Bald and Fire Mountain forgotten

Jammin2054Slamm

New Member
Original Poster
Does anyone remember the Rumours about Bald and fire mountain and what kind of ride they are.I read some where that one of the mountains where base on Atlantis and one on fantasia. If there is a mountain based on atlants i think if disney desides to build a disneysea park in wdw it will fit better in here then in MK. but the mountain based on fantaisa i think would go in well in Mk where the 20,000 leagues lagoon is.


P.S. why isn't the 20,000 leagues under the sea lagoon not being replaced.

If any of this stuff happens it will probably be after 2010. I would think. :lookaroun
 

Shaman

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Jammin2054Slamm
Does anyone remember the Rumours about Bald and fire mountain and what kind of ride they are.I read some where that one of the mountains where base on Atlantis and one on fantasia. If there is a mountain based on atlants i think if disney desides to build a disneysea park in wdw it will fit better in here then in MK. but the mountain based on fantaisa i think would go in well in Mk where the 20,000 leagues lagoon is.


P.S. why isn't the 20,000 leagues under the sea lagoon not being replaced.

If any of this stuff happens it will probably be after 2010. I would think. :lookaroun

I think they could even have a whole section or maybe a park based on Atlantis...looking at the movie, when they zoom out to show you the skyline of the city...looks like a good looking park. as for Fire Mountain...maybe we will see it pop up again if Beastly Kingdom is green lighted. But everything said, for now all this is just us fans dreaming. (I think eventually Beastly Kingdom will get green lighted...but look for it further in the future if anything). Just my opinion.
 

bhg469

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Jammin2054Slamm



P.S. why isn't the 20,000 leagues under the sea lagoon not being replaced.


20,000 should have never been taken away if they didnt plan on building anything there within i dont know 10 years!!
 

Shaman

Well-Known Member
Re: Re: Bald and Fire Mountain forgotten

Originally posted by bhg469
20,000 should have never been taken away if they didnt plan on building anything there within i dont know 10 years!!


Thank you!!!! It was better than nothing. Maybe they thought people would either A. would no miss it, or B. not notice it was gone. I think they should now either get the attraction back up, or replace it already...maybe after PhillarMagic is finished the lagoon issue will be adressed. But who knows......:hammer:
 

Jammin2054Slamm

New Member
Original Poster
Re: Re: Bald and Fire Mountain forgotten

Originally posted by objr
I think they could even have a whole section or maybe a park based on Atlantis...looking at the movie, when they zoom out to show you the skyline of the city...looks like a good looking park. as for Fire Mountain...maybe we will see it pop up again if Beastly Kingdom is green lighted. But everything said, for now all this is just us fans dreaming. (I think eventually Beastly Kingdom will get green lighted...but look for it further in the future if anything). Just my opinion.

I think your right objr.
I don't think anything will go in to that area until after epcot turns 25. then we would here alot more on any thing replacing it.
 

Jammin2054Slamm

New Member
Original Poster
here is some info i got from jimhillmedia.com about the mattorhorn going into wdw.this is from 2002.


There WAS concept art up in the post show area of the "Walt Disney Story" back in the early 1990s that clearly showed a "Space Mountain" - type roller-coaster ride which was supposed to have been built right behind the Japanese pavilion in Epcot's World Showcase area. And - yes - this ride was to have been housed in a mountain-shaped building, with the attraction inside being called either "Mount Fuji" or "Fire Mountain."

Now where this gets interesting is that this indoor roller-coaster ride was actually one of two "mountains" that the Imagineers had hoped to add to Epcot's World Showcase skline back in the early 1990s. The second of these "mountains" (which was also supposed to have contained a thrill ride) would have been an updated version of Disneyland's popular "Matterhorn" ride.

This proposed Epcot addition was to have been the centerpiece of a brand new Switzerland-themed area which WDI had hoped to add at Epcot. Had construction actually gone forward, the pavilion's Swiss chalet-styled structures as well as its towering mountain-shaped ride building would have occupied that empty spot along World Showcase Lagoon between the Italian and German pavilions.

In the best of all possible worlds, the Imagineers had wanted to add both the "Matterhorn" as well as "Mount Fuji / Fire Mountain" to Epcot's World Showcase. Why both? Well, there were a variety of reasons, actually.

1) With the possible exception of Norway's rather wimpy "Maelstrom" attraction , Epcot had no real thrill rides. Adding these two new Disney mountains would (hopefully) finally clear up that problem. Which would finally give WDW's science and discovery park a little teen appeal.

2) These two rather prominent mountain-shaped ride buildings towering over World Showcase's skyline would obviously have made great "weenies." (I.E. Objects that would catch the attention of Epcot visitors, compelling them to move ever deeper into the theme park.)

3) The Imagineers thought - by adding both the "Matterhorn" and "Mount Fuji / Fire Mountain" to World Showcase's skyline - it would give the back part of Epcot some symmetry. These two faux "mountains" would have acted as book-ends for the American Adventure pavilion. Framing and balancing this part of the theme park.

But of course, none of this ever happened. In spite of all of WDI's best laid plains, neither of these attractions were ever built.

Why for? Well, just about the same time that the Walt Disney Company began searching for a corporate sponsor to underwrite "Mount Fuji / Fire Mountain," the Japanese economy collapsed. So suddenly there weren't a whole lot of firms out there who could shoulder the construction costs (not to mention the 10 years of staffing costs and maintenance fees) associated with the creation of this $100-million-plus thrill ride.

Mind you, the Mouse did everything it could to try and line up a sponsor for "Mount Fuji / Fire Mountain." The company reportedly had prolonged discussions with Fuji Film about possibly sponsoring this proposed attraction ... until Kodak (the Official Film of the stateside Disney theme parks) stepped in and quickly put the kibosh on the idea that its direct competition would be the sponsor of a popular new thrill ride for World Showcase.

There were even allegedly conversations with Toho Studios, built around the notion that this Epcot attraction could possibly prominently feature Toho's biggest star, Godzilla. The idea behind this radically revamped version of the ride is that WDW guests would now race around inside of this faux "mountain" aboard miniature bullet trains, just inches away from constantly being crushed by Big G.

As for the "Matterhorn" ... well, it's the same sad story, folks. The Imagineers just weren't able to find a Swiss corporation that was willing to pick up the tab for this proposed $100 million Epcot addition. Which is why Disney eventually had to abandon the idea of adding two "mountains" to World Showcase's skyline and concentrated instead on adding exciting new elements to Future World.

Why Future World? Because it was infinitely easier -- back in the mid-1990s, anyway -- for Disney execs to convince American corporations to pony up sufficient dough to help showcase their latest products in Future World. I mean, surely the name "Innoventions" rings a bell.

Eve so, it's still kind of sad to think that none of these faux "mountains" proposed for Walt Disney World ever made it off of WDI's drawing board. Particularly the "Matterhorn."

What's so sad about the "Matterhorn" not getting built at Epcot? Well, it's just that ________ Nunis, the former Chairman of Disney Attractions, tried for over 20 years to get a version of this Disneyland favorite built at Walt Disney World.

Take for example, back in the mid-1970s, when Nunis envisioned building a "Matterhorn" in the Magic Kingdom - in the same approximate area that "Mickey's Toontown Fair" currently occupies. This Florida version of Disneyland's "Matterhorn" ride was supposed to have straddled the railroad track that circled the park.

The idea behind doing this was that the WDW railroad was supposed to have rolled right through an opening in the base of the "Matterhorn." Once inside this cave, guests would have encountered ... a raging blizzard! (Which you have to admit would be a very cool way to spend a few moments on a blistering hot summer afternoon in Central Florida.)

Anyway ... when the Magic Kingdom version of this thrill ride failed to make it off the drawing board, ________ set his sights on getting a "Matterhorn" attraction added to Disney - MGM. Below, you'll find a photo of a conceptual painting for the studio theme park that shows one of the proposed layouts for the park. Please note that - at approximately the center of this photograph (back and to the left of the "Great Movie Ride" show building) - you'll see a pointy mountain rising right up where Disney - MGM's New York backlot area was eventually built.


Click to view larger image.

What is that? You guessed it, kids. Another Florida version of the "Matterhorn." Only - in this incarnation of the attraction - only the side facing out toward World Drive would have been finished and actually looked like a real mountain. The side facing in toward the center of the park would have been open, unfinished. Just like most movie sets are.

The idea behind this version of the "Matterhorn" was that WDW guests would (thanks to all the daylight that was pouring in through the open side of the mountain) get a big thrill out of seeing how close their ride vehicle was actually coming to the "mountain"'s support beams. Which (supposedly) would have added to the fun of this Disney-MGM thrill ride.

The only problem was that - as the budget kept ballooning for the studio theme park - the Imagineers were under constant pressure from Disney's CEO Michael Eisner to keep construction costs down on Disney-MGM. (You have to understand that - by building the studio theme park - Uncle Michael was out to prove that all future WDI-designed projects wouldn't have to be like Epcot. Which ended up costing the corporation over a billion dollars to complete. Eisner wanted MGM to be the new template for WDI. To prove to the Imagineers that it really was possible to build an entire new theme park for a 1/3rd or half of what it cost the Walt Disney Company to build Epcot).

One easy way to keep construction costs down on this particular park was to pull the plug on the enormous "E" Ticket that towered over the backlot. Which is how Disney-MGM's version of the "Matterhorn" ended up on the cutting room floor.

What happened to the Epcot version of the "Matterhorn," you already know. And - by the time WDI was hatching plans for Disneys' Animal Kingdom - Nunis had been promoted up and out of his position of power at Disney Attractions. Once he became chairman of that division, ________'s powers became largely ceremonial. He'd show up ribbon cuttings, maybe hand out a few oversized checks to organizations like the United Way. But - beyond that - Nunis was no longer in a position to call the shots as to what got built where at the Walt Disney World resort.

Which - as I said earlier - is sort of sad. Still, I'm hoping that ________ Nunis can take at least some comfort in the knowledge that DAK's "Forbidden Mountain" attraction clearly draws its inspiration from Disneyland's "Matterhorn" ride. This new thrill ride - which is supposed to be built in Animal Kingdom right along the edge of Discovery River near the entrance to Asia (facing out across the water toward the "Tarzan Rocks!" amphitheater) - is, of course, another snow capped faux Disney "mountain."

Only this version of the "mountain" (which hides most of trackwork for this indoor roller-coaster) is lush and green below the snow line. Truth be told, the pictures that I've seen of the model for this attraction (thanks Michelle!) suggest a somewhat squashed "Matterhorn." Shorter in stature, but wider around the base.

So - if all goes according to plan (I keep hearing that Disney plans to break ground on DAK's "Forbidden Mountain" sometime in early 2003. With an eye toward having the ride up and running by October 2004. Just in time for WDW's annual press event) - Walt Disney World will finally get its "Matterhorn" clone.
 

Fievel

RunDisney Addict
As we said from the other thread: Jim Hill is VERY uncreditable.

If you want very specific info on the 20,000 leagues lagoon, do a search. Some of our longest threads are on this ride.
 

AndyMagic

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Fievel
As we said from the other thread: Jim Hill is VERY uncreditable.

If you want very specific info on the 20,000 leagues lagoon, do a search. Some of our longest threads are on this ride.
I don't know if we should say that he is VERY uncredible. Are their any specific instances when he was blatenly wrong? From my experiences with reading his past articles, I have found almost all of his information to be pretty accurate. Why is there this stigma that he is always wrong? Sure he is probably wrong at times but almost every source of news is sometimes wrong.
 

MrNonacho

Premium Member
Originally posted by AndyMagic
I don't know if we should say that he is VERY uncredible. Are their any specific instances when he was blatenly wrong? From my experiences with reading his past articles, I have found almost all of his information to be pretty accurate. Why is there this stigma that he is always wrong? Sure he is probably wrong at times but almost every source of news is sometimes wrong.

It's not so much that he's wrong; rather, it's that so much of what he writes about can't be considered "right." A lot of what he writes is about the past, or things that "could have been." He goes on for pages about how Mission: Space was going to be sooo much more than it will be or how much the queue for Everest has been drastically scaled back. As much as he writes and makes his stories interesting, there is very little substance behind them to back up his claims.

He does get some things right, like with Destination Disney/Pal Mickey, but he comes off as an arrogant, self-important know-it-all. Perhaps that's the reason he kept getting fired and was forced to start his own page...?
 

Fievel

RunDisney Addict
Exactly...He says "This ride was going to be sooooo cool. Now it's really scaled back"

I will guarantee that this happens with 99% of the rides WDW builds. They have a huge idea, then they actually have to make it feasible to build.

Disney's funds aren't endless....they are a business trying to make money, after all. They have to keep costs down to keep profits up...

and more profits mean more/better rides in the future.


Jim Hill gets a lot of attention by sounding like he has these inside sources, which he may have. However, he has RARELY been right. It's because he always has disclaimers that things are in planning stages (project gemini), and if they change he can still claim to be right. When he talks about the past, he talks about how much better original plans were - which will almost always be the case.

He's a disney pessimist. He really needs a better hobby.
 

mkepcotmgmak

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Jammin2054Slamm
Does anyone remember the Rumours about Bald and fire mountain and what kind of ride they are.I read some where that one of the mountains where base on Atlantis and one on fantasia. If there is a mountain based on atlants i think if disney desides to build a disneysea park in wdw it will fit better in here then in MK. but the mountain based on fantaisa i think would go in well in Mk where the 20,000 leagues lagoon is.


P.S. why isn't the 20,000 leagues under the sea lagoon not being replaced.

If any of this stuff happens it will probably be after 2010. I would think. :lookaroun

about 20,000 not being replaced...
one of my MK trainers told me that they couldn't drain the tank becuase it had been there for so long they were afraid it would collapse, and right underneath it is the men/women's lockerooms and costuming... sounds dangerous huh? well i think that the WDI or someone would be able to solve the debacle, seeing that everytime the 20,000 gets too much rain water in it our lockeroom gets leaked on!!! It seems this tank is a thorn in Disney's side.
 

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