Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Now Open!

[DavidDL]

Sorry for the double post, but I just recalled one of the most "messed up" moments we witnessed at Epic Universe.

Some context: when the Dragon show broke down, we were handed a one time Express pass upon exiting for anything that wasn't DK or Potter. We decided to save it for a night time ride on Stardust Racers to close out our trip (we had ridden it once during the day already).

So we get there and there's hardly a line. Still, we decide we may as well skip what's there and use our one time Express pass. When we got to the merge point, the TM working there was like "Are you sure you want to use these? They're good until September and there's no line". We told him that we were aware but that we were flying back home tomorrow. I said, "Maybe you take those and hold on to 'em for us and make some magic for another party of two before they expire?" He nodded, agreeing and saying that was definitely a good idea and that he would.

Just then, another TM who was next to him and listening in (his superior, I imagine), stepped in and took the tickets from him and coldly stated, "No, I'll take those" before disposing of them.

I feel awful for that first TM. For a brief moment, he had a glimmer of happiness in his eyes when he realized he might be able to do something special for someone with his role at the park. Only for that to immediately be snatched away in front of all three of us. I was absolutely flabbergasted.

 

[disneylandtour]

It's been interesting to watch--and go to--Epic this year. Two months ago, the park was poised to be one of the premiere parks in the US. But it seems like the excitement has come and gone. Not everything working. Team member issues. Very hot. Some long lines and low capacity rides. The Potter area is still amazing--probably the best art directed land anywhere in the world. And Le Cirque Arcanus is top shelf. But there were months of technical rehearsals. It seems like things should be operating better by now, but not all team members seem fully trained and some of the rides still have issues, which is forgivable. It takes teams a while to get complex rides fully functional. I did enjoy my time there. But I really don't think about my visits to the park very much. When I compare this to the months of public excitement for Galaxy's Edge after it opened--even with out the full entertainment package at GE--I sorta wonder how did Epic not fully capture this moment? That's mostly what I'm wondering--where were the missteps, as this should've fully been Epic's summer, but a few weeks after opening, it doesn't feel that way.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Moving this to a more appropriate thread...

I think classifying the Monsters area as IP is a bit of a stretch as nobody has seen those movies in theaters unless they were born literally 100 years ago.

Universal Classic Monsters is definitely an IP. They've been trying to revive a Universal Monsters cinematic universe for the past few decades. Their other park uses this franchise quite openly. The Mummy Ride is supposed to be part of this franchise.

Recently..

• The Invisible Man February 28, 2020
• Renfield April 14, 2023
• The Last Voyage of the Demeter August 11, 2023
• Wolf Man January 17, 2025

It is by all definitions of an IP, an IP.

Universal Monsters - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Sir_Cliff]

It's been interesting to watch--and go to--Epic this year. Two months ago, the park was poised to be one of the premiere parks in the US. But it seems like the excitement has come and gone. Not everything working. Team member issues. Very hot. Some long lines and low capacity rides. The Potter area is still amazing--probably the best art directed land anywhere in the world. And Le Cirque Arcanus is top shelf. But there were months of technical rehearsals. It seems like things should be operating better by now, but not all team members seem fully trained and some of the rides still have issues, which is forgivable. It takes teams a while to get complex rides fully functional. I did enjoy my time there. But I really don't think about my visits to the park very much. When I compare this to the months of public excitement for Galaxy's Edge after it opened--even with out the full entertainment package at GE--I sorta wonder how did Epic not fully capture this moment? That's mostly what I'm wondering--where were the missteps, as this should've fully been Epic's summer, but a few weeks after opening, it doesn't feel that way.

Yeah, I have been cautious about posting this lest it comes as a criticism or raining on people's parade, but I also have the same impression that the pre-opening hype that suggested this was going to be a game changer has more or less dissipated by now. All the talk on the other forums that Disney was heading for disaster for not rushing a bunch of new additions to open against Epic also seems to have mostly gone quiet. That's not to say the park has been received poorly, more that it has been received more in line with what you would expect of a new theme park from Universal or Disney in the US rather than as a new revelation. Also notable that certain things like this being the Uni park that would finally permit decent nighttime fireworks or dragons flying overhead has all sort of been pushed off to "they're working on it..."

Again, I think the park has been well-received. I'm just not sure anyone is still suggesting it raises the bar for what a theme park can be. In that sense, it kind of reminds me of Volcano Bay which was supposed to be such an elevated version of a water park that it was basically a theme park. Then it opened and people mostly liked it, but it was a water park with plusses and minuses like they all have.

 

[Disney Analyst]

Yeah, I have been cautious about posting this lest it comes as a criticism or raining on people's parade, but I also have the same impression that the pre-opening hype that suggested this was going to be a game changer has more or less dissipated by now. All the talk on the other forums that Disney was heading for disaster for not rushing a bunch of new additions to open against Epic also seems to have mostly gone quiet. That's not to say the park has been received poorly, more that it has been received more in line with what you would expect of a new theme park from Universal or Disney in the US rather than as a new revelation. Also notable that certain things like this being the Uni park that would finally permit decent nighttime fireworks or dragons flying overhead has all sort of been pushed off to "they're working on it..."

