Len Testa - “Disney positions itself as the all-American vacation. The irony is that most Americans can’t afford it.”

[Miss Bella]

Canada not doing so hot either https://www.newser.com/story/377581/why-young-canadians-are-doom-spending.html

It’s a global phenomenon. Europe is worse off.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Canada not doing so hot either https://www.newser.com/story/377581/why-young-canadians-are-doom-spending.html

Increase maple syrup production!!!

 

[HauntedPirate]

Increase maple syrup production!!!

Add in maple candies and...

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I'm extrapolating, but based on experience I'm confident most of these folks would book if they could.

American CC debt is at $1.21 trillion, more people are carrying balances, and consumer cards classified as "in distress" hit a 12-year high earlier this year. It's tougher for a lot of people now that it has been in a while.

That 12 year number is very telling/important

 

[Disstevefan1]

I believe Disney is just a symptom of the economy.

A lot of folks want to blame everything on the economy.

Disney has constantly raised prices on everything for decades and decades, its just now there is social media and everyone can post about it.

I think today's Disney is no longer worried about attendance, I think today they are focused in per capita spending, even more of a reason to keep raising prices on everything to get more money from less people.

 

[Miss Bella]

Disney has constantly raised prices on everything for decades and decades, its just now there is social media and everyone can post about it.

I

You could say the same thing for Universal and every cruise line and hotel chain. Food, rent, energy, automobiles, insurance health care....what hasn't gone up? Disney's got to pay the bills too you know.

 

[Disstevefan1]

You could say the same thing for Universal and every cruise line and hotel chain. Food, rent, energy, automobiles, insurance health care....what hasn't gone up? Disney's got to pay the bills too you know.

Yes and prices have gone up for decades for all these. There is nothing new about this.

What is new is all the places like social media, discussion forums and YouTube to publicly complain about it.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Let’s remember that Disney is not in danger at all of “not covering bills”

They should be willing to accept “reduced margins” temporarily to preserve their audience on a longer term basis

Thats what good management would do

 

[Jrb1979]

You could say the same thing for Universal and every cruise line and hotel chain. Food, rent, energy, automobiles, insurance health care....what hasn't gone up? Disney's got to pay the bills too you know.

Yes everything has gone up. From what I have seen is the higher end vacation places like Disney, Universal, Ski Resorts and cruises have gone up a lot more than a lot of lot of the middle class vacation places.

Myrtle Beach and Pigeon Forge and vacation places on that level haven't give up in price as much as Disney and Universal and those on that level have.

For Disney a lot of it is due having to show increased profits each quarter.

 

[Miss Bella]

Yes everything has gone up. From what I have seen is the higher end vacation places like Disney, Universal, Ski Resorts and cruises have gone up a lot more than a lot of lot of the middle class vacation places.

Myrtle Beach and Pigeon Forge and vacation places on that level haven't give up in price as much as Disney and Universal and those on that level have.

For Disney a lot of it is due having to show increased profits each quarter.

The solution is easy don’t go to Disney. As long as people are willing to pay it they’ll charge it.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The solution is easy don’t go to Disney. As long as people are willing to pay it they’ll charge it.

That would imply reliance on a very simplified “S&D” curve…

More complicated with Disney

 

[Miss Bella]

Let’s remember that Disney is not in eager at all of “not covering bills”

They should be willing to accept “reduced margins” temporarily to preserve their audience on a longer term basis

Thats what good management would do

They will when you stop giving them your money. You can’t complain about the cost of something and continue to hand them your wallet. It’s not a necessity.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

They will when you stop giving them your money. You can’t complain about the cost of something and continue to hand them your wallet. It’s not a necessity.

See previous post

 

[Jrb1979]

The solution is easy don’t go to Disney. As long as people are willing to pay it they’ll charge it.

That's the thing, attendance has been down or flat since 2019. People have stopped going.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Because they have gone up faster than incomes. It’s called stagflation.

Ha, for decades prices at WDW have gone up faster the incomes. Its called business.

They never let us forget WDW is just a business.

This will be even more true in the future at WDW with Carsland.

 

[HauntedPirate]

Ha, for decades prices at WDW have gone up faster the incomes. Its called business.

They never let us forget WDW is just a business.

This will be even more true in the future at WDW with Carsland.

Yeah, that dollar per day price increase in 1995 killed my trip plans. Couldn’t pull it off with that massive ticket price increase. Even worse - the $1.25 increase in 1997. I almost had to call the trip off because of it.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Yes I agree inflation is a lot more complicated then simple supply and demand. I think I said that in an earlier post.

I was more commenting on Disney…they have a Much more loyal following than they probably deserve due to rep and nostalgia…but defections are hitting them a lot harder. That’s the “cost” you suffer for that benefit of the doubt.

They won’t admit it…but it’s real. And that’s why having bad managers using bad theories is such a big festering “wound” of a problem…

 

[PREMiERdrum]

Per cap spending increases will only offset a declining bodycount for so long.

The model of WDW that we've known for the past 30 years is fundamentally incompatible with a shrinking customer base. Their focus on "short return visits" playing off of FOMO with special parties and cupcakes gave fewer folks incentive to book those once every few years, once a decade, or once in a lifetime trips. They became far too fixated on catering to a base of regular visitors, because reaching those people with treats and tchotchkes is far cheaper than consistent major, marketable attraction development.

This focus has removed plenty of diversity from their portfolio of potential customers, and left them extremely vulnerable to a situation like is starting to come into focus: A regular cadence of price increases outpacing inflation has brought them past the figurative mendoza line right at the outset of a "regular folk recession."

The product can't really be right-sized, quarterly-focused executives can't stomach the needed fix to their pricing model and perceived product value, and the company's other divisions can't handle the cashflow generated by the parks drying up.

Whatever they do will be in business books - assuming books are still allowed - for generations to come.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Per cap spending increases will only offset a declining bodycount for so long.

The model of WDW that we've known for the past 30 years is fundamentally incompatible with a shrinking customer base. Their focus on "short return visits" playing off of FOMO with special parties and cupcakes gave fewer folks incentive to book those once every few years, once a decade, or once in a lifetime trips. They became far too fixated on catering to a base of regular visitors, because reaching those people with treats and tchotchkes is far cheaper than consistent major, marketable attraction development.

This focus has removed plenty of diversity from their portfolio of potential customers, and left them extremely vulnerable to a situation like is starting to come into focus: A regular cadence of price increases outpacing inflation has brought them past the figurative mendoza line right at the outset of a "regular folk recession."

The product can't really be right-sized, quarterly-focused executives can't stomach the needed fix to their pricing model and perceived product value, and the company's other divisions can't handle the cashflow generated by the parks drying up.

Whatever they do will be in business books - assuming books are still allowed - for generations to come.

Mmmmm hmmmm

 

[Miss Bella]

Per cap spending increases will only offset a declining bodycount for so long.

The model of WDW that we've known for the past 30 years is fundamentally incompatible with a shrinking customer base. Their focus on "short return visits" playing off of FOMO with special parties and cupcakes gave fewer folks incentive to book those once every few years, once a decade, or once in a lifetime trips. They became far too fixated on catering to a base of regular visitors, because reaching those people with treats and tchotchkes is far cheaper than consistent major, marketable attraction development.

This focus has removed plenty of diversity from their portfolio of potential customers, and left them extremely vulnerable to a situation like is starting to come into focus: A regular cadence of price increases outpacing inflation has brought them past the figurative mendoza line right at the outset of a "regular folk recession."

The product can't really be right-sized, quarterly-focused executives can't stomach the needed fix to their pricing model and perceived product value, and the company's other divisions can't handle the cashflow generated by the parks drying up.

Whatever they do will be in business books - assuming books are still allowed - for generations to come.

They will either figure it out or fail. I'm betting they will figure it out after they fail and in the mean time I'll be sitting it out.