Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[ToTBellHop]

That's not at all the same as dropping you from the insurance.

If your insurance costs $100 a month and they move you to a $1000/month plan, they’ve effectively dropped you, just without violating federal law. They are only giving you the illusion of choice.

 

[DisneyCane]

This line of discussion is drifting dangerously off-topic for this thread and into full-contact politics, but this kind of attitude is exactly the kind of divisiveness that has permeated every single important issue - including Covid - challenging our country.

How would you suggest we solve THAT problem...? Because that problem has clearly become the root of all problems, especially Covid.

You are right that I should not have posted that reply in this thread and should have bitten my tongue. I decided to self moderate and delete it.

As for the divisiveness, that has existed since the "hanging chads" of 2000 (although it probably started with the impeachment of Clinton) and there probably isn't a solution any time soon. We have gotten to the point where elections require "firing up the base" instead of appealing to the middle. Even if the actual candidate is pretty moderate, the base of the party leads to branding of the candidate which causes the base of the other party to be vehemently opposed to.

Honestly, the only solution would be to get rid of the two party system somehow. Every issue has to have one party in favor and one party opposed.

I don't agree that political divisiveness is the root of the problem with COVID. The biggest culprit of spread according to many is young people partying and not caring about precautions. That demographic certainly leans away from my political beliefs.

 

[Kevin_W]

A president who is honest with the American people about the challenges this pandemic has presented and a willingness to work with our allies on this global problem is at least a start in the right direction. No more gaslighting, no more boasts about how this is almost over, no more empty gestures about the "tremendous job" his people have done (while the Titanic sinks). Just honest messaging.

I think that will go a long way. There is no one on the planet that is or can be an expert in infections disease, and trade, and military deployment, and economics, and immigration policy, and education, and a million other things. A president needs to be a good administrator of a huge staff that has competence in those areas.

As an aside, I work in a chemical research facility and have given hundreds of tours over the years to everyone from our customers to Boy Scout groups. The most bizzarre by far was for one of our senators. He did a wonderful job of looking you in the eye, asking questions, and producing an aura that he cared about your work... all while not understanding a single thing that was said. The man confused "carbon fiber" with "carbon footprint". So I sincerely hope he at least has some good scientific policy advisors on his staff.

 

[Miss Bella]

It’s better than drinking bleach, right?

People weren’t going to do that either.

 

[GoofGoof]

You're going to have about 70 million people that won't listen to a word Biden says. I'm not sure why you think they would??? I don't want to get political, but just like four years ago when one side said "not my president" you are going to see the same thing this time around on the other side.

I think you're living in some kind of dream world if you think people are going to comply just because POTUS says too.
There are lock down protest going on all over Europe. Your going to see them here. Your also going to vaccine protests. The more force you see by government the more people are going to rebel. Some people think the government should fear the people not the other way around.

I disagree. You assume that all 70M people who voted for Trump are die hard trumpers that live in an alternate reality. There is a portion of the population that fits that mold. Many people who voted for Trump did so for many other reasons other than delusional hero worship. There are more independents than democrats or republicans and a number of them voted for Trump. Even within the Republican Party there are levels. I’m not foolish enough to think everyone can be convinced, but I think you underestimate the desire people have to get out of this pandemic. People are going to protest vaccines because Trump lost the election? That’s pathetic. I think it’s kinda sad that people would advocate resisting common sense public health initiatives just to spite the incoming administration because their guy lost.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

Anyone saying this with seriousness is probably still dug in. You don’t leave a cult

Yeah, I haven't seen a single person who said that prior to the election admit they were wrong. Ironically, after months of crying about "moving the goalposts" they have now moved the goalposts themselves claim it's about asserting control and taking power. It's as if thewhole "it's going to magically vanish after the election" claims never happened. Anything that happens proves the conspiracy theory true to them and nothing can ever disprove it.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

People still assume during these times that they can do what they want. Why isn’t there something in place that would have prevented them from boarding? And we sit here and discuss why we can’t somehow control it better.

United Airlines bans couple that boarded plane after testing positive for COVID-19

A couple that was arrested after boarding a flight to Hawaii after knowingly testing positive for COVID-19 has been banned from United.

www.google.com

 

[DisneyCane]

First I will say studies in Canada have shown 80% of the the spread is from private homes. Places people don't wear masks. While cases are rising, IMO they would be that much higher with no restrictions in place. I tell you a big reason for the rising cases, there is still too many that feel they should be able to do what they want. Look no further then Thanksgiving and the amount of people traveled even after being advised not too.

I'm not really disagreeing with you. My point in posting that data is that many people on here like to criticize Desantis (and other Republican governors) for what he (they) has done/not done to reduce spread and praised other governors for finding the right balance and acting correctly. The data doesn't indicate that any way is the "right" way. I do not argue that the more severe the restrictions, the more spread will be reduced. I just disagree with the tradeoff of the restrictions required for significant slowing vs. the effect on the economy and loss of personal freedoms.

Canada is doing significantly "better" overall than the USA but Canada also has the advantage of having a lower population than California spread out over 23.5 times the land area of California. For sure, there are a few densely populated metropolitan areas and I'm not saying that population density (I also realize that huge swaths of Canada are essentially unpopulated) is the only reason, but it certainly helps.

 

[GoofGoof]

It’s interesting how this has evolved, up until President Obama I don’t remember so many people saying “he’s not my president!” I thought it was a racist thing with him but now it’s happened with President Trump and of your prediction is true, President Biden will be next.

Isn’t it also possible that Trump was just that bad? He was intentionally nasty in his public speaking and went out of his way to provoke the other side. Many people who disagreed with George W Bush’s politics still supported him completely through 9/11. His approval rating came close to 90%. They didn’t support his other policies, but got behind him when we faced a national security crisis. Protesting vaccines to spite someone politically makes no sense.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

You are right that I should not have posted that reply in this thread and should have bitten my tongue. I decided to self moderate and delete it.

As for the divisiveness, that has existed since the "hanging chads" of 2000 (although it probably started with the impeachment of Clinton) and there probably isn't a solution any time soon. We have gotten to the point where elections require "firing up the base" instead of appealing to the middle. Even if the actual candidate is pretty moderate, the base of the party leads to branding of the candidate which causes the base of the other party to be vehemently opposed to.

Honestly, the only solution would be to get rid of the two party system somehow. Every issue has to have one party in favor and one party opposed.

I don't agree that political divisiveness is the root of the problem with COVID. The biggest culprit of spread according to many is young people partying and not caring about precautions. That demographic certainly leans away from my political beliefs.

Someday...when we’re back to debating rides, restaurants, fireworks and nonsense...we’ll go over divisiveness

Dangling chads were a symptom of the disease...not the cause

 

[Miss Bella]

I disagree. You assume that all 70M people who voted for Trump are die hard trumpers that live in an alternate reality. There is a portion of the population that fits that mold. Many people who voted for Trump did so for many other reasons other than delusional hero worship. There are more independents than democrats or republicans and a number of them voted for Trump. Even within the Republican Party there are levels. I’m not foolish enough to think everyone can be convinced, but I think you underestimate the desire people have to get out of this pandemic. People are going to protest vaccines because Trump lost the election? That’s pathetic. I think it’s kinda sad that people would advocate resisting common sense public health initiatives just to spite the incoming administration because their guy lost.

People will make up there own minds regardless of what our corrupt political leaders tell us. People aren’t going to protest vaccines because trump lost. I never said that. They would have protested mandated masks and vaccines regardless of who is on the White House.

 

[Chi84]

You're going to have about 70 million people that won't listen to a word Biden says. I'm not sure why you think they would??? I don't want to get political, but just like four years ago when one side said "not my president" you are going to see the same thing this time around on the other side.

I think you're living in some kind of dream world if you think people are going to comply just because POTUS says too.
There are lock down protest going on all over Europe. Your going to see them here. Your also going to vaccine protests. The more force you see by government the more people are going to rebel. Some people think the government should fear the people not the other way around.

I would dispute the 70 million number. I assume you're lumping together everyone who voted for Trump and suggesting none of them would listen to Biden and therefore none of them would go along with his plea for 100 days of mask wearing.

I know several people who are Republicans and voted for Trump in the last election - none of them are opposed to COVID precautions. Every single one of them complies with mask rules. None of them appeared on the news with MAGA hats staring down nurses - people who do the right thing don't get news coverage. I'm sure there are many, many people who voted for Trump because they support a Republican agenda but also think for themselves when it comes to the virus and have concluded that restrictions make sense at this time.

I also know life-long Democrats who are concerned that the restrictions have gone too far. One is far more likely to show up at a lockdown protest than any of my Republican acquaintances.

It's going to be a tough job, but the new administration is going to have to tackle the fact that the current one took the lead in politicizing this virus. I don't "hate" Trump, but in my opinion, he never successfully moved from campaigning to governing. Dividing people works to get you elected, but it's a horrible disadvantage when you're trying to confront a public health menace.

 

[Disstevefan1]

In reference to our discussion on when to roll back Covid restrictions, President-elect Biden says he will ask the nation to wear masks for 100 days after he takes office. He specifically states, not forever - just 100 days. That puts us at May 1st. It’s his belief that universal masking in conjunction with the start of the vaccination process will drive down the number of cases significantly if everyone gets on board.

I don’t think this means there will be no masks anywhere as of May 1 or that a place like WDW will definitely remove that restriction by that time, but it gives you some idea as to what the new administration is thinking.

Biden plans to ask nation to wear masks for 100 days

"Just 100 days to mask. Not forever — 100 days," Mr. Biden said. "I think we'll see a significant reduction if that occurs with vaccinations and masking, to drive down the numbers considerably."

news.yahoo.com

Nice gesture Joey!!!

 

[DisneyDebRob]

Someday...when we’re back to debating rides, restaurants, fireworks and nonsense...we’ll go over divisiveness

Dangling chads were a symptom of the disease...not the cause

What I would do right about now to be going back and forth about whether the Yeti will be fixed or not.
Some are so dug in here that they can’t see the forest through the trees.

 

[Horizons '83]

Isn’t it also possible that Trump was just that bad? He was intentionally nasty in his public speaking and went out of his way to provoke the other side. Many people who disagreed with George W Bush’s politics still supported him completely through 9/11. His approval rating came close to 90%. They didn’t support his other policies, but got behind him when we faced a national security crisis. Protesting vaccines to spite someone politically makes no sense.

You described me perfectly during his presidency. Not my cup of tea on some of his policies, but was behind him 110% during 9/11 and had a much deeper appreciation for him as a man. He also respected the office and the respected the other side of the aisle.

I think I just read that Bush, Obama and Clinton will jointly receive the vaccine together to show solidarity and some form of leadership this country needs right now.

 

[Chi84]

You described me perfectly during his presidency. Not my cup of tea on some of his policies, but was behind him 110% during 9/11 and had a much deeper appreciation for him as a man. He also respected the office and the respected the other side of the aisle.

I think I just read that Bush, Obama and Clinton will jointly receive the vaccine together to show solidarity and some form of leadership this country needs right now.

Time to revive the SNL ex-presidents skit.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

You described me perfectly during his presidency. Not my cup of tea on some of his policies, but was behind him 110% during 9/11 and had a much deeper appreciation for him as a man. He also respected the office and the respected the other side of the aisle.

I think I just read that Bush, Obama and Clinton will jointly receive the vaccine together to show solidarity and some form of leadership this country needs right now.

Biden also said he will join them in getting the shot.
Can hear the conspiracists now saying it was a placebo, they never got it. And it continues..

 

[giantgolfer]

You described me perfectly during his presidency. Not my cup of tea on some of his policies, but was behind him 110% during 9/11 and had a much deeper appreciation for him as a man. He also respected the office and the respected the other side of the aisle.

I think I just read that Bush, Obama and Clinton will jointly receive the vaccine together to show solidarity and some form of leadership this country needs right now.

Biden said he will take it publicly as well.

