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Len Testa - “Disney positions itself as the all-American vacation. The irony is that most Americans can’t afford it.”

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AidenRodriguez731

Well-Known Member
Touchdown said:
Meanwhile, at the competition, Universal’s business is changing. It was pretty clear to me that the hotels were quite full, Hard Rock certainly was. HHN was as crowded as it ever was, but attendance is either flat or only mildly increased because IOA and USF day attendance is way down compared to previous years, VB seemed steady, and obviously Epic is doing well. Clearly the attempt to force USF and IOA days in exchange for Epic days wasn’t working as starting in January vacationers will be able to hop at will. I suspect that will bring an end to evening at Epic being quieter as with its later close, especially come Jan/Feb a lot of vacationers are going to hop there at night. Going to be interesting to see the dynamic, especially with APs still blocked from included admission as part of their pass. I suspect Universal is going to lose a lot of APs over that and VB closing next fall in the coming year. Expect Comcast to focus on their higher per cap spending in their filings.
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I would not call what Epic is going through "doing well" considering its operating at less than Disney's least visited Florida park and the lowest rated park in Orlando right now. Not to mention even with vastly less rides + experiences, DAK is still able to "comfortably" hold much more than Epic is.
 
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Touchdown

Well-Known Member
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AidenRodriguez731 said:
I would not call what Epic is going through "doing well" considering it’s operating at less than Disney's least visited Florida park and the lowest rated park in Orlando right now. Not to mention even with vastly less rides + experiences, DAK is still able to "comfortably" hold much more than Epic is.
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It’s constantly coming close to selling out of its capacity. The fact it doesn’t have a higher capacity is a problem, but not one of sales. Everyone wants to go there. The Ministry ride only operating on less then 50% capacity in addition to the decision not to double the tracks for Mine Cart Madness is what’s really kneecapping things. Sounds like plans are already in the works to add onto the park.
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
AidenRodriguez731 said:
I would not call what Epic is going through "doing well" considering its operating at less than Disney's least visited Florida park and the lowest rated park in Orlando right now. Not to mention even with vastly less rides + experiences, DAK is still able to "comfortably" hold much more than Epic is.
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That’s ironic considering it’s only been open 5 months…

If you want get a good gauge of where it’s at…you’re gonna have to see the 2026 attendance…

Comcast hopes attendance doesn’t fall…like it did at DAK after its first 2
Years…

But they are at an advantage too…because if they need to expand or sure it up…they can get something built in 18-24 months…

As opposed to 3-5 years for fancy refurbs
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
tommyhawkins said:
Does it matter if every park is treated and counted the same way?

Personally I would look at the difference between the most popular and the other parks at the resort for signs of creative accounting of visits. For example the difference between IOA and USF is only 250k. Yet more than 7milion between DL and DCA. Anyway it's a total minefield and opens more questions like what's the true number of visitors to a resort if people who go to both parks are being counted twice
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No one is questioning their volume…(that they have the most…breaking news from 1955) what’s in question is how it’s doing at this point and time?

And it’s not particularly well…

The built things well in the 70’s and 80’s…today is largely dependent on that. But that’s not a reflection of the current trajectory.

And as stated…having 25% more “days” counted than there are actually days on this planet throws all the numbers out of whack and is used to hide problems…and get rubes to buy things that don’t benefit them.
 
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HauntedPirate

HauntedPirate

Park nostalgist
Premium Member
Christ... again with the "lowest rated theme park in Orlando" BS? "It has 342 ratings and it's below Sea World. See?!?!? Just ignore the fact that other parks have 178,000 ratings, I have indisputable proof that Epic is the lowest rated park and I'm going to put it on repeat ad naseum because I have a Disney agenda to defend!!!!!"
 
T

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
I would seriously fight back with this instance of worst reviewed park in Orlando. It has some phenomenal rides. Monsters Unchained is my new favorite dark ride, Ministry is extremely impressive, Mariokart is fun. Stardust is a fantastic coaster, hiccup wing gliders is very fun, mine cart madness is also a childhood dream come true. The food is fantastic. I’m not confident of where I granularly put this but for me Epic is in the same category of park as MK, Epcot and IOA, ie top tier park.
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Where did these “rankings” come from?

Since they keep getting tossed around everytime a certain operator in town needs an unsolicited excuse from fanboys….

There are 2 pretty glaring issues with epic that I observed…but lower “ranked” than USO? or frankly mgm?

That’s not too accurate.
 
Agent H

Agent H

Well-Known Member
If I was ranking all the Disney and universal parks in Orlando epic universe would probably be the middle of the pack right next to hollywood studios. It would be below magic kingdom and animal kingdom but above Epcot and the other two universal parks. It’s placemaking and theming are superior to Hollywood studios overall but I find their best rides to be roughly the same level of quality. I haven’t seen either of epic’s shows but they can’t be significantly better than fantasmic.
 
T

Trauma

Well-Known Member
Sirwalterraleigh said:
So the truth seems to be what it appears to be?

This all lines up to an old carmuggeon watcher (my body says Gen X…my brain was transported from the past in an unsanctioned marvel esque science experiment gone wrong) like me…no matter how many disingenuous proclamations of roaring business are made from the echo chambers in Orlando and Burbank…

The ship continues to leak.

Thank you, sir
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No Walter the truth is what Bob says it is.

He can’t tell a lie remember ?
 
T

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
Agent H said:
If I was ranking all the Disney and universal parks in Orlando epic universe would probably be the middle of the pack right next to hollywood studios. It would be below magic kingdom and animal kingdom but above Epcot and the other two universal parks. It’s placemaking and theming are superior to Hollywood studios overall but I find their best rides to be roughly the same level of quality. I haven’t seen either of epic’s shows but they can’t be significantly better than fantasmic.
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Fantasmic is a nighttime spectacular and is far better but not a fair comparison. The two Epic shows are superior to any daytime DHS show. The untrainable dragon has a full size animatronic Toothless manned by a real Hiccup fly over the entire audience and then land on stage where Hiccup dismounts and then Toothless takes off and flies away. Cirque Arcanue eventually takes place in Newt’s suitcase where all sorts of magical creatures appear (mostly as puppets and animatronics.)
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
LittleBuford said:
YouTube comments don't provide rankings.

The TripAdvisor reviews have also been mentioned in this regard:

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Ok…so after reading through the TA complaints…my take:

There is a lot of validity to many of those complaints.
1. It doesn’t handle the weather AT ALL. That’s the worst offense.
2. It’s under equipped for crowds…but that can be addressed.
3. The breakdowns are a big problem…but that can also be addressed. That has a lot to do with how the operators ( all of them) have begun to “bass ackwards” their pricing and profit strategies.
4. It is a “caste system” no doubt…and That’s rampant across travel and does and should bring a hell of a lot of criticism to pay.

The success or failure…”ratings”…will shake out based on what they do or don’t do to fix the park? And do you know the last 5 or so “new parks” in the US…they are:
Epic
California adventure
IOA
DAK
USO
MGM

That’s the list…for the whole darn country.

The reason I bring this up is what park amongst those didn’t suffer from major “underbuild” problems?

The answer is one: islands of adventure…the rest were all lacking and some still are…uso is in the worst shape now…California adventure has made the most strides (shocking) as it stands…my opinion.

But also the tank reviews on TA have some things that trigger the smell test:
1. “We were there on the last day of a 14 day combo ticket” has some baggage - from across the pond attached to it. They (it’s the truth) have been bombing TA reviews for decades. Sometimes legit…sometimes things not in the control of the operator at all. What sense is that?
2. Our party ranged from a 7 year old neuro divergent to a 75 year old…

…ummm…yeah…just a couple of things there
3. Complaints about the customers. Again…out of the control of the proprietors and should never be the basis of a review.


My take is the reviews are 50/50…some
Legit and some redonkulous. As is with the internet often times.

They built the park…they deserve the right to tweak it and see…that’s fair.
 

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