MK Piston Peak and Villains Land Construction Thread

[EricsBiscuit]

Contrast the lethargic pace on this project with Uni’s replacement for RRR.

 

[James Alucobond]

Contrast the lethargic pace on this project with Uni’s replacement for RRR.

RRR is just being torn down, and not at a pace any quicker than demolition occurs at Disney. They’ve already cleared tons of land for this project, cleared the courtyard for Monstropolis, and cleared Dinorama for Encanto. None of that demo took very long; it’s the land prep that has been “slow”, though only from a visibility perspective.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Contrast the lethargic pace on this project with Uni’s replacement for RRR.

It would be apples to apples if Disney was replacing a bare bones steel coaster with another bare bones steel coaster.

So, the 'contrast' is: two separate things.

 

[truecoat]

RRR is just being torn down, and not at a pace any quicker than demolition occurs at Disney. They’ve already cleared tons of land for this project, cleared the courtyard for Monstropolis, and cleared Dinorama for Encanto. None of that demo took very long; it’s the land prep that has been “slow”, though only from a visibility perspective.

They’ve cleared land for the new project at Uni as well.

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

The Disneyland railroad, with four stations, has a station on average every 500 meters of track. At Magic Kingdom, which has three stations, it's on average every 800 meters. And Disneyland is already a smaller park to cross on foot. It seems like a no-brainer to put a station in Villains Land and bring that average length to 600 feet and give tired guests an option to get from the far back of the park to the front, so they can leave without clogging walkways.

Disneyland also has two incredible dioramas back-to-back, and a diorama would be a great addition to MK's railroad in Villains Land. Not only would it be a cool, unexpected "plussing up" and provide some parity between MK and several other castle parks, but I think it offers a chance to introduce the thematic concept and backstory of Villains Land.

That is, Villains Land will undoubtedly be cool, but it's still a tough concept creatively to bring all the villains together in one realm and rationalize it story-wise. Sure, they can just lean on tropes and motifs and aesthetic design and hand-wave away any need to explain what the place is supposed to be and why it exists, but it will be stronger -- and it's in Imagineering's tradition -- to have a backstory.

But often these backstories, which serve to inspire the Imagineers, can go unknown by guests, leaving them confused by the creative choices in the land. Avenger's Campus is a perfect example: that weird mix of old industrial brick buildings and a modern sleek office park is meaningless and doesn't resonate (i.e., trigger warmth of recognition by guests)...unless you know the backstory that the site was once the location of Stark Industries, and by the way, you have to even know what that is, like Marvel fans do. Other than putting "Stark Industries" logos all over the land, they didn't leave much other evidence of that history (old 1950s rockets or flying cars or anything Howard Stark may have built back then that may be left over).

All that may be a bit of an aside, but the point is backstories are helpful, but Disney can get a better reaction from guests when they actually convey them, and not just use them as a design-process tool.

So, a train diorama leading into Villains Land (and hopefully leading up to a station) is a perfect chance for a diorama to give guests a rich taste of the land's concept and flavor. A narrator could say something like:

"As we venture into this shadowy realm of the Magic Kingdom, we drift off to a land of our fantastical fears and wild imagination. What if the scoundrels, villains, and rogues of enchanting tales had a place to call their own, where they could hatch their dark and devious plans together, shrouded away from the light of goodness and fairness. Do you dare disembark and explore these dark dreams? If so, try to keep your eyes wide for dangers, and don't fall too deep into the sinister slumber of Villain's Land that you don't wake it out."

This, for example, spins the land as a "what-if dream" and not compromising the story cannon of any individual IP. But it's a conceptual backstory and difficult to express through the physical design of the land. That is, it's not easy to come up with architectural, rockwork, or landscaping cues that say "this is all a dream."

A diorama, with special projection effects, along with narration allows that story to be told easier. Using similar techniques to the slightly psychedelic Heffalumps and Woozles scene in the Pooh attraction, the idea that we are falling asleep and having a scary dream could be created in this diorama. We could roll from Frontierland into a forest and in the diorama what initially look like a continuation of forest trees could start to transform into spooky trees right before our eyes...suggesting our "nightmare" is taking over. This would all have to be done at an all-ages level, but enough can be done to tell the story.

Or you could just explain the general backstory with a Hades River Styx E-Ticket Attraction.

Muses appear in the beginning just to tell you they are about to tell you a story of how the Villians rose again.

Boom boom Hades is shown making a plan to rescue the villians from the Underworld in a final bid to get revenge and take over the Magic Kingdom.

The boat enters each of the major villians "realms" in the Underworld as they agree to come together and take over the world, starting by defeating their respective heroes (which is why they are set up in MK).

Yada yada, they notice you there and a small fight/chase scene occurs where you barely make it out.


We could then make a new firework location about the Villian's big battle. Could either end with the Villians winning and claiming this area for them permanently with a new updated lighting package around the area for the last hour or the Villians losing (defeated by their inability to work as a team) and swearing revenge that they'll be back another day.

 

[michmousefan]

A diorama, with special projection effects, along with narration allows that story to be told easier. Using similar techniques to the slightly psychedelic Heffalumps and Woozles scene in the Pooh attraction, the idea that we are falling asleep and having a scary dream could be created in this diorama. We could roll from Frontierland into a forest and in the diorama what initially look like a continuation of forest trees could start to transform into spooky trees right before our eyes...suggesting our "nightmare" is taking over. This would all have to be done at an all-ages level, but enough can be done to tell the story.

A tunnel/diorama setting also allows them to have the trains for a coaster pass over such a tunnel, and extend out over the boundary of the railroad if they need/want to do that. Could be fun to pass over a rocky outcropping and out into a forbidden forest, of sorts...

 

[Disney Analyst]

I sincerely hope they build the train into whatever rocky mountain they are creating, and finally give MK a diorama.

 

[DrStarlander]

A tunnel/diorama setting also allows them to have the trains for a coaster pass over such a tunnel, and extend out over the boundary of the railroad if they need/want to do that. Could be fun to pass over a rocky outcropping and out into a forbidden forest, of sorts...

Yes this is true. Overall, as I see it, there's four established ways for Disney to lay out the land, including the "village" of shops, restaurants, general placemaking), the large show buildings (perhaps two), and the railroad passing through.

1. "TUNNELS UNDER RAILROAD INTO LAND": Essentially the Disneyland SWGE, Hong Kong Toys Story and Frozen Land approach, where in this case the train runs to the south of, and outside Villains Land (separated by a rock berm/boundary) and guests enter VL by going through tunnels under the track. (In this approach VL is unlikely to have a station, but the project could have a diorama if this segment is through a tunnel.) The village would back up to a rockwork mountain, which would hide the show buildings. I don't think this approach is likely only because I don't think they can turn the train tight enough after BTM to cut across south enough. It would likely push all of VL too far north.

2. "RAILROAD AS CREASE BETWEEN VILLAGE AND SHOWBUILDING": This approach, used in places like Disneyland's Haunted Mansion and it's a small world (also at DLP) puts placemaking in front of the railroad tracks, and locates the tracks at the seam between the placemaking and show buildings, sometimes exposed (it's a small world), sometimes not (Haunted Mansion).

3. "RAILROAD BISECTS SHOWBUILDING": Exemplified by PotC and Splash Mt./Tiana's at both Disneyland and Magic Kingdom, and PotC at DLP. This is where placemaking and an initial amount of the attraction is on one side of the tracks, and the tracks bisect the show building.

4. "RAILROAD PASSES THROUGH AND ABOVE ON TRESTLE": This is the Bear/Critter/Bayou Country at Disneyland, and Tokyo Disneyland approach, where the train passes through the land, visibly, above guests such as on a trestle bridge (or a bridge of whatever aesthetic makes sense).

As mentioned, I doubt they can pull off #1 due to train radius limits. I think #4 could be amazing (I love the kinetics and things happening at different levels) but I suspect it's less likely as it imposes a big element into the land that may detract from the vibe (a little too festive/lively) and other placemaking landmarks and views they want to create. I think #2 and #3 are most likely, with my bet's on #2 (given the choice I think they'd avoid bisecting a show building, makes refurbs more difficult). They both make a diorama easy (part of or connected to the show building) and both make a tunnel station easy, and I think thematically that's such a great way to say "Villains Land is different (tonally) than all other castle park lands."

 

[MisterPenguin]

Overnight Dredging Underway To Clean Rivers of America at Magic Kingdom

Walt Disney World has begun overnight dredging to clean the Rivers of America at Magic Kingdom ahead of demolition

blogmickey.com

 

[gerarar]

Pumps are now visble inside the park, removing the last few puddles of water.

Source and more (swipe left for more construction pics):

 

[Disney Analyst]

Pumps are now visble inside the park, removing the last few puddles of water.
View attachment 879478

Source and more (swipe left for more construction pics):

I wonder if they are just going to bury most of this, once it’s dried out? The river feels like something they just need to fill in, to get the island and Frontierland all at one level for grading etc.

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

I wonder if they are just going to bury most of this, once it’s dried out? The river feels like something they just need to fill in, to get the island and Frontierland all at one level for grading etc.

I feel like they'd be more likely to dig out the island to make it all the same level as the river and build up from there. Put in foundations, etc. Or maybe it's too low in the water table, I don't really know.

 

[Disney Analyst]

I feel like they'd be more likely to dig out the island to make it all the same level as the river and build up from there. Put in foundations, etc. Or maybe it's too low in the water table, I don't really know.

I’m definitely curious to see what the plan is.

Perhaps they flatten as you mention, and use river level to expand the utilidors for both Cars and Villains? (lol they’d never)

 

[lazyboy97o]

I wonder if they are just going to bury most of this, once it’s dried out? The river feels like something they just need to fill in, to get the island and Frontierland all at one level for grading etc.

I feel like they'd be more likely to dig out the island to make it all the same level as the river and build up from there. Put in foundations, etc. Or maybe it's too low in the water table, I don't really know.

I’m definitely curious to see what the plan is.

Perhaps they flatten as you mention, and use river level to expand the utilidors for both Cars and Villains? (lol they’d never)

The water management drawings show the area being filled in with the river bed remaining in place.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

The water management drawings show the area being filled in with the river bed remaining in place.

Really? That’s interesting. I wonder if it will crack and cause problems down the road?

 

[DrStarlander]

Really? That’s interesting. I wonder if it will crack and cause problems down the road?

Agreed. They will almost certainly be removing the riverboat tracks next, and then breaking up and removing any concrete footings for the track and concrete in the riverbed. It would astonish me if anything were left as-is, and just buried. That would seem extraordinary for a professional, commercial project like this. But we're likely to find out in the next month or so!

Maybe when these guys are done with Rip Ride Rockit they can pop over and take care of the riverboat tracks.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Agreed. They will almost certainly be removing the riverboat tracks next, and then breaking up and removing any concrete footings for the track and concrete in the riverbed. It would astonish me if anything were left as-is, and just buried. That would seem extraordinary for a professional, commercial project like this. But we're likely to find out in the next month or so!

Maybe when these guys are done with Rip Ride Rockit they can pop over and take care of the riverboat tracks.
View attachment 879574

Its fascinating how the two companies work. As we see, Universal is rapidly removing Rockit with a HARD DATE it must be removed.

At Disney, they are not so good with dates.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Agreed. They will almost certainly be removing the riverboat tracks next, and then breaking up and removing any concrete footings for the track and concrete in the riverbed. It would astonish me if anything were left as-is, and just buried. That would seem extraordinary for a professional, commercial project like this. But we're likely to find out in the next month or so!

Maybe when these guys are done with Rip Ride Rockit they can pop over and take care of the riverboat tracks.
View attachment 879574

Why would a state licensed civil engineer risk their license and lie to a state water management district over this?

 

[jah4955]

The water management drawings show the area being filled in with the river bed remaining in place.

Disney has a history of burying former attractions: one of Brickey's videos ("Disneyland Oddities") speaks of where in Disneyland and at Walt Disney World it's approximately where the Persian Resort would have stood.

 

[EvilChameleon]

How much would you pay for a slice of the riverboat track?