Why Does Fifth Gate Speculation Always Seem to be Out of Left Field?

[Scott M]

I'm as much of a Disney fan as any one of you...But as much as I enjoy reading about the future of Walt Disney World, I can't help but feel a little uneasy when I read about rumors of a fifth gate.

I'm not stating that there will not be one, I'm just not convinced that any of the rumored themes are even close to plausible. A Villains or Beastly Kingdom theme immediately comes to mind.

Neither of these two ideas are enough to sustain the theme of an entire park. Maybe an attraction, or even a land in an existing or future park, but certainly not an entire park.

My reasoning for this line of thinking is simple, just look at the success of Disney's existing parks and their competition: The Magic Kingdom is obviously the top dog and is the standard for which all other amusement parks are unfairly compared. Epcot has found it's niche as something that can not be found anywhere else. Hollywood Studios clearly competes with Universal Studios and it's Islands of Adventure, with all 3 parks seemingly doing fairly well. And Animal Kingdom had taken Busch Garden's Tampa park to the next level, with the competition between the two keeping the other on it's toes.

It seems to me that the only obvious choice for a theme for a fifth gate would have to be something completely different, something along the lines of Tokyo Disney Sea...Something that would compete with SeaWorld. But is that something that Disney is ready to take on? Who knows?

But please, no more Villain or Beastly Kingdom rumors...They just don't make much sense.

Scott

 

[raven]

Many will argue that a 5th Gate will never happen. But the fact is that no one knows for sure...even those who claim they do. I've seen many members here claim they know everything about WDI but most of them are not reliable or can list their sources. A 5th Gate in WDW is not out of the question and I'm sure that there have been plans drawn up for many different types of parks that are in the WDI vault.

While we can make our own assumptions based on the history, land usage, attendance and tourist growth in Central Florida, we simply don't know what lies in store for the future of WDW.

So as they say "Anything is Possible!" :wave:

 

[teebin]

perhaps because, as it is out of left field, it should be in the "discussion" field and not the "rumor" field.

 

[unkadug]

I'm as much of a Disney fan as any one of you...But as much as I enjoy reading about the future of Walt Disney World, I can't help but feel a little uneasy when I read about rumors of a fifth gate.

I'm not stating that there will not be one, I'm just not convinced that any of the rumored themes are even close to plausible. A Villains or Beastly Kingdom theme immediately comes to mind.

Neither of these two ideas are enough to sustain the theme of an entire park. Maybe an attraction, or even a land in an existing or future park, but certainly not an entire park.

My reasoning for this line of thinking is simple, just look at the success of Disney's existing parks and their competition: The Magic Kingdom is obviously the top dog and is the standard for which all other amusement parks are unfairly compared. Epcot has found it's niche as something that can not be found anywhere else. Hollywood Studios clearly competes with Universal Studios and it's Islands of Adventure, with all 3 parks seemingly doing fairly well. And Animal Kingdom had taken Busch Garden's Tampa park to the next level, with the competition between the two keeping the other on it's toes.

It seems to me that the only obvious choice for a theme for a fifth gate would have to be something completely different, something along the lines of Tokyo Disney Sea...Something that would compete with SeaWorld. But is that something that Disney is ready to take on? Who knows?

But please, no more Villain or Beastly Kingdom rumors...They just don't make much sense.

Scott

You seem to be contradicting yourself.

You say that a 5th gate "would have to be something completely different," but then in the very same sentence "something along the lines of Tokyo Disney Sea...Something that would compete with Sea World."

Wouldn't a "Villain or Beastly Kingdom" theme be completely different as opposed to a remake of Sea World ?

Also remember that DHS started out as a concept for a pavilion at Epcot, so why couldn't Villains or Beasts be filled out enough for a park. It requires some imagination and I'm sure it could be done.

 

[Scott M]

You seem to be contradicting yourself.

You say that a 5th gate "would have to be something completely different," but then in the very same sentence "something along the lines of Tokyo Disney Sea...Something that would compete with Sea World."

Wouldn't a "Villain or Beastly Kingdom" theme be completely different as opposed to a remake of Sea World ?

Also remember that DHS started out as a concept for a pavilion at Epcot, so why couldn't Villains or Beasts be filled out enough for a park. It requires some imagination and I'm sure it could be done.

Perhaps I did not expand enough in my original post. When I stated "something completely different", I was refering to being different from the existing parks in the Walt Disney World resort itself.

I just do not feel as if a Villains or Beastly Kingdom themed park is different enough from what already exists, or can exist, in any current park. For example: How would a roller coaster in Beastly Kingdom differ from Expedition Everest? How would a dark ride in Villains Park differ from Snow White's Scary Adventures? My point is that Disney would be hard pressed to come up with enough ideas to sustain an entire park of a theme that already exists elsewhere.

Theming a park to compete with SeaWorld seems to make more sense to me. Disney has done it with Hollywood Studios (successfully competing with Universal Studios) and Animal Kingdom (successfully competing with Busch Gardens Tampa). And they've alraedy obtained the experience with Tokyo Disney Sea.

Scott

 

[unkadug]

Perhaps I did not expand enough in my original post. When I stated "something completely different", I was refering to being different from the existing parks in the Walt Disney World resort itself.

I just do not feel as if a Villains or Beastly Kingdom themed park is different enough from what already exists, or can exist, in any current park. For example: How would a roller coaster in Beastly Kingdom differ from Expedition Everest? How would a dark ride in Villains Park differ from Snow White's Scary Adventures? My point is that Disney would be hard pressed to come up with enough ideas to sustain an entire park of a theme that already exists elsewhere.

Theming a park to compete with SeaWorld seems to make more sense to me. Disney has done it with Hollywood Studios (successfully competing with Universal Studios) and Animal Kingdom (successfully competing with Busch Gardens Tampa). And they've alraedy obtained the experience with Tokyo Disney Sea.

Scott

I'm pretty certain that BK is a dead concept. :shrug:

However your question about attraction duplication still applies to any new park.

It's all about themeing. For example, Dinosaur and Indiana Jones, exactly the same ride...but totally different experiences.

 

[imagineer boy]

Yeah, I'm very tired of people constantly throwing out the Villains park idea as part of the rumors. Personally, I hate the villains park idea. Its a terrible idea and it would not work or be popular in the slightest.

 

[BigB911]

I really don't get some of you guys. Maybe you've visited "the World" so much, that you're bored with it, or spoiled by it, and need something new:shrug: But, from the way I see it, there is plenty to do as there is, without the need for another "gate" or park. As it is, I'll be there 8 days in September, and I already know that I will not get to see and do everything.

As far as parks, there is:
Magic Kingdom
Epcot
Disney Hollywood Studios
Animal Kingdom
Blizzard Beach
Typhoon Lagoon

In addition, there's also Downtown Disney, 2 mini-golf courses (I don't know how many of the "big" ones there are as I don't golf), numerous activities at the resorts, plus Universal Studios and Sea World. And I'm told the beach is only about an hour and a half drive away. If you can't fill your vacation with activities among the amenities that already exist, then maybe you should think about vacationing somewhere different. I know my 8 days are jam-packed and I probably won't even get to relax on my vacation.

IMO, WDW should focus on updating/expanding their existing parks and resorts before breaking ground on any "5th gate."

 

[phenom1307]

Yeah, I'm very tired of people constantly throwing out the Villains park idea as part of the rumors. Personally, I hate the villains park idea. Its a terrible idea and it would not work or be popular in the slightest.

thats your opinion there is probably numerous amounts of people that think it would be a great idea and love the place if it was made. there may not be a lot of people on here that would like it but that doesn't mean the millions of other people that visit WDW wouldn't like.

 

[Mr. Tickle]

Until energy costs come under control, and the economy gets better a 5th gate is a bad idea. If things get worse and attendance drops how could a new park even be considered? Expanding on what they have is a better choice for the time being.

 

[MousDad]

Because right fielders know better.

 

[Legacy]

Something that would compete with SeaWorld. But is that something that Disney is ready to take on? Who knows?

But please, no more Villain or Beastly Kingdom rumors...They just don't make much sense.

Scott

How about something that competes with Discovery Cove?

 

[RSoxNo1]

You kind of answered your own question as to where many of the new park rumors stem from. They're partly the product of necessity, or at least the need for meeting a specific demand. Such was the case with a Studios park (to compete with Universal Studios) and the Animal/Adventure park (to compete with Islands of Adventure and Universal Studios). This is partly where the Night Kingdom rumors have a basis in fact, as they are look for a niche/higher end park to compete with Discovery Cove.

As for your suggestions, I have never heard Beastly Kingdom mentioned as it's own park, it has always been a part of the Animal Kingdom. The Villains park was rumored to be an Islands of Adventure competitor, or "an evil version" of Fantasyland. I think some derivation of the two ideas may find there ways into the parks, as we've already seen mythical creatures added to the Animal Kingdom.

By all accounts, Night Kingdom seems to be happening, but I don't know if I'd necessarily qualify that as a 5th gate if the boutique/high price part of that park are true. It seems to be a combination backstage Animal tour, dinner, and show, as opposed to a traditional park with a choice of rides and attractions.

 

[Festivus]

Hi everyone, I am new to this forum, this is my first post. I have been to WDW 3 times and am taking my family again this October/November for Halloween (can't wait!).

I live in Chicago, so multiple frequent visits over the course of a year to the parks is out of the question for me due to obvious reasons. As a non-Florida resident, and having only been to WDW 3 times, I have not been able to experience everything WDW has to offer. I've been to all the parks, been on most of the rides, but there are so many hotels, restaurants, and misc. activities available in WDW that you could have a completely different and new experience every time you go. That's one of the things that I really enjoy about visiting WDW, the variety.

I completely understand the want/need/curiosity of pontificating on what Disney may or may not have up their sleeves for a 5th gate. I would love to see a 5th gate, as long as it is done with quality in mind and is Disney themed without too much Pixar involved. I personally think that the "Villians" 5th gate could be something worth seeing. It could be the anti-thesis of the Magic Kingdom, centered around a dark, gothic castle, perhaps the castle from Beauty and the Beast. There are so many great Disney villians, the imagination can just go crazy coming up with ideas.

However, I can also understand why there really is no need for a 5th gate. WDW is so big with so many things to do, a 5th gate would require 2 weeks to see and do everything at WDW, much less the cost involved for the average vacationer.

In lieu of a 5th gate, I would like to see them expand and improve upon the existing parks. Maybe replace some attractions in MK, like the Swiss Family Treehouse. In Epcot, they could add some countries to the pavillion. Hollywood Studios could be expanded and updated to compete better with Islands of Adventure. I would LOVE to see the Star Tours update happen. In AK, add another continent like Australia and another ride.

At any rate, there is much to improve on and update in WDW before a 5th gate should be announced. Although, I must say, I wouldn't complain if they did announce a 5th gate.

 

[raven]

In addition, there's also Downtown Disney, 2 mini-golf courses (I don't know how many of the "big" ones there are as I don't golf), numerous activities at the resorts, plus Universal Studios and Sea World. And I'm told the beach is only about an hour and a half drive away. If you can't fill your vacation with activities among the amenities that already exist, then maybe you should think about vacationing somewhere different. I know my 8 days are jam-packed and I probably won't even get to relax on my vacation.

Not everyone who goes to Walt Disney World is going to visit other places. A lot of guests, like myself, want to stay on the property and do exclusively Disney things. Going to Universal, Sea World, Busch Gardens, Kennedy Space Center or even the beach means renting a car or getting other transportation.

Disney is seeing this and that's why they built the water parks, golf courses, shopping complexes, and other activites on the property. They are fighting to keep guests there because there are so many other attractions now around the area. Because of the growing tourism in the area they just might build another park down the road to help keep guests on the property. It's not completely out of the picture yet.

 

[imagineer boy]

thats your opinion there is probably numerous amounts of people that think it would be a great idea and love the place if it was made. there may not be a lot of people on here that would like it but that doesn't mean the millions of other people that visit WDW wouldn't like.

They won't, trust me.

 

[CThaddeus]

I have heard from a friend, who is the doctor of a bus driver related to a janitor at Walt Disney Imagineering that the 5th Gate is going to be Disney's Florida Adventure. Amongst the themed areas will be:
1. Swamp Land (featuring The Great Gator Plunge)
2. The Golden Girls Retirement Community
3. Walt Disney World Land, and
4. The We-Swear-We're-Not-Competing-With-Kennedy-Space-Center Space Experience

Naturally, the Monorail will be run from the TTC to DFA, which will cross in front of the entrance to the Park over a bridge resembling one in Key West. Right now, the main wienie for the Park is intended to be a giant orange, or perhaps a key lime, but this, like everything else in the Park, is subject to change without notice.

 

[Disneyfan1981]

A fifth gate will happen, when is the question. Disney makes it a point to reference a possible fifth gate in many things including the Travel Channel specials. I have a feeling that it won't happen for another five years at the very earliest and when what is going on will be announced it'll be cheered and complained about in unison.

 

[BigB911]

Not everyone who goes to Walt Disney World is going to visit other places. A lot of guests, like myself, want to stay on the property and do exclusively Disney things. Going to Universal, Sea World, Busch Gardens, Kennedy Space Center or even the beach means renting a car or getting other transportation.

Disney is seeing this and that's why they built the water parks, golf courses, shopping complexes, and other activites on the property. They are fighting to keep guests there because there are so many other attractions now around the area. Because of the growing tourism in the area they just might build another park down the road to help keep guests on the property. It's not completely out of the picture yet.

The point of my post was that there is plenty to do within the confines of "the World," and if one bores with that, there are other attractions to visit. But there is plenty do to at WDW, without the need for any expansion. Most families are lucky to visit WDW just once.

I know this for sure...if another park is added, I won't be taking my family again. There is no way we'd be able to visit every park and would be out of our minds deciding where to go and where to not go:hammer:

Here's to hoping the powers-that-be at WDW do not construct another "gate."

 

[Omnimover]

I have heard from a friend, who is the doctor of a bus driver related to a janitor at Walt Disney Imagineering...

Nice one. :ROFLOL: