Well, that's what we've been discussing for the past several pages. That video rehashes what has already been posted here.
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Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Opens 2025
- Thread starter Bob Harlem
- Start date
Well, that's what we've been discussing for the past several pages. That video rehashes what has already been posted here.
The Grand Inquisitor
Well-Known Member
Sorry about that
Transport between the parks has been mentioned in passing in this thread but I think it’s something Universal will have to take more seriously than people are suggesting here.
At Disney, for guests who stay in one of the site hotels, part of the magic is that one can exist within the self-contained world, without the real world intruding, for the entire vacation.
People complain about the commuting between Disneyworld parks but at least you within the park grounds, which are green and well-kept. I have always been surprised that Disney hasn’t done more about theming these transport routes but at least you aren’t driving past convenience stores and trash filled front yards.
Perhaps most importantly, you won’t be stuck in long traffic jams.
And it’s not just a matter of a lower quality experience because of a hit to immersion and theming.
The incentive to stay in an onsite hotel, or shop in onsite facilities, is much reduced if parks are separated. There are plenty of cheaper hotels located between the parks.
At Disney, for guests who stay in one of the site hotels, part of the magic is that one can exist within the self-contained world, without the real world intruding, for the entire vacation.
People complain about the commuting between Disneyworld parks but at least you within the park grounds, which are green and well-kept. I have always been surprised that Disney hasn’t done more about theming these transport routes but at least you aren’t driving past convenience stores and trash filled front yards.
Perhaps most importantly, you won’t be stuck in long traffic jams.
And it’s not just a matter of a lower quality experience because of a hit to immersion and theming.
The incentive to stay in an onsite hotel, or shop in onsite facilities, is much reduced if parks are separated. There are plenty of cheaper hotels located between the parks.
lebeau
Well-Known Member
I think everyone here takes that topic pretty seriously. Several people including myself have mentioned it as their primary concern about Universal expanding. Some insiders have hinted that Universal is at least looking into options other than buses. But there's no verifiable information to go on here, so we will just have to wait and see.
The one thing that gives me hope is that to date Universal has handled transportation issues much better than Disney has. As long as they maintain that level of service, I don't care if I see the real world through a bus window on the way to and from the new park.
lebeau
Well-Known Member
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
So what do you want them to do, theme an entire city? Universal is already a metropolitan resort. It's not going to have the same feel or disconnect from "reality" as WDW no matter what they do. Disneyland has the same problem. Universal can still one-up Disneyland by not using filthy, decidedly unmagical city buses as their mode of transportation, but they're not about to go Hogwarts Express for a route like this. There are far worse parts of the city, and even I-Drive itself, anyway.
That's why they've already started building their own hotels between the parks. You also get what you pay for, both in the quality of the hotel itself and also the related amenities. People who want Express passes and easy access to the current parks will continue to stay on-site.
BubbaQuest
Well-Known Member
I'm not that worried about it, yet. I didn't drive that much outside the resorts, but I seem to remember Kirkman Road being a pretty nice road. Maybe I was just lucky with the time of day. If the rumors are true about dedicated bus lanes on Kirkman this could be a pretty fast transit method.
As long as they provide a nice air-conditioned bus with enough seats and I don't have to wait 20 minutes and crawl over 3 strollers to board, I'll be pretty happy.
lebeau
Well-Known Member
Don't forget waiting another 20 minutes while they load the ECVs. And then the bus is standing room only so you have to decide if you want to board a dangerously stuffed bus or wait another 20 minutes for the next one to roll up.
Jon81uk
Well-Known Member
Reports are at the moment that Universal has excess capacity on buses to resorts, some people have said the bus from Cabana Bay pulled off and got immediately replaced with another. They don't seem to operate them in the same way as Disney.
Downside is they drop at the City Walk bus station so you have a walk through City Walk to the parks.
lebeau
Well-Known Member
That's been my experience any time I have boarded a bus at Universal. The transportation situation is dramatically different. Disney's transportation is nightmarish. Universal does a much better job. Granted, Disney is dealing with a lot more guests, more pick-up and drop-off points, etc. It's a much more complicated problem. Universal has a comparatively simple problem to solve. I will be interested to see how they handle it when things get a little more complex with the expansion. I am cautiously optimistic the won't fall short to the extent Disney does.
Tom Morrow
Well-Known Member
Let's not gloss over the fact that, as is, Universal's transportation system does not have to cover anywhere even close to the amount of people that Disney does, let alone travel distance. It's real easy to have consistent buses to Cabana Bay when its right down the block.
JoeCamel
Well-Known Member
Yep, just takes putting enough busses on to handle the load. Longest I ever waited was when HHN was winding down and it was 10 minutes. For the most part they run them so the first bus doesn't leave til the next pulls in behind so you can wait in the AC. Just takes believing in your guests comfort enough to not leave them waiting for 20 minutes then every bus is standing room only
Tom Morrow
Well-Known Member
My point was that Disney already does have a massive fleet of buses. Considering the number of resorts and destinations amplified by travel distance, it would be a logistical nightmare to ensure another bus pulls up immediately, all the time, when the last one leaves, no matter where you are or where you're going. Universal currently has bus service to, I think, three hotels, all of which have the same single dropoff point that is literally right around the corner. It's way easier for Universal to accomplish immediate bus service because they only need two, maybe three tops, per hotel.
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JoeCamel
Well-Known Member
My point was that if Dis wanted to provide the same level of service they could. Double the fleet and it would be done. Massive or not is not a pass to not provide the same level of service. It only takes viewing the guest as more valuable.
And they run a fleet of boats to another three hotels the same way
Tom Morrow
Well-Known Member
Universal: ~12 buses needed for efficient transportation service (currently).
Disney: Fleet of 350-400 buses.
I'm not saying they couldn't do it, but it's not as simple as "just add more". The real problem is that WDW has expanded too much without investing in better mass transit options that it needs (the gondolas are a step in the right direction.. or might be... we'll see), but with the buses they do alright without completely jamming the roads with other buses. Twenty minutes between buses isn't really that bad for an operation of that scope. Also I would say ECVs are the bigger issue and probably what cause most of the delays.
But furthermore, too often I see a handful of you on here resort to the "but Disney!" complaint in response to any hint of criticism at UOR. The fact that other, often separate issues exist at WDW does not excuse or relieve UOR of criticism of it's own shortcomings, they are worth discussing on their own.
In this case it is worth discussing how Universal might address the transportation between the new and old property. I'm sure one exists, but I don't know of another large scale resort destination that 1. sells itself as an escape from the real world, and 2. has 1/3rd (and what will eventually be 1/2) of its property split with public land in between. I'm confident they will come up with an efficient solution (bus fleet with dedicated bus lanes should be enough), but my concern is what it will look like. Currently once you cross over I4 on Universal Blvd away from the existing property, it looks a bit dumpy until you cross Sand Lake Road. Often there are homeless here panhandling, for instance.
Disney: Fleet of 350-400 buses.
I'm not saying they couldn't do it, but it's not as simple as "just add more". The real problem is that WDW has expanded too much without investing in better mass transit options that it needs (the gondolas are a step in the right direction.. or might be... we'll see), but with the buses they do alright without completely jamming the roads with other buses. Twenty minutes between buses isn't really that bad for an operation of that scope. Also I would say ECVs are the bigger issue and probably what cause most of the delays.
But furthermore, too often I see a handful of you on here resort to the "but Disney!" complaint in response to any hint of criticism at UOR. The fact that other, often separate issues exist at WDW does not excuse or relieve UOR of criticism of it's own shortcomings, they are worth discussing on their own.
In this case it is worth discussing how Universal might address the transportation between the new and old property. I'm sure one exists, but I don't know of another large scale resort destination that 1. sells itself as an escape from the real world, and 2. has 1/3rd (and what will eventually be 1/2) of its property split with public land in between. I'm confident they will come up with an efficient solution (bus fleet with dedicated bus lanes should be enough), but my concern is what it will look like. Currently once you cross over I4 on Universal Blvd away from the existing property, it looks a bit dumpy until you cross Sand Lake Road. Often there are homeless here panhandling, for instance.
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lebeau
Well-Known Member
Exactly this.
I hear the argument that Disney has a more complicated transportation problem all the time. Acknowledged. Doesn't change the fact that their solution is woefully inadequate. If Universal needs 10 buses and they are running 12 and Disney needs 350 but are only running 325, one is still exceeding the need while the other is falling short.
For what they charge for the on property hotels, Disney can buy and operate more buses.
Disney has bought more buses a few years ago, spending about $20M for 50 of them. They've been adding more dedicated bus lanes all over the place. They've been adding bus-only entrances to the parks. They've been replacing crossroads that have traffic lights with fly-overs. They've added monitors to bus stops and your MDE app to track your bus. They're building the Skyliner which will divert all those buses to other resorts/parks. They built the new resort bus terminal next to MK gate so you can skip the TTC. They built a new bus terminal for DHS. They built a new bus terminal for Disney Springs.
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