Rumor New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

[Katieg3030]

But technically they can with Genie.

I get a Genie for say PP at 930. I am now allowed to hop in another line prior to that and wait to ride say HM before my time comes up… so yes i understand why people are saying that but its another slippery slope Disney im sure does not want to go down.

I agree that standby guest who purchase genie can hold 2 places at once… but they have to pay to do it.
So I think the “elevated experience” offered to those with the DAS is that in theory they can hold 2 places in 2 lines without paying for it. Which makes it “greater than equal” experience.
I have seen people argue on some chats that they don’t feel it is fair to let DAS holders buy genie plus and that of course isn’t fair… DAS is the disabled persons standby line.. so they should be able to hold a place with genie as well like anyone else can.
It’s just when DAS folks are getting to be in “ 2 lines at once” for free that DAS becomes a “better” experience (which is part of the reason why Disney is in this mess to begin with lol- making it a better scenario always sadly attracts fraud )

 

[Disstevefan1]

It's possible that happens but we also don't know how the return to line is going to work.

This return to line is going to be a huge mess. There was a time Disney would test things. Today they manage by committee and approved this in a meeting full of people probably.

It will be interesting to watch.

 

[nickys]

This exactly. It will happen.

There will also continue to be cheaters that will claim specific medical conditions (that cant be proven either way) to get DAS.

The only way to reduce the use of DAS is to reject honest folks with real medical conditions.

We’ll have to disagree. I don’t believe it will be certain conditions that no longer qualify, rather the questioning will be more stringent. That’s where the healthcare partnership comes into play - how to weed out those that don’t need an accommodation. People will not be able to get away with stock answers eg: “he gets anxious in line”.

 

[Chi84]

That might depend on a grand jury and trial jury.

How would a grand jury ever get involved in an ADA complaint? Or a regular jury for that matter.

 

[Tha Realest]

We’ll have to disagree. I don’t believe it will be certain conditions that no longer qualify, rather the questioning will be more stringent. That’s where the healthcare partnership comes into play - how to weed out those that don’t need an accommodation. People will not be able to get away with stock answers eg: “he gets anxious in line”.

I think it’ll be both.
1) Certain disabilities / classifications will no longer qualify for DAS, and be accommodated in a different way.
2) They will be more stringent/discerning for those claiming developmental disabilities.

 

[ditzee]

How would a grand jury ever get involved in an ADA complaint?

Not sure if all states have grand juries for civil investigations but some do if a trial is sought.

 

[Disstevefan1]

We’ll have to disagree. I don’t believe it will be certain conditions that no longer qualify, rather the questioning will be more stringent.

This is a contradictory statement in my opinion.
Person A, previously qualified, their conditions as actually worsened.
The same questions, plus "more stringent" questions whatever that means.
This same person who previously qualified does not.

This person is not now magically able to wait in these queues, in fact their condition has worsened since before the pandemic and Genie+ when this person qualified with no issues and renewed regularly.

Disney answer, purchase Genie+ even though the DAS is a MUCH BETTER guest experience.

 

[Andrew25]

This return to line is going to be a huge mess. There was a time Disney would test things. Today they manage by committee and approved this in a meeting full of people probably.

It will be interesting to watch.

It will be very interesting to see what happens, as its the one puzzle piece I'm not quite sure will work as well as they think it will.

There are certain queues that are built well to accommodate such a feature (Flight of Passage, etc.), but what happens to Claustrophobic queues like Peter Pan's Flight that has no easy way for access?

The new system/policies will be enacted in about a month... very little time to do any construction/massive changes to the queue themselves.

 

[The Mom]

This is a contradictory statement in my opinion.
Person A, previously qualified, their conditions as actually worsened.
The same questions, plus "more stringent" questions whatever that means.
This same person who previously qualified does not.

This person is not now magically able to wait in these queues, in fact their condition has worsened since before the pandemic and Genie+ when this person qualified with no issues and renewed regularly.

Disney answer, purchase Genie+ even though the DAS is a MUCH BETTER guest experience.

That is still supposition without anyone actually experiencing this. But this whole discussion has been full of hypotheticals.

 

[DisneyCane]

Ok....



Uhm.... No.

If they have a disability that prevents them from standing in the queue, and Disney says they MUST stand in the queue in order to ride an attraction, then Disney is denying them access based on their disability.

If the person can't stand in a queue, Disney could provide a wheelchair so they can sit in the queue.

As I posted dozens of pages back, I have a nephew with autism who is towards the severe end of the spectrum. Waiting in a long standby line will likely lead to him acting out, very possibly screaming and maybe hitting whoever happens to be near him but he technically CAN wait in line. He's not going to end up in the hospital if he does, it will just be a very miserable experience.

The text of the law is very open to interpretation with respect to things like autism and different judges may rule differently. It's very clear that you have to provide a means for somebody in a wheelchair to access attractions, not so clear on other disabilities.

 

[Chi84]

This is a contradictory statement in my opinion.
Person A, previously qualified, their conditions as actually worsened.
The same questions, plus "more stringent" questions whatever that means.
This same person who previously qualified does not.

This person is not now magically able to wait in these queues, in fact their condition has worsened since before the pandemic and Genie+ when this person qualified with no issues and renewed regularly.

Disney answer, purchase Genie+ even though the DAS is a MUCH BETTER guest experience.

I think the confusion comes in with thinking that DAS = disability accommodation. DAS is just Disney's system, which may have given some people more accommodation than they actually needed, even the person whose condition has worsened.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It still hate this.

I wonder if it would have worked if they had made these changes instead.

Remove all pre booking.

Limit DAS to three uses a day.

This ensures that all disabled people still receive accommodations and will be able to experience the attractions most important to them that day.

It also greatly reduces any reward for abusers.

It might have been a happy middle ground but maybe it runs into legal trouble ?

So fastpass plus without the genie fee?

Can only see one or two potential problems there

 

[Trauma]

So fastpass plus without the genie fee?

Can only see one or two potential problems there

Well it’s still a huge reduction on what’s currently available.

Currently it’s pre booking plus unlimited rides per day.

This would cut down the total number of rides possible by a wide margin.

 

[some other guy]

I remember back in the 80s when they didn't have all this and there was at least three dead in the streets of World Showcase every day

 

[Chip Chipperson]

This is a contradictory statement in my opinion.
Person A, previously qualified, their conditions as actually worsened.
The same questions, plus "more stringent" questions whatever that means.
This same person who previously qualified does not.

This person is not now magically able to wait in these queues, in fact their condition has worsened since before the pandemic and Genie+ when this person qualified with no issues and renewed regularly.

Disney answer, purchase Genie+ even though the DAS is a MUCH BETTER guest experience.

The issue is that some people equate "it's not fun" with "I can't and therefore need DAS." If there are other accommodations available that adequately and reasonably address a guest's issue then there is nothing requiring Disney to go beyond that. Just because something is less than what was received before doesn't necessarily mean it does not adequately address the need.

 

[nickys]

I think it’ll be both.
1) Certain disabilities / classifications will no longer qualify for DAS, and be accommodated in a different way.
2) They will be more stringent/discerning for those claiming developmental disabilities.

I think we are agreeing.

Yes, most who have medical conditions will not qualify for DAS but will still qualify for an alternative.

What I am saying is, they’re not just going to decide that Cerebral Palsy and Crohn’s disease no longer qualify for any accommodation.

But they will use more stringent questioning to determine exactly what accommodation is most appropriate. Not everyone with CP will be offered the same solution.

And some people will continue to be given the classic DAS, even without a developmental disability.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I think the confusion comes in with thinking that DAS = disability accommodation. DAS is just Disney's system, which may have given some people more accommodation than they actually needed, even the person whose condition has worsened.

Well that is the Disney way. Charge more, provide less. Why should DAS be any different.

 

[ditzee]

So, as I ate lunch, I attempted to read the relevant section of the ADA. I've determined that laws are worded as unclearly as possible so that the lawmakers can shirk responsibility for the laws they pass and dump it on judges to "legislate from the bench" and then complain that judges do that.

First of all, the reasonable accommodation language does not appear in the section that applies to theme parks. The similar language essentially refers specifically to physical modifications.

The applicable section basically says you can't discriminate or deny access to goods and services to somebody based on their disability. If Disney eliminated DAS completely, there is a reasonable chance that they would win a suit if it was brought against them. Based upon the (overly vague and complex wording) of the actual law, you could argue that making an autistic person wait in the standby line does not deny them access to the attraction.

In their effort to serve the target audience and make the parks enjoyable for people with and without disabilities I think that Disney should provide the program for people who legitimately need it so that they (and the other people in the queue) aren't made miserable but make it as much of a PITA as possible for people trying to use the system to get free Genie+/ILL.

According to an ADA training manual dealing with public accommodations, aka, theme parks:

The ADA says people with disabilities are entitled to “the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations” that a public accommodation provides to its customers. In other words, every type of good or service a business provides to customers is covered by the ADA. All businesses that serve the public must provide equal opportunity for customers with disabilities.

The ADA asks public accommodations to take steps that are “readily achievable” or are “reasonable”or that do not constitute an “undue burden” to enable people with disabilities to be their customers and clients. These terms are explained later in the course. After taking the course, businesses that are willing to do simple, easy, and reasonable things to accommodate customers with disabilities will likely find it easy to comply with the ADA.

 

[Chi84]

According to an ADA training manual dealing with public accommodations, aka, theme parks:

The ADA says people with disabilities are entitled to “the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations” that a public accommodation provides to its customers. In other words, every type of good or service a business provides to customers is covered by the ADA. All businesses that serve the public must provide equal opportunity for customers with disabilities.

The ADA asks public accommodations to take steps that are “readily achievable” or are “reasonable”or that do not constitute an “undue burden” to enable people with disabilities to be their customers and clients. These terms are explained later in the course. After taking the course, businesses that are willing to do simple, easy, and reasonable things to accommodate customers with disabilities will likely find it easy to comply with the ADA.

So that means what for Disney though. Clearly line accommodations are not simple or easy and reasonableness needs to be addressed in terms of their impact on Disney’s business, which is considerable.

 

[DisneyCane]

According to an ADA training manual dealing with public accommodations, aka, theme parks:

The ADA says people with disabilities are entitled to “the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations” that a public accommodation provides to its customers. In other words, every type of good or service a business provides to customers is covered by the ADA. All businesses that serve the public must provide equal opportunity for customers with disabilities.

The ADA asks public accommodations to take steps that are “readily achievable” or are “reasonable”or that do not constitute an “undue burden” to enable people with disabilities to be their customers and clients. These terms are explained later in the course. After taking the course, businesses that are willing to do simple, easy, and reasonable things to accommodate customers with disabilities will likely find it easy to comply with the ADA.

Just to clarify for the discussion, "full and equal enjoyment" does not mean "enjoy the parks" from an emotional standpoint, it is a legal term. From the Cornell Law School, "Enjoyment, in a legal context, has several related meanings; but generally, it means “to exercise a right.”

The way the full text is worded, it is not cut and dried with respect to mental disabilities. Especially since Disney charges for Genie+/ILL, it could be argued that it is not reasonable to have to give up revenue to allow access to the lightning lane for free as an accommodation which takes up capacity that they can't sell without further negatively effecting the experience of non-disabled patrons.