 

[Miss Bella]

I would dispute the 70 million number. I assume you're lumping together everyone who voted for Trump and suggesting none of them would listen to Biden and therefore none of them would go along with his plea for 100 days of mask wearing.

I know several people who are Republicans and voted for Trump in the last election - none of them are opposed to COVID precautions. Every single one of them complies with mask rules. None of them appeared on the news with MAGA hats staring down nurses - people who do the right thing don't get news coverage. I'm sure there are many, many people who voted for Trump because they support a Republican agenda but also think for themselves when it comes to the virus and have concluded that restrictions make sense at this time.

I also know life-long Democrats who are concerned that the restrictions have gone too far. One is far more likely to show up at a lockdown protest than any of my Republican acquaintances.

It's going to be a tough job, but the new administration is going to have to tackle the fact that the current one took the lead in politicizing this virus. I don't "hate" Trump, but in my opinion, he never successfully moved from campaigning to governing. Dividing people works to get you elected, but it's a horrible disadvantage when you're trying to confront a public health menace.

I just don’t believe one person has that much influence. It doesn’t seem to matter who’s in the White House only about half the country will approve of them. If they are lucky. A 50 % approval rate is great for any president.
I find it fascinating that People think if POTUS says wear a mask all of a sudden everyone is going to comply. They wouldn’t comply if Trump told them either.

 

[DisneyCane]

It’s interesting how this has evolved, up until President Obama I don’t remember so many people saying “he’s not my president!” I thought it was a racist thing with him but now it’s happened with President Trump and of your prediction is true, President Biden will be next.

Isn’t it also possible that Trump was just that bad? He was intentionally nasty in his public speaking and went out of his way to provoke the other side. Many people who disagreed with George W Bush’s politics still supported him completely through 9/11. His approval rating came close to 90%. They didn’t support his other policies, but got behind him when we faced a national security crisis. Protesting vaccines to spite someone politically makes no sense.

There was plenty of "he's not my President" with George W. Bush because of the "hanging chads" and the feeling that the Supreme Court stole the election from Gore. The country got behind him after 9/11 but after a while that unity came to an end with some justification.

I disagree. You assume that all 70M people who voted for Trump are die hard trumpers that live in an alternate reality. There is a portion of the population that fits that mold. Many people who voted for Trump did so for many other reasons other than delusional hero worship. There are more independents than democrats or republicans and a number of them voted for Trump. Even within the Republican Party there are levels. I’m not foolish enough to think everyone can be convinced, but I think you underestimate the desire people have to get out of this pandemic. People are going to protest vaccines because Trump lost the election? That’s pathetic. I think it’s kinda sad that people would advocate resisting common sense public health initiatives just to spite the incoming administration because their guy lost.

I am what you might call a "die hard Trumper." Not because of cult hero worship but because I supported the things he was doing before COVID which I thought would improve the economy and the country. I didn't vote for him in the primary because of his abrasive personality but I turned into a supporter based on what he was doing as President. I also knew the second that COVID started spreading that he wouldn't be re-elected unless the Democrats nominated a really terrible candidate.

Anyway, as much as I am disappointed that he lost the election, I would never protest a COVID vaccine or support people spreading crazy reasons not to take it out of spite. I won't be against anything COVID-related under Biden that I wasn't already opposed to under Trump. I think you will find that the overwhelming majority of Trump voters are similar to me and not crazy cult member, hero worshippers that would commit mass suicide at Mara Lago. I am friends with a lot of them so I think I can make this assertion.

As I said in a prior post, I want the country to do well no matter who is President which means I would like COVID to go away without simultaneously destroying the economy or severely restricting freedoms. I live here and for at least the next four years (well probably only four years due to comments he has made) Joe Biden will be the President. It would certainly not be in my best interest to resist a vaccine just so everything can be horrible and my life can be miserable for four years which is probably 10% or more of my remaining life span.

Someday...when we’re back to debating rides, restaurants, fireworks and nonsense...we’ll go over divisiveness

Dangling chads were a symptom of the disease...not the cause

I look forward to that debate since it will come after this pandemic ends.