Again, I think the park has been well-received. I'm just not sure anyone is still suggesting it raises the bar for what a theme park can be. In that sense, it kind of reminds me of Volcano Bay which was supposed to be such an elevated version of a water park that it was basically a theme park. Then it opened and people mostly liked it, but it was a water park with plusses and minuses like they all have.

I’ve been thinking this lately also, but didn’t want to bring it up.

The other forum dedicated to Universal, their Epic section was so active, and since opening it’s dead. None of my social feeds have anyone talking about it anymore …

Is this a symptom of our current society? Where people move on to the next thing super quickly?

Where did the hype go?

 

[Tom Morrow]

I think there's a lot of factors to consider.

One of them being that there were 2.5 months of previews, and a very significant number of people that were hyped about the park actually got to see it during that time. For the final few weeks, the park was essentially already open, with anyone being able to buy a ticket.

Two, there wasn't really like a big IP to draw people in in the sense that it was something that hadn't been done before. This was the third Super Nintendo World to open, and while a new area, it was still the third Potter area in Orlando. Dark Universe and HTTYD aren't exactly IPs that will draw hoards of people in just for them. While I firmly maintain that a great theme park land or attraction does not have to be based on a popular or even good IP as long as it itself is good (for example, the Avatar films are kind of whatever but the land and FoP are great), DU and HTTYD might have fared better in an established park than as anchors for a new park.

Three - the high price plus inability to bundle plus no AP, combined with the fact that many people are holding off assuming the park is a madhouse = a park that is relatively quiet.

 

[JusticeDisney]

I agree with what is being said. There was so much hype for this park, and it would have been nearly impossible to live up to all that. It’s definitely a great park, but it is nothing even close to the “game changer” that so many were predicting. Add to that the constant operational problems that Universal just can’t seem to get straightened out and you get what you have. Bottom line, Disney is likely laughing to themselves and quietly saying “told ya so.”

 

[lewisc]

Disney has Pandora and SWGE. EPIC is an entire park with that level of immersion.
Rise of the Resistance had delays which was as bad, maybe worse, then what EPICs experiencing. Disney solved it with B modes.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I’ve been thinking this lately also, but didn’t want to bring it up.

Glad it's not just me who has felt this way.

I think there's a lot of factors to consider.

One of them being that there were 2.5 months of previews, and a very significant number of people that were hyped about the park actually got to see it during that time. For the final few weeks, the park was essentially already open, with anyone being able to buy a ticket.

Two, there wasn't really like a big IP to draw people in in the sense that it was something that hadn't been done before. This was the third Super Nintendo World to open, and while a new area, it was still the third Potter area in Orlando. Dark Universe and HTTYD aren't exactly IPs that will draw hoards of people in just for them. While I firmly maintain that a great theme park land or attraction does not have to be based on a popular or even good IP as long as it itself is good (for example, the Avatar films are kind of whatever but the land and FoP are great), DU and HTTYD might have fared better in an established park than as anchors for a new park.

Three - the high price plus inability to bundle plus no AP, combined with the fact that many people are holding off assuming the park is a madhouse = a park that is relatively quiet.

All of this makes sense.

I do think it may also have something to do with expectations and how it plays into the Disney and Universal tribalism online. My feeling with Disney is that the starting point for discussing most projects online seems to be for a significant group to assume the worst and pick apart every statement from the company, rightly or wrongly. That probably ultimately works in Disney's favour as it sets expectations at such a level that people are pleasantly surprised every time something isn't a complete disaster.

At least what I have observed from the pre-opening hype about Epic is a tendency to go to the other extreme, assume the best, and accept PR from the company with zero cynicism. To be honest, it always looked to me that the discussion online was out of sync with what the company was actually releasing in terms of concept art and details in suggesting this was going to blow everyone away when compared to the other Orlando parks. For example, I never really understood what everyone saw as so groundbreaking in Celestial Park. Another example is the Chronos which pre-opening discussion seemed to suggest would be almost awe inspiring once in motion, whereas it's kind of just fine as an entrance. Even the discussion about attendance expectations ended up going beyond what the park is seemingly able to handle.

So, I do wonder whether the hype quieting down is the result of expectations coming back down to earth more than anything.

It is also now worth reflecting on the weird initial preview period of this park, which apparently started with them firing people left, right, and centre for posting online about their visit to the park despite having several weeks of previews with thousands of guests planned. Once they gave up that futile effort, did they ever re-hire those people?

 

[jrhwdw]

Apparently, Fireworks are still in the Plans..... Saw it on X....

 

[DKampy]

it is telling that most of the universal defenders have gone quiet in this thread

 

[flynnibus]

Teething issues like uptime and staff quality really aren’t issues one should be focusing on when talking about the long term impact of the park. They are growing pains that will be in the past soon enough.

I keep saying you need to be looking at this over quarters… not weeks… and here just 2.5 weeks after official opening you all are talking like it’s fading away…

The crowds that seek an opening are the fringe… they are not the meat and potatoes of the industry. People are going to vacation when they vacation… not everyone switch to the last week of may.

Sit back… it’s gonna be a long ride

 

[Andrew C]

I for one am thrilled that the vacation package I bought to Uni for next year allows you to visit Epic multiple days with the park-to-park ticket. I was a bit worried that it would be limited to one day still and was seriously considering a VIP tour.

 

[lewisc]

it is telling that most of the universal defenders have gone quiet in this thread

Nothing to defend. For many of us the park meets all reasonable expectations. Food exceeded my expectations. Ride down time isn't great, for a couple of attractions; similar to Rise.

Did anyone really think EPIC was going to TURN WDW into a ghost town?

 

[DKampy]

Nothing to defend. For many of us the park meets all reasonable expectations. Food exceeded my expectations. Ride down time isn't great, for a couple of attractions; similar to Rise.

Did anyone really think EPIC was going to TURN WDW into a ghost town?

I did not…. But there were people gleeful about those posters predictions that Universal was going to cause WDW to fall due to Epic..,, I am sure it is a great park and I look forward to visiting it one day…. But Epic is not the Disney killer many Uni fan boys were hoping for

 

[jrhwdw]

it is telling that most of the universal defenders have gone quiet in this thread

Maybe because EU not being ready with a Regular Fireworks Spectacular or Flying Dragons over Berk is not defend-able???

 

[lewisc]

Maybe because EU not being ready with a Regular Fireworks Spectacular or Flying Dragons over Berk is not defend-able???

I don't remember. Were nightly fireworks and drones promised by Universal? It's hard to remember rumors on fan sites vs actual releasesd plans

 

[jrhwdw]

I don't remember. Were nightly fireworks and drones promised by Universal? It's hard to remember rumors on fan sites vs actual releasesd plans

Nothing Official was said from UOR . However High Fireworks were in the concept art and there were enough Tests before EU that showed could do High Level Fireworks. Yes we saw a Spectacular on May 21st, but how far along is EU on a Regular Spectacular? Who Knows!

Same can said with the Flying Dragons

 

[Tom Morrow]

Disney has Pandora and SWGE. EPIC is an entire park with that level of immersion.
Rise of the Resistance had delays which was as bad, maybe worse, then what EPICs experiencing. Disney solved it with B modes.

Epic is definitely not an entire park of the full immersion found in Pandora or SWGE. Or Diagon Alley. Only two of the five lands at Epic achieve that level of full immersion. Which is fine, except the entire concept of the park was that the portals would completely "transport" you to "fully immersive worlds". This is one of the biggest issues with the park. If they weren't promising full immersion from the beginning, I think the perception and initial reactions to the park would have been higher.

And no, I'm not trying to claim that reception to the park has been all bad, because it hasn't. However, there does not seem to be many people that were blown away. I would say that the average response to the park has been mixed to positive but not glowing. I do believe it will only improve over time and as far as openings go, Epic's was okay, but it's not a smash hit right out of the gate.

IMO, Animal Kingdom remains the most immersive and cohesive theme park in Florida, especially now that Dino-Rama is gone (and hopefully this doesn't stop with the upcoming changes). It's common for people to dismiss them because they aren't IP based, but Harambe (Africa) and Anandapur (Asia) are just as immersive as SWGE and Pandora.

Did anyone really think EPIC was going to TURN WDW into a ghost town?

Because of my life and my interests I know and interact with a lot of "theme park people" and yes, a lot of people actually thought this. It's the social media bubble effect - seeing only negative discourse about Disney and only positive discourse about Universal makes them think that Disney was doomed. What these people don't consider is that Disney is a behemoth of a resort, an institution, a "right of passage" for many, and some negative online complaints or one new theme park aren't going to change that anytime soon. Then you have to consider that on a typical day, the Magic Kingdom alone sees as many guests as USF/IOA/VB combined, or... well, I could go on, but basically all the "Disney is doomed" people are not well informed but are trying to appear informed.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

And no, I'm not trying to claim that reception to the park has been all bad, because it hasn't. However, there does not seem to be many people that were blown away. I would say that the average response to the park has been mixed to positive but not glowing. I do believe it will only improve over time and as far as openings go, Epic's was okay, but it's not a smash hit right out of the gate.

I think this is a good way of describing the vibe around Epic Universe since it opened to guests and why it stands out: few people seem blown away.

The response generally seems positive to me beyond what will hopefully be teething issues regarding reliability, capacity, and shade. However, it is more 'positive' than 'blown away', and I think expectations were set more toward the latter before it opened.