The growing cultural war over AE

[Stitchfan712]

In the comments posted here over the last two weeks or so, it has become apparent to me, at least, that former AE fans really aren't going to much care for the Stitch ride.

And who can blame them? It's not easy to "love" an attraction that replaced one you had loved before. There's expectations to meet. And those who enjoyed the dark humor and scare factor of AE just aren't going to find it with Stitch.

Understandably, Stitch will fall short with these folks.


Then there's us folks who never saw Alien Encounter....or those folks who even if AE were still around, probably wouldn't go for it, because dark humor and/or scare thrills just aren't their thing.

And then there's the Stitch fans, like me, who will like the ride just because it has Stitch's name on it.


Thing is I see the potential for this to become a hot-button issue in these and other forums. Already we've seen a few arguments amongst folks about whether SGE lives up to AE standars...or rather...how it doesn't. We've had a few folks passionately defending SGE, but thus far no real huge fights.

I'm not a mod, I'm not even a well-known name in these forums. But...I think before this goes too far we should sit back, take a breath, and realize that everyone is going to have a difference of opinion, based on what they view as part of their disney experience. Some AE folks have given SGE a fair shake. Some SGE folks liked AE. That's great. But let's not fight with each other over which attraction was better.

The fact is, Stitch is not AE. Never was meant to be AE. Stitch will never be scary-scary to anyone but the little kids. Stitch will never be as foreboding, or as intense, as AE. We can't expect it to. Because it won't. To search constantly or complain constantly that Stitch can't be AE, is really counterproductive. In the end it only makes the AE folks feel worse that their attraction is gone.

At the same time it makes people who are eager to try SGE out, a bit cautious about the attraction. When they might have otherwise loved SGE, some here are already forming negative opinions based just on what they've read. Not on actual experience.


Now, I'm going to WDW on the 22nd, and I'll be trying out SGE myself. I'm a Stitch fan, so I'm bound to like it, but I can also be criticial if a critical statement is warranted.


I guess the point of my message here is: Stitch can never be AE. It's hard to lose AE for the AE fans, but, maybe we should all give Stitch a chance? Stitch is a completely different attraction. Same chamber, same basic idea of using the seats to make the experience "real", but a completely different idea behind the attraction.

He's a friendly alien with playfully destructive tendencies. He's not the type that would kill someone. This makes the attraction less scary by default. That was, as far as I understand it, the reason AE closed anyway. It was an attraction that you either loved or hated, and it seems Disney mostly heard from the guests who hated it. Hence the closure and installment of something a little more family friendly.


We just have to accept that. You can mourn AE, but don't crucify Stitch because it isn't AE.

I hope this doesn't offend anyone. I just feel that the show should be judged on its OWN merits and shortcomings. Not judged on a scale comparison with AE.

Likewise, we shouldn't chastise fans of AE or SGE because their viewpoints are a bit different. It doesn't help, when the fact is, AE is gone and Stitch will never be AE. If you want to make the show better, write to Disney. Be constructive. Make yourself heard on how SGE can be improved. But i doubt Disney would hear of making Stitch identical to AE.


That's all I have to say.

 

[Lynx04]

I for one like AE, mainly because it was mainly for older mature guests, like myself. I am not a Stitch fan but I saw the video of SGE and thought that it looked like a worthy replacement the AE of Stitch lookes amazing and seems very fluid. The ride still had dark moments and kids still cried. I understand why they changed the attraction to SGE and to be honest I think within the next 7 to 10 years it will change again. This attraction will be one of those attractions that changes more frequently because the ride losses it re-rideablity (if such a word excists, if not, then pencil it in to old webster) very fast. As much as I liked AE, it did seem less and less desirable to ride, and judging by others comments I have read in the past, I am not alone. I am sure when it is time to change the ride again there will be upset SGE fans out there like AE fans are now.

 

[longfamily]

People always view change with skeptisism (sp?). Stitch is a very popular toon with the general public and therefore to answer the call of popular demand, Disney found a place for it in the parks. Not everyone will love it, but I'm sure even the naysayers will try it once.

 

[kennyj29]

Stitch vs. AE

I for one am looking forward to trying this ride. I liked AE but it was time for it to go. However, There is height restrictions on this new ride and the little 3 year old we're going with on Nov. 26th, is looking forward to seeing Stitch. He doesn't realize that he won't be able to go on it because of the height restrictions. He will be devistated. So my only complaint is, if you were trying to make a more family friendly ride, why the height restrictions? Is there anyway he can sit in a seat without the shoulder harness? He will be so upset when he realizes he can't go on it.

 

[Stitchfan712]

I may see you down there!! I'll be in WDW until the 4th of December!!

 

[Master Yoda]

I really just don’t get “purists” that are so resistant to change. If there is one constant in the world it’s that every thing will eventually change. WDW parks are all about themes and in most cases these themes coincide with Disney movies. AE had nothing to do with any Disney movie. After Stitch came out the Disney imaginers saw a great opportunity to retrofit an existing ride and theme it perfectly with a Disney movie. I did SGE several times during the pass holder preview and thought is was great. Was it as intense as AE…no, was it fun….yes. I think everyone in this forum has seen a Disney Ride that the loved go the way of the dodo, (20K was mine) but that is the way of things. WDW world has every right to update and change things as the see fit. All of us will never agree if the changes are good or bad.

 

[Master Yoda]

I for one am looking forward to trying this ride. I liked AE but it was time for it to go. However, There is height restrictions on this new ride and the little 3 year old we're going with on Nov. 26th, is looking forward to seeing Stitch. He doesn't realize that he won't be able to go on it because of the height restrictions. He will be devistated. So my only complaint is, if you were trying to make a more family friendly ride, why the height restrictions? Is there anyway he can sit in a seat without the shoulder harness? He will be so upset when he realizes he can't go on it.

I took my three year old on SGE and it was still a little scary for her and she is pretty fearless. So proceed with caution.

 

[Shaman]

I for one like AE, mainly because it was mainly for older mature guests, like myself. I am not a Stitch fan but I saw the video of SGE and thought that it looked like a worthy replacement the AE of Stitch lookes amazing and seems very fluid. The ride still had dark moments and kids still cried. I understand why they changed the attraction to SGE and to be honest I think within the next 7 to 10 years it will change again. This attraction will be one of those attractions that changes more frequently because the ride losses it re-rideablity (if such a word excists, if not, then pencil it in to old webster) very fast. As much as I liked AE, it did seem less and less desirable to ride, and judging by others comments I have read in the past, I am not alone. I am sure when it is time to change the ride again there will be upset SGE fans out there like AE fans are now.

Well said...I agree...Personally I liked AE, but looking at SGE, it seems like a worthy enough replacement...I mean the Stitch AA is great, and those laser cannons are awesome additions...I think in this case the replacement's worth is about the same if not slightly higher than that which it replaced. Ofcoarse I haven't been on this attraction as of yet, but from the video it seems like an acceptable replacement. My only qualm is that Tomorrowland seems to be invaded by animated characters, which for the life of me I don't understand...the thing I'll miss about AE is the story...it was original...not from a movie...based off a character...it was original...thats whats missing nowadays it seems...orginality...But I'm ok with SGE...I'm looking foward to experiencing this attraction.

 

[CTXRover]

I'm just going to throw out some thoughts here, but the reason I think SGE is "disappointing" so many right now is not because it isn't a high quality show. I'm not going to argue its perfect (its not), but the effects on their own are great, the lighting is superb and perhaps some of WDI lighting expert's best work, the animatronics are the best I've seen and overall its a fun attraction with great themeing. The disappointing factor is two-pronged though. First, those who really liked AE are undoubedtly going to walk away underwhelmed. Why? Because SGE is practically the same show as AE, but with a newer, lighter, and goofier storyline. Gone is the scare factor and in its place is meant to be humor using the same effects (which has its advantages and disadvatages). Second, those who didn't care for AE will probably also walk away disappointed. Why? For the same reason as before, SGE is practically AE but with a Stitch character and a lighter overall tone to the whole show from start to finish. It doesn't offer much new to either side, taking away something one group really liked and replacing it with something that probably doesn't entice the other group that much.

Thus, as SGE currently stands, it will be difficult to impress really anyone who has ridden AE, whether they liked it or not. And since most who have posted reviews up to now either live near WDW or visit it frequently, it will be tough to find those who can't compare the two. I am one who really enjoyed AE from start to finish. The first time I saw SGE I wasn't disappointed, but perhaps underwhelmed would be the appropriate word. Why? Because overall it wasn't that new of an experience. However, knowing I never catch everything one time through a Disney attraction, I experienced it a couple more times and have really grown to enjoy it. The storyline has its holes (but so did AE...really, how did the huge alien crawl out of that broken tube so fast, how was he walking behind me when I was on the top row, how in the world did XS "suck" him back into the tube at the end, etc.), but SGE is well done. The story is fun if you just let yourself enjoy it and stop comparing it to AE. SGE isn't my favorite attraction, its certainly not WDI's best work, but its still a great time and I never expected it to be the best WDI has done (I leave that for the big guns like Mission:Space, Everest, etc.). Like it or hate it, its still a decent attraction at the MK. I encourage all to try SGE more than once and take in the details and just let yourself enjoy it. I'm not going to judge anyone's opinions on it, but I personally don't believe it deserves the negative reaction its getting.

 

[Indy95]

Dude, Stitchfan712, it's great that you spoke your mind so well at the beginning of the thread. That's what these forums are all about. More power to ya!

On the SGE subject, I can agree with CTXRover on most points. Now, I warn you, I have never been on AE, and will not experience SGE until June, so my opinion is more "outsider." But I think the way the Disney/AE purists are reacting so harshly isn't exactly because it's replacing AE, but because it just reflects the "cheap fix" mentality of the executives these days. You see, instead of creating a whole new experience, with whole new effects, storyline, characters, etc., here's what happened: Disney executives say "hey, people are mad that their children are getting really scared on AE, so here's what we'll do. We're not going to do anything but cosmetic changes to the existing infrastructure, because it costs too much. We're going to just keep almost the same storyline and more or less (with a few exceptions, of course) the same effects, because new effects and storylines cost too much. And we have to have a popular animated character to be the star, so we can sell lots of merchandise." And on and on and on.

Now do you see why some people might be a little harsh on SGE? Because of the executive mindset, guests are getting the impression that a) SGE is just a watered-down version of AE (which it is to the executives, anyway. Just another number on the spreadsheet), b) Disney would only build something like this because it would sell merchandise (which they are), and c) Disney purists loath SGE because they remembered Tomorrowland as a land of futuristic attractions that pushed the envelope when it came to technology and entertainment, but what they're getting is just a futuristic Fantasyland. So I think all of this SGE backlash is happening because everyone is seeing the attraction as a quick (and cheap) "fix" of AE. But, of course, there are those of us who have not ridden AE, and take SGE at face value. And so far, these people have genuinely enjoyed the attraction.

 

[LilDucky]

I for one am looking forward to SGE mainly because AE scared the Christ out of me when I was younger, and I remember that I cried for hours after viewing it ( I was eleven years old and thats not really considered a child.. I cant imagine what it must have been like for a six year old!!) It felt so real, and I hated feeling the alien's hot breath behind me!! I know complete darkness is scary for children, heck, its scary for some adults, so Im glad to hear that this ride is somewhat tamer than AE, even if it still takes place in the dark. I wont get to see SGE until December, so I cant really judge it until I've experienced it. But now I wish I had tried AE once more before they closed it down for good. It wasnt that bad was it....? hehe :animwink:

 

[Lynx04]

But I think the way the Disney/AE purists are reacting so harshly isn't exactly because it's replacing AE, but because it just reflects the "cheap fix" mentality of the executives these days. You see, instead of creating a whole new experience, with whole new effects, storyline, characters, etc.,

I think your make create points but I disagree with the cheap fix. Anything that would be put in the AE/SGE would have been a replacement useing the same effects and same room. No matter what the story it would have been along the lines of the same experience. Now I think the reason they used Stitch instead of developing a new story is for a couple of reasons.

First, George Lucus either did or helped with the the story of AE, so it was for the most part Lucus' story/characters. That is why AE was an original story. I am sure if Disney was only involved it may have been a Disney character from day one.

Second, the idea to use Stitch I think has more to do with his popularity then being a cheap fix. A story still had to be writen, with ideas for how he would interact with guests, everything still had to go through the normal channels.

Personally, I agree that Tomorrowland has been invaded by Disney character and would prefer not see them in Tomorrowland. Having said that, I think the SGE idea may turn out to be the right attraction to replace AE, which seemed to be on the way out anyways. I think the wild card will be if how the ride effects the children (scare the ________ out of them). I think if there are to many complaints about the ride being to scary then they are in real trouble, cause kids don't want to ride because it is too scary and adults don't want to ride it because it isn't scary enough, or don't care to see a cute little alien.

 

[lnsemsf]

AE never did much for me, it was not really scary and having very high standards one major error with AE always bothered me, if you're supposed to be sprayed with somebody's blood from their broken body make the stuff warm guys, blood isn't 70 degrees. How much extra would a small water heater REALLY have cost? Since I never liked AE, I was actually looking forward very much to the new attraction, and I have to say, I'm even more disappointed with SGE. They changed way too little, and what they did change was unimpressive. They could have put in some nice flat screen TVs instead of the big old ones in the first room. They didnt even take the "series 1000" off the transporter in the 2nd room. SIR didnt change much really, and i liked the old one better. The main room looked almost the exact same as well. I was impressed by the Stitch figure though, did a lot of movement and the sort so that was good. The big scanner things on the cealing also were cool, though thats about where the quality ends. The "antics" were not really all that funny, and I don't know about you guys but I've had to work REALLY hard just to sneak a soda on to a ride at the MK, I think a Chili Dog would be cought by the cast members well in advance. When people had asked me in the past what this ride was going to be like, I said I just hope it wouldn't end up as a 10 minute joke about flatulence. Well I guess it didnt, though it was close as there was definitly more belching than there needed to be (If belches were really that amusing I'd win Last Comic Standing.) I guess the thing I was the most pleased with was the fact that Kevin McDonald's voice was in the ride, making that 2 members of The Kids In The Hall to have their voices featured at WDW (can I dream that Soarin' will use Mark McKinny or Bruce McCulloch for the pre-show?) All in all,I give it a C- to D+ over AE's C. Maybe in 10 more years they'll break out of the Mission to Mars circle theme (fingers crossed.) These are my official opinions and as with all my opinions, should be treates as The Gospel. :drevil:

 

[Indy95]

Anything that would be put in the AE/SGE would have been a replacement useing the same effects and same room. No matter what the story it would have been along the lines of the same experience. Now I think the reason they used Stitch instead of developing a new story is for a couple of reasons.

First, George Lucus either did or helped with the the story of AE, so it was for the most part Lucus' story/characters. That is why AE was an original story. I am sure if Disney was only involved it may have been a Disney character from day one.

I can see where you're coming from here, however I just wanted to clear up two things:

1. You say that anything that replaced AE would have to have the same storyline, effects, etc., however that was exactly the point I was trying to make: it doesn't HAVE to be. Just think of how different AE was from Mission to Mars. Disney could have, with a little time and effort, come up with something totally original for the theater, or they could have repalced it with a completely different set-up all together. It could have become a totally new attraction for Tomorrowland. But instead, we get a PG-rated AE with Stitch and some new lasers. That was the point I was trying to make.

2. The original AE concept was not from George Lucas. Originally, (when AE was first supposed to be installed at Disneyland), the show revolved around the guests being terrorized by the ACTUAL "Alien." You know, from the movie "Alien." Well, it wasn't until some senior Imagineers complained that AE was too scary and "didn't belong at Disneyland" that George Lucas came on board and...basically had no say in what was going on. He was a producer in name only. It was only when WDW was to receive the "First" (out of a perceived four) AE attractions that the storyline was significantly changed to reflect the "tongue-in-cheek" nature of WDW's New Tomorrowland. The storyline was then totally messed up by Eisner and...*sigh* Let's just say it's a long story, shall we?
:wave:

 

[Stitchfan712]

Horizons is 100% correct about the "original" idea for AE. This is all comfirmed by Jim Hill as well.


Now, as far as Disney doing more:

Yes, they could, and should have. However, had they done a much more in depth show that stands on its own two legs, you wouldn't see this attraction open until Fall of 2005.

I've seen the video. The script is a bit weak I admit. but I still think SGE is one of the greatest attractions in Magic Kingdom, based on the video alone. The animatronic is absolutely amazing. And I'm glad that it's finally opening, I went to florida earlier this year and it was hard staring at that construction wall. We called it the "wall of misery", we wanted into SGE so bad.

The wall has come down, the attraction is open. I'm prepared to enjoy it. If the script is seen as bad by many guests though, eventually this attraction will lose some of its appeal. If that happens, you'll see Disney shut it down for a short time, and give it a new storyline, and it'll open back up a few months later with a few changes, much like AE did. Disney could have spent more money, but they already laid out extensive bucks on this attraction, and they'll try to save it if they can if the guest response is too negative.

But the basic idea will always be the same. Stitch escapes, and we sense his antics through the chair. That will never change.


The chili dog, i think, was a stupid idea. I bet that changes after a while.



See, I love the attraction, and yet i can criticise too, without making the ride sound awful.

 

[Poncho1973]

Let me be the first to say:

Don't ever change it! Nothing should ever change! Once it's in... it's IN FOR LIFE! Run Disney like the mob! Classics! More attractions for people who quote every line in Monty Python movies (accents and all) and think if you haven't "married" someone online then you really aren't commited to your personal internet lifestyle. Bring back HORIZONS! Bring back the SKYWAY! Bring back 20K! Bring back WORLD OF MOTION!

Oh wait... I think SGE rocks. I also LOVE change!!! Please disregard this post. I thought I was in Gen Grizz's army for a second.

 

[Poncho1973]

Horizons is 100% correct about the "original" idea for AE. This is all comfirmed by Jim Hill as well.

I equate Jim Hill with Baghdad Bob.

"We butchered the force present at the airport. We have retaken the airport! There are no Americans there!"
- Baghdad Bob (After U.S. Forces Seized Baghdad's Airport)

:hammer:

 

[Stitchfan712]

I find Jim Hill to be a reliable source of info. Why don't you?

 

[AEfx]

It's not just AE fans that do not like Stitch. I never saw AE, yet for the reasons hashed out in many threads I found Stitch's Great Escape less than stellar. I just don't care for the assumption that anyone who didn't like it must be biased because of liking AE. Stitch fans seem to think we are "missing" something, and just can't accept that in the eyes of many the attraction is lacking.

AEfx (who's name is my real-life initials, nothing to do with the Alien