• The new WDWMAGIC iOS app is here!
    Stay up to date with the latest Disney news, photos, and discussions right from your iPhone. The app is free to download and gives you quick access to news articles, forums, photo galleries, park hours, weather and Lightning Lane pricing. Learn More
  • Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
    Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.

Len Testa - “Disney positions itself as the all-American vacation. The irony is that most Americans can’t afford it.”

Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Sir_Cliff said:
I think you have kind of missed the point here. You quoted a figure that suggests 20% of the population is responsible for 51% of ALL spending, and then suggest that a responsible business strategy for Disney is to pitch to the 80% who combined are responsible for 49% of all spending? How much of that do you imagine is disposable income used for vacations and other luxuries?

A contingency in case of a collapse would involve things like price elasticity and being able to cut costs, for example, through reduced capacity. It doesn't mean operating now as if they were in a post-collapse economy. Hedging for a collapse or downturn would also suggest they should not be expanding capacity right now, which I believe is the opposite of what you have been arguing.

This thread is a little eye opening for me. I really think a lot of people want to pretend Disney is some anomaly and the rest of the world is continuing along as though it was 30 years ago in terms of how the economy and distribution of income works. My impression is that it is more convenient for them to think that way than to consider there may be a fundamental problem with the economy and not just Disney.
Click to expand...
No…you missed it…you have to expand your client pool to account for disruptions

You missed where I explained the model: it’s MASS.

You can’t “flip a switch” on that. The tea cups and Peter Pan will NEVER be bought for the amount needed to make up for attrition. It’s not a “luxury” product.

And that’s just the cliff notes version of why it a bad strategy…it goes in other directions the more you push it

As far as the last part…I’m in total agreement…it is an economic issue…not a Disney.

But they are paid to come up with solutions to these issues. But it seems like big shot doesn’t care? And why? Cause if he thinks he’ll take an ego hit he bails…just like the last time…because he answers to no one. The classic bull Believing what comes out of his backside
 
Sir_Cliff

Sir_Cliff

Well-Known Member
Sirwalterraleigh said:
No…you missed it…you have to expand your client pool to account for disruptions

You missed where I explained the model: it’s MASS.
Click to expand...
Disney is already about as mainstream a product as exists. You don't think that if they dropped prices in response to softening demand people would show up? As much as I may not like them, one advantage of inflated prices is that you can lower them quite a lot without losing money.

Sirwalterraleigh said:
You can’t “flip a switch” on that. The tea cups and Peter Pan will NEVER be bought for the amount needed to make up for attrition. It’s not a “luxury” product.
Click to expand...
Yet, they are continuing to charge what they are charging and people are showing up. For me personally, WDW is too expensive and too much work to be worth it at the moment. I can't deny, though, that it is a very successful business.

Sirwalterraleigh said:
And that’s just the cliff notes version of why it a bad strategy…it goes in other directions the more you push it

As far as the last part…I’m in total agreement…it is an economic issue…not a Disney.

But they are paid to come up with solutions to these issues. But it seems like big shot doesn’t care? And why? Cause if he thinks he’ll take an ego hit he bails…just like the last time…because he answers to no one. The classic bull Believing what comes out of his backside
Click to expand...
They're not paid to come up with solutions to structural issues in the US economy. They are paid to come up with responses to the economies in which they are operating. How are Disney theme parks going to change income distribution in the world's largest economy with a population of over 340 million people?
 
Last edited:
bmr1591

bmr1591

Well-Known Member
Sirwalterraleigh said:
The parks problem is they’re already throwing out discounts in the range of 2010 to try and get the occ and attendance up…

What happens when it’s in a “bad” economy?

They can’t discount 60%…and they’d have to do that and more

The prices are too high. That is Bob. It’s only Bob. The buck stops at Bob.

Full stop
Click to expand...

I’m no expert by any means, but didn’t the quarterly report say numbers were up in attendance and hotel occupancy? @lentesta am I remembering this incorrectly?
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Sir_Cliff said:
Disney is already about as mainstream as product as exists. You don't think that if they dropped prices in response to softening demand people would show up? As much as I may not like them, one advantage of inflated prices is that you can lower them quite a lot without losing money.
Click to expand...

In the past I would agree…when abc/espn accounted for 60% of the revenues. You know what does that now?

Sir_Cliff said:
Yet, they are continuing to charge what they are charging and people are showing up. For me personally, WDW is too expensive and too much work to be worth it at the moment. I can't deny, though, that it is a very successful business.
Click to expand...
Not “normal” times. The US government spent/invented $7 trillion to “buy” it way out of a recession…and still Disney is softening…
Think it would work again?

Sir_Cliff said:
They're not paid to come up with solutions to structural issues in the US economy. They are paid to come up with responses to the economies in which they are operating. How are Disney theme parks going to change income distribution in the world's largest economy with a population of over 340 million people?
Click to expand...
They can’t…but you can hold the line and let the economy catch up…which they have done periodically over time…to try and maintain a buffer
 
Sir_Cliff

Sir_Cliff

Well-Known Member
Sirwalterraleigh said:
They can’t…but you can hold the line and let the economy catch up…which they have done periodically over time…to try and maintain a buffer
Click to expand...
They have a big buffer, which is their profit margin. It makes little sense to earn less now because they might have to earn less in the future.

Again, I don't love any of this. My only point is that this is not just a Disney issue, which I think was the point of the article that sparked this whole thread.
 
networkpro

networkpro

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
Sirwalterraleigh said:
Anyone who speaks German…or any language “German adjacent” loves two things:

1. Christmas
2. David hasselhoff
Click to expand...
Deutsch-nah? Das ist eine große Fehlbezeichnung, denn die sogenannte Trennung zwischen Hoch- und Niederdeutsch ließ alle denken, dass Silbenschlucken wie im Wienerischen normal sei. Ich mag zwar Weihnachtsmärkte und 30 % Bier, aber redet nicht schlecht über den Hoff! Das Lied „Looking for Freedom“ kam zur richtigen Zeit am richtigen Ort.
 
Miss Bella

Miss Bella

Well-Known Member
Sirwalterraleigh said:
That’s all I’m saying

The biggest threat to travel and leisure is a disruption to consumer confidence in the “real world”. It’s always the first/easiest thing to cut.

The fact they’ve kinda yo yo and never gotten back to their pre 2020 numbers in Orlando is a huge warning sign. People dismiss that far too easily
Click to expand...
Consumer confidence is one thing, but I think a decrease in disposable income is a bigger factor. I don't know about anybody else, but every single bill and everything I buy has gone up faster than my income since 2020. Food prices may have stabilized a little. Now we are just used to the high prices. I just paid 20 dollars for 3 pounds of ground beef. I've given up eating steak.
 
Jrb1979

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
Sir_Cliff said:
They have a big buffer, which is their profit margin. It makes little sense to earn less now because they might have to earn less in the future.

Again, I don't love any of this. My only point is that this is not just a Disney issue, which I think was the point of the article that sparked this whole thread.
Click to expand...
It's not just a Disney issue, Universal is right up there too. Personally IMO I find that the vacation places that were already high in price have increased prices a lot more than those cheaper vacation places.

A good example is Myrtle Beach. I know for most here it's not a place you visit but in terms of pricing, it's hasn't gone up that much compared to when we went 5 years ago.

I understand the business side for going after those who have the spending money. Vegas, Disney and Universal all do it. The problem is those who have the spending money aren't going to visit your destination every year like the middle class did.
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
networkpro said:
Deutsch-nah? Das ist eine große Fehlbezeichnung, denn die sogenannte Trennung zwischen Hoch- und Niederdeutsch ließ alle denken, dass Silbenschlucken wie im Wienerischen normal sei. Ich mag zwar Weihnachtsmärkte und 30 % Bier, aber redet nicht schlecht über den Hoff! Das Lied „Looking for Freedom“ kam zur richtigen Zeit am richtigen Ort.
Click to expand...
You’ve gone deutsch

Was ist das?
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
bmr1591 said:
I’m not talking about their words from a call, I’m talking reported numbers on paper. I recall us all be surprised how strong they actually were when we expected a heavy slump due to the amount of discounts.
Click to expand...
The numbers are not broken down by location…they can hide a down in Disneyland or wdw if it’s offset by the other

They don’t give “hard” numbers to the point where we can pinpoint exactly what is going on. They never had to. It’s why it’s “guidance” it’s vague on purpose
 
networkpro

networkpro

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
Sirwalterraleigh said:
You’ve gone deutsch

Was ist das?
Click to expand...

Like a lot of Americans, I and my wife come from Germanic stock, but not from populations that spoke what standard high German is today. We love Weihnachtsmärkten (Or Christmas markets), real Beer, and the Hoff (why? Baywatch, Knight Rider and the Freedom song which came out when the wall came down). Something like Disney really needs to pay attention to, how to play to and maintain your market. The Hoff played directly to his audience to engage them where they were, not where he wanted them to be.
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
networkpro said:
Like a lot of Americans, I and my wife come from Germanic stock, but not from populations that spoke what standard high German is today. We love Weihnachtsmärkten (Or Christmas markets), real Beer, and the Hoff (why? Baywatch, Knight Rider and the Freedom song which came out when the wall came down). Something like Disney really needs to pay attention to, how to play to and maintain your market. The Hoff played directly to his audience to engage them where they were, not where he wanted them to be.
Click to expand...
Don’t hassle the hoff?
 
IanDLBZF

IanDLBZF

Well-Known Member

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom