MK Cars-Themed Attractions at Magic Kingdom

[mattpeto]

I honestly thought Beyond BTM was always "beyond" and not adjacent because that's not really Beyond.

I just wonder if this is what they had in mind the entire time. In the original 2022 expo video (blue sky with Coco/Encanto/VL in this space and Moana/Zootopia at AK) Beatty mentions "new Frontiers". New Frontiers doesn't sound like a new land to me so Coco/Encanto would have also been part of FL I'd imagine.

Then when everyone thought Disney was going to axe Frontierland completely, they double-downed on it.

"But hold your horses, we’re not done yet. We have a lot of growth and investment planned for our theme parks in the coming years and look forward to sharing more announcements about Frontierland … so y’all come back now, ya hear?"

That was from January 2024.

They also keep calling it the biggest expansion since New Fantasyland/GE and we I believe we confirmed the acreage of TSI/RoA does make that math work.

We probably got bamboozled and didn't realize it. It was likely always TSI/RoA that was getting replaced.

 

[danlb_2000]

Red - Destroy
Green/Yellow - Save.

So what is the difference between Green and Yellow?

 

[easyrowrdw]

So what is the difference between Green and Yellow?

Blue

 

[danlb_2000]

I don't have any capacity numbers...

The LLMP for speedway on average sells out before: Buzz Lightyear, Carpets, Pirates, Barnstormer, Mermaid, Dumbo, mad tea party, and small world.

Wait times in MK is currently pretty dead... but it does have a 10 min wait which is more than peoplemover, carpets, small world, dumbo and barnstormer (tied with Pirates and Mermaid)

It's not my cup of tea either... I never really ride it, but its far from a dead attraction.

Do you have anything to show that it is unpopular?

Speedway also has an edge because it stays open later the the riverboard and island.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

We probably got bamboozled and didn't realize it. It was likely always TSI/RoA that was getting replaced.

That’s the big question - I think coco was always “beyond” but Encanto may have been the TSI plot or what would have connected coco to Villians.

 

[mattpeto]

That’s the big question - I think coco was always “beyond” but Encanto may have been the TSI plot or what would have connected coco to Villians.

Just looking back at some older @PREMiERdrum posts, I don't believe he thought it was TSI FWIW.

There are two decidedly different, focused plans being leaked. They've both been discussed here.

I know which direction I think things will go. I don't know if the extra noise is meant as a red herring, or if there are still internal players jockeying for a final greenlight.

As it appears to sit:

Properties under development:
- Coco E-ticket / FL expansion
- Moana E-ticket
- Radiator Springs Racers (attraction only, not Carsland a la DCA)
- Dark Kingdom (E-ticket, ancillary attractions, guest facilities)

Sites under review:
- MK, AL expansion pad
- MK, west of BTM (phase 1)
- MK, north of BTM (phase 2)
- DHS, northwest corner

Put on a blindfold and pin the tail. Or something like that.

Still it's hard to think this wasn't part of their grand plan all along. They look at TSI as wasted space (just like Muppets Courtyard).

Would be nice if they felt as strongly as Launch Bay and commerical properties behind it. Just think that's more of a undertaking and for whatever the reason, maybe they don't have the plan locked down yet.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I honestly thought Beyond BTM was always "beyond" and not adjacent because that's not really Beyond.

I just wonder if this is what they had in mind the entire time. In the original 2022 expo video (blue sky with Coco/Encanto/VL in this space and Moana/Zootopia at AK) Beatty mentions "new Frontiers". New Frontiers doesn't sound like a new land to me so Coco/Encanto would have also been part of FL I'd imagine.

Then when everyone thought Disney was going to axe Frontierland completely, they double-downed on it.


That was from January 2024.

They also keep calling it the biggest expansion since New Fantasyland/GE and we I believe we confirmed the acreage of TSI/RoA does make that math work.

We probably got bamboozled and didn't realize it. It was likely always TSI/RoA that was getting replaced.

From that first concept art it definitely looks more "beyond" than what we are getting now but did look to me like would at least take away the top part of TSI/upper river

I always figured it would require modification of the river but after they did that at DLR for GE I figured that is what it would be, but at a minimum the bottom part of TSI and lower River "loop" would stay .... But obviously incorrect and maybe that was the plan all along they just kept that part obtuse

 

[mattpeto]

I was surprised and thrilled when this artwork popped up last night.

The trajectory, as it was explained to me, was that these projects were a bit volatile because of the ballooning cost of building the as-envisioned BBTM project. When the leading proposal was the Mesa Village of Coco transitioning immediately past BTMRR which then brought you to a dark woodline as the path continued into a Dark Kingdom concept, the cost projections to achieve suitability were skyrocketing. A direction explored here was a treatment of Villains that created a bizzaro village where they'd set up camp. This is when I started warning about expectations. Showing the OG concept art last night and promising 2 major attractions, the right proposal for the property was chosen.

I'm concerned that the Cars projects got the nod because they could fit on the remains of TSI/ROA, allowing them to do a less-expensive and smaller single-phase BBTM with Villains. Reading the tea leaves from last night, this seems to fit.

Or, if Cars and Villains are both going in the "big loop" BBTM original vision, the ballooning costs of that project could have been enough to kill the was-ready-to-go-months-ago Moana project.

At least Disney confirmed two major attractions are still coming to VL. But VL will likely be smaller than everyone was hoping.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Our trusted insider has indicated RoA was on and off the table many atimes for many years.

Yes, but that also means that nothing ever made it past concept design and feasibility. Lots of things end up on the table and people often assume that means projects were much further along.

Yes and…. Disney very recently got a brand new boiler for the Liberty Belle - one would assume they ran numbers and decided to keep it operating before that kind of decision was made.

To the extent they did it would have been within the context of not having an alternative.

 

[peter11435]

Yes and…. Disney very recently got a brand new boiler for the Liberty Belle - one would assume they ran numbers and decided to keep it operating before that kind of decision was made.

I wouldn’t exactly say that was very recently. That was before Covid.

I wouldn’t call 7 years ago very recently.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I honestly thought Beyond BTM was always "beyond" and not adjacent because that's not really Beyond.

It always was 'beyond.'

From a certain point of view.

Seriously, West of BTM past the tracks was considered a future expansion pad when RoA wasn't under the ax.

When you get to BTM and/or the Frontierland RR station, all you got is either West or North (or both). Both are indeed *beyond* BTM.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I wouldn’t exactly say that was very recently. That was before Covid.

The before-times?

I've heard stories of that long-ago.

 

[BagOfGroceries]

So what is the difference between Green and Yellow?

I forget which is which, but one means reuse, another means archive.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I wouldn’t exactly say that was very recently. That was before Covid.

I wouldn’t call 7 years ago very recently.

When it comes to a brand new boiler - 7 years is extremely recent. Haha. That’s not even half of an FRA mandated inspection for locomotives that fall under those regulations.

 

[danlb_2000]

Looks like they may have started to lower the water level..

 

[Disney Analyst]

Looks like they may have started to lower the water level..

View attachment 870233

Frontierland about to get stinky!

 

[EricsBiscuit]

I wouldn’t exactly say that was very recently. That was before Covid.

I wouldn’t call 7 years ago very recently.

You’re right it was the 2018 refurb which brought in the automatic feed pump and boiler, among other things.

 

[Drew the Disney Dude]

 

[EeyoreFan#24]

One thing that was out was the steam generator. It was out for a couple months at least before the 7th.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

One thing that was out was the steam generator. It was out for a couple months at least before the 7th.

Correct, Terry the Turbine did not make it to the end. The turbine was one piece of equipment they had a very hard time finding replacement parts for.