Was the Magic of Disney a Secret?

[Chef Mickey]

Every year, Disney crowds grow. This is proven in hard numbers (increased attendance and park revenue) and in the "feel" of the parks as the years pass.

I remember back in the 90s, it was crowded, but only during peak times. Now, Disney World has seemingly become crowded almost all the time. I've gone in almost every month and although wait times are not really the issue, it "feels" more crowded. Fireworks, Parades, and food areas especially.

I feel Disney has always been great, but more people are discovering its allure and more people are taking more frequent trips.

What do you think?

 

[Tom]

There are many factors that have played into Disney's ever-increasing attendance, and ever-decreasing "slow times".

Generally speaking, families have more disposable income today than they did 20, 30 years ago. They're able to take vacations more often.

Word spreads exponentially. The more time that goes by, the more people will know about specific vacation destinations.

Ever-changing school schedules are allowing more families to take vacations during times that used to be considered slow, like Fall and just after New Years.

DVC Members have grown as well, and they tend to take their vacations during the "slow times", which has contributed to them not being as slow any more.

And, it's the age of technology. In the 90s, you weren't surrounded by media 24/7. Unless you saw a Disney commercial on TV, or your kids watched the Disney Channel, you weren't constantly reminded to visit. Now, if you so much as use the internet, you know WDW is still there.

 

[horizons82]

I'd certainly agree with this. But I'd also add that the Disney 'brand' itself has definitely expanded, which doesn't hurt in terms of being able to funnel more people into the parks.

I'm someone who loves Disney for the actual parks and not so much from a brand point of view. I've been going to the parks since the 80s, when my dad became employed there. I've been at least 100 times. The parks themselves are magical and special in so many ways. Call it fantasy, magic, escapism, whatever--all I know is that even as many times as I have gone the impact never seems to go away with each visit. The ability to immerse oneself in such an amazing environment and enjoy such a wide-range of attractions is something special.

OTOH, I will say the heavier crowds do lessen the ability to enjoy the parks. When it's so full that you can't see the landscaping, buildings, architecture and all of the little details that make the park so wonderful, the overall experience is lower. If you were to ask me what made one visit any better or worse than another, the crowd, wait times and amount of people there would usually be the deciding factor.

As someone who has been going to the parks for quite a while, I will say there are definitely larger crowds now than there used to be. Until a few years ago I never remember seeing a CM having to hold a sign showing where a queue actually started because the line had outgrown the original queue area, and this was no special day or holiday.

So yes, there has been an increase in crowds over the years, but we've also had continual population increase and the expansion of the Disney brand. It also doesn't help that we have four separate parks that likely draws quite a few people here.

At some point I think there may be a tipping point to where guests don't see enough return on the cost for a visit or that the wait times, crowds and overall experience will dip below what the threshold is for repeat visits. But as long as there are 'new' guests always coming, that will keep things moving in the direction they currently are.

Just my $.02

 

[MY_NAME_STITCH]

While there has always been an allure to WDW, there appears to be more people taking advantage of it. In the past, there were times of the year when most people took vacation and you could always expect those times to be busier than others. Today, this is no longer the case. Many people don't seem to have a problem with taking the kids out of school and off to the parks at any time during the year. Couple that with the appeal of the parks in Europe, Canada, and South America and it's easy to see why the parks are crowded year around. Although it would be great to have a down period when the crowds were low, as soon as everyone found out about it, it would get crowded as well.

 

[Nemo14]

A lot probably has to do with heavy marketing/discounts to international markets.

 

[rob0519]

Let's not forget the increase in international travelers. Disney marketing has done an exceptional job of enticing visitors from the U.K., South America, and Asia in particular with deep lodging discounts not offered in the U.S. They help fill what used to be the slow seasons as well.

 

[horizons82]

Although it would be great to have a down period when the crowds were low, as soon as everyone found out about it, it would get crowded as well.

I think this plays a huge role as to why we have so few days with lower park attendance. The busy season is SO busy now that you have those who can making plans and arrangements to go during what was traditionally the slower season to be able to better enjoy their trip. Plus, the Internet and ability to make reservations and look up info and read-up in advance has helped move things in this direction as well.

And for anyone who uses on-line crowd calendar guides to help with deciding the level of crowds on a given day, I have a feeling those numbers are based on just that year and not against all-time crowd levels. What is listed as a 3 or 4 level on crowd calendars the past few years was probably more like a 5, 6 or 7 many years ago. So that has to be taken into account and not having inflated expectations.

 

[Chef Mickey]

Thanks for the feedback. I agree with all of the points mentioned, but ask this question:

At some point, when does the crowd ruin the experience?

I've made this point before about Disney World outgrowing even its immense space. They still have limited space in the MK and you can begin to see restaurants and walk up food areas becoming too crowded. Sure, Fast Pass has helped with attraction wait times, but it's getting harder and harder to move around.

Strollers and electric scooters have also contributed to ruining the experience for the average guest. These take up so much space, it's like doubling or tripling a guest's footprint.

I don't know the answer, but Disney will have to think of a way to control attendance enough to keep the quality high. Unfortunately, I don't think they care as much about the repeat guest since they have such a huge amount of first timers and infrequent travelers.

I do see the quality decreasing in the experience because taking the rides out of the equation, it can get tiring fighting the crowds in EVERY other aspect. Food. Parades. Fireworks. And just trying to enjoy the scenery. It's hard to stroll around the parks now.

 

[horizons82]

Thanks for the feedback. I agree with all of the points mentioned, but ask this question:

At some point, when does the crowd ruin the experience?

I do see the quality decreasing in the experience because taking the rides out of the equation, it can get tiring fighting the crowds in EVERY other aspect. Food. Parades. Fireworks. And just trying to enjoy the scenery. It's hard to stroll around the parks now.

I'd equate this to people talking, making noise and using devices in a movie theater. The more it happens and the more people do it, the less one is going to really enjoy the movie. At some point if it gets too bad people are just going to stay home.

I'm not trying to compare the magic of the Disney parks to watching a movie, but just in terms of being able to enjoy the experience in spite of crowds/people taking from it.

 

[Chef Mickey]

I'd equate this to people talking, making noise and using devices in a movie theater. The more it happens and the more people do it, the less one is going to really enjoy the movie. At some point if it gets too bad people are just going to stay home.

I'm not trying to compare the magic of the Disney parks to watching a movie, but just in terms of being able to enjoy the experience in spite of crowds/people taking from it.

Excellent point. I have gotten so sick of movie theaters over the years (Talking, texting, eating, etc) that I have spent almost $10,000 building a home theater in my house where we can enjoy movies and sound just like the theater.

Unfortunately, $10,000 won't buy me a Disney

It's very true. People can ruin an experience with their obnoxious behavior and the sheer volume of guests wanting to maximize their experience.

 

[rob0519]

For us the crowds are now at the level of taking the enjoyment out of WDW. Finding an available week at one of two of our favorite resorts has become difficult and approaching prohibitively expensive. MK is land locked, yet more and people, strollers and ECVs are crammed in there every day. People and families jockey for tables at quick serve restaurants while management allows several locations to remain shuttered for what can only be cost saving motives. I firmly believe at least the WDW management does not care much about repeat business. The DVC people are locked in and there seem to be and endless supply of people to take our place. We will be trying our first Disney cruise next month instead going back to the world. After last year's visit I just couldn't give them that kind of money again without at least taking a break

 

[Chef Mickey]

For us the crowds are now at the level of taking the enjoyment out of WDW. Finding an available week at one of two of our favorite resorts has become difficult and approaching prohibitively expensive. MK is land locked, yet more and people, strollers and ECVs are crammed in there every day. People and families jockey for tables at quick serve restaurants while management allows several locations to remain shuttered for what can only be cost saving motives. I firmly believe at least the WDW management does not care much about repeat business. The DVC people are locked in and there seem to be and endless supply of people to take our place. We will be trying our first Disney cruise next month instead going back to the world. After last year's visit I just couldn't give them that kind of money again without at least taking a break

I'm not quite to the point that's completely ruined the experience for me, but it truly has changed enough for me to notice and worry about the future. They have to say, enough is enough and start limiting the amount of people coming through or significantly expanded just the common areas. They have solved the attraction wait times with Fast Pass/Fast Pass+ but they have work to do if they want to maintain greatness.

 

[Figmentation]

My own opinion:

I'm still 'fairly new' to going to the parks on the 'off-season'. I've gone to the parks so many times that I can't count them anymore, but a MAJORITY of those times was during the Spring Break season, or the Holiday season due to being out of school during those periods of time.

It wasn't until I was in college when I was able to start going during the Feb-May slow times, or the Sept-Nov slow times. Of course, I could never go back to the parks again during Spring Break or the Holidays... it just felt too busy, too much of a issue to even move around.

What some people have mentioned above are 100% correct, technology is helping promote the parks more, introducing it to a younger generation who wants to go.

But you also have to take into consideration the long time fans like me (And almost everyone on here).
We're older now.
Those who visited the park back in the olden days only during the busy season are now taking their own families, or even just themselves whenever they feel like going. No more waiting til Spring Break or the Holidays, just drop 3-5 days of vacation time at work and head off to the parks.

So, you have the old crowds going when they feel like it, plus new people (Old and young) being introduced through advances in advertisment and technology. The parks will be busier during the 'off-season' and packed during the 'on-season'

 

[Britt]

Crowds absolutely ruin the experience for me. I do not like crowds, I don't like masses of people moving together.....I feel my anxiety at an all time high and frequently head to the back of the park after fireworks to wait out the masses.

We chose to take our kids out of school to be able to go during the "slow" time, and while maybe it's not particularly "slow", it's not like our first trip, which was during Spring Break. I bet it would have been an AMAZING time had it not been for the crowds...everything was perfect about that trip...except the crowds. lol

And yet....it's still where we chose to go and spend our money. The themes, the characters, the cast members, the music, the smells.....it's the one place where I can go from one resort to another, to another, to a park, without having to get into a car or leave the property. Where one card (or band) works as payment, keys, entry way. It's the one place I can let my son go get in line for a ride alone, while I sit on a bench and let him have a blast (I would NEVER do that anywhere else). It feels safe and happy....so I chose to continue going.

UGH. I cant wait to go back :/ So hoping we make it back this year! LOL

 

[morningstar]

Disney is doing a better job as a business to keep attendance at peak at all times. By offering discounts and promotions in the off-season, they encourage attendance. Since a lot of people now get their food, lodging, and tickets direct from Disney, they have a lot of ways they can offer discounts and packages. In the old days when most people only got their tickets and maybe ala carte food from Disney, it was hard for them to make as interesting offers.

 

[Britt]

Disney is doing a better job as a business to keep attendance at peak at all times. By offering discounts and promotions in the off-season, they encourage attendance. Since a lot of people now get their food, lodging, and tickets direct from Disney, they have a lot of ways they can offer discounts and packages. In the old days when most people only got their tickets and maybe ala carte food from Disney, it was hard for them to make as interesting offers.

Right? They offer great promotions. If they offer their free dining in Sept/Oct the way they usually do...they can count on my family being there this year for sure

 

[EOD K9]

For us the crowds are now at the level of taking the enjoyment out of WDW. Finding an available week at one of two of our favorite resorts has become difficult and approaching prohibitively expensive. MK is land locked, yet more and people, strollers and ECVs are crammed in there every day. People and families jockey for tables at quick serve restaurants while management allows several locations to remain shuttered for what can only be cost saving motives. I firmly believe at least the WDW management does not care much about repeat business. The DVC people are locked in and there seem to be and endless supply of people to take our place. We will be trying our first Disney cruise next month instead going back to the world. After last year's visit I just couldn't give them that kind of money again without at least taking a break

True dat. The wife and I discovered our first Disney Cruise last year. We have found that DCL and their CMs have what should be the essence of Disney Magic more than in the parks. You'll get bitten by the bug and want to cruise more often.

 

[TubaGeek]

I think the solution is to build another park to spread out the crowd, but I wouldn't want that to happen till they maintain and fill what they have.
Unfortunately, neither look like they're gonna happen anytime soon.

 

[EOD K9]

I think the solution is to build another park to spread out the crowd, but I wouldn't want that to happen till they maintain and fill what they have.
Unfortunately, neither look like they're gonna happen anytime soon.

Said park should also not be rushed or budget engineered. It needs to be well planned, thought out, and executed to the standards that MK originally opened with.

 

[Disvillain63]

Disney is doing a better job as a business to keep attendance at peak at all times. By offering discounts and promotions in the off-season, they encourage attendance. Since a lot of people now get their food, lodging, and tickets direct from Disney, they have a lot of ways they can offer discounts and packages. In the old days when most people only got their tickets and maybe ala carte food from Disney, it was hard for them to make as interesting offers.

Disney is also planning more...meaning that they are doing more things during the 'non-peak' times that will make them 'peak' times...marathons and other running events, F&W, F&G, etc...