not available for ownership interests not purchased directly from Disney Vacation Development, Inc. after March 21, 2011, and, effective April 4, 2016, Members who do not purchase an ownership interest directly from Disney Vacation Development Inc. will not have access to Membership Extras."

So they would be stupid to spell it out in public for just anyone to see, as those perks can be changed.

Here's a link to the public website which spells out all of the currently available perks of DVC members along with the usual disclaimer that they are subject to change. No need to log in or be a current member to view this:
https://disneyvacationclub.disney.g...7_A1_MGBDVC_A4-7-WDW2017-FINAL-1-19 edits.pdf

It clearly lists Top of the World Lounge along with a whole bunch of other current year membership extras. The bottom of the page clearly indicates:

Effective April 4, 2016, Members who do not purchase an ownership interest directly from Disney Vacation Development Inc. will not have access to Membership Extras.
​

Nowhere does it indicate that Top of the World Lounge is exempt from that limitation. IMHO they could make it a whole lot less confusing if they just simply stated under the Top of the World Lounge write-up that the perk is not subject to the April 4, 2106 direct purchase limitation.

 

[nickys]

IMHO they could make it a whole lot less confusing if they just simply stated under the Top of the World Lounge write-up that the perk is not subject to the April 4, 2106 direct purchase limitation.

They could. Should they? Well my answer is why should they? There are several reasons why they might not want to, and @helenabear has already given you the main ones.

But honestly why does it matter to you? I assume you're not a DVC owner, so why does it concern you anyway? Not trying to be snarky but it simply illustrates something that @helenabear has already said, they do not want people buying because of perks. Once you buy, you will find out what the perks are. Now clearly people find out ahead of time by asking, and owners tell them. In this case, people have told the OP that the 3 perks they currently have are TOTWL, pool hopping and DVD rentals. But if one day, a new resale buyer finds they don't have access to TOTWL, there will be no redress required from DVC if they have nowhere stayed it as a perk.

For some reason you appear to have an issue about the clarity of the terms to the general public. It was only in your last post that you said that this wasn't a case of you disbelieving @helenabear, up until then it appeared to be exactly that (you demanded proof etc.). As it doesn't concern the general public one way or the other, how clear it is to them is unimportant.

 

[GoofGoof]

For some reason you appear to have an issue about the clarity of the terms to the general public. It was only in your last post that you said that this wasn't a case of you disbelieving @helenabear, up until then it appeared to be exactly that (you demanded proof etc.). As it doesn't concern the general public one way or the other, how clear it is to them is unimportant.

Read the whole thread. The OP asked if they would have access to TOWL if they bought resale. I made the simple statement that the answer isn't clear and it's confusing. Several people jumped in and said all members have access and I am wrong that it's confusing. I never asked them for proof of anything. To explain my original statement I posted some info direct from Disney which was the basis for why in my opinion it is not clear and is confusing. Another person posted a chat with a DVC rep that also supported my opinion. I really don't understand why what I said was such a big deal. Why does it matter so much that I find it confusing?

 

[GoofGoof]

They could. Should they? Well my answer is why should they? There are several reasons why they might not want to, and @helenabear has already given you the main ones.

But honestly why does it matter to you? I assume you're not a DVC owner, so why does it concern you anyway? Not trying to be snarky but it simply illustrates something that @helenabear has already said, they do not want people buying because of perks. Once you buy, you will find out what the perks are. Now clearly people find out ahead of time by asking, and owners tell them. In this case, people have told the OP that the 3 perks they currently have are TOTWL, pool hopping and DVD rentals. But if one day, a new resale buyer finds they don't have access to TOTWL, there will be no redress required from DVC if they have nowhere stayed it as a perk.

DVC has no requirement to list out this rule. The only reason they would spell it out is to make it clear for prospective buyers and as I said before it benefits them from a sales standpoint if potential buyers think it's only available for direct purchases. DVC has less incentive to make it clear to potential resale buyers that this perk will still be available to them.

I disagree with the concept that DVC doesn't want you to know about the perks until after you buy. A sales rep will absolutely highlight the current perks to a potential buyer with the disclaimer that perks are not guaranteed.

What would make you assume I'm not a DVC owner? Just curious how you jumped to that conclusion.

 

[JaxFLBear]

Here is a screen shot a resale purchaser posted on the DISboards from the information page for their digital membership card. IT CLEARLY STATES IT'S VALID FOR TOTWL ACCESS.

END OF DISCUSSION.

Direct link to POST if you prefer to view it on the DISboards: Access to TOTWL for resale buyers

 

[nickys]

DVC has no requirement to list out this rule. The only reason they would spell it out is to make it clear for prospective buyers and as I said before it benefits them from a sales standpoint if potential buyers think it's only available for direct purchases. DVC has less incentive to make it clear to potential resale buyers that this perk will still be available to them.

I disagree with the concept that DVC doesn't want you to know about the perks until after you buy. A sales rep will absolutely highlight the current perks to a potential buyer with the disclaimer that perks are not guaranteed.

What would make you assume I'm not a DVC owner? Just curious how you jumped to that conclusion.

Because if you were, you would know that when you log on to your DVC account it tells you what perks you are entitled to. Something which I summised you did not know.

And a sales rep for DVC would obviously be able to tell you what the perks are, because they work for DVC. And all the perks would apply as you wee buying direct. Now a sales rep for a resales company may also be able to tell you what the perks are, but as there aren't many, it doesn't come into the sales process much does it?

 

[GoofGoof]

Because if you were, you would know that when you log on to your DVC account it tells you what perks you are entitled to. Something which I summised you did not know.

And a sales rep for DVC would obviously be able to tell you what the perks are, because they work for DVC. And all the perks would apply as you wee buying direct. Now a sales rep for a resales company may also be able to tell you what the perks are, but as there aren't many, it doesn't come into the sales process much does it?

So what you are saying is as a prospective buyer I would need to buy in first so I can log into my account to find out what benefits I'm entitled to. I think that pretty much proves my point. There isn't a simple straightforward place to get that information as a prospective buyer. It's confusing. We can just agree to disagree on that point.

 

[nickys]

So what you are saying is as a prospective buyer I would need to buy in first so I can log into my account to find out what benefits I'm entitled to. I think that pretty much proves my point. There isn't a simple straightforward place to get that information as a prospective buyer. It's confusing. We can just agree to disagree on that point.

Actually there is. Phone the DVC tour people and ask to chat to them. They would be able to tell you as part of the phone "tour", even if you tell them you are thinking of buying resale.

And I never said it wasn't confusing. It's just that I know other DVC members who bought resale and have gone to TOTWL as has been stated. This is how I know what the perks are for resale buyers. So to me, it's not confusing. But it may be to you. Not much I can do about it, except to tell you what I know to be the case.

 

[GoofGoof]

And I never said it wasn't confusing.

Well we finally agree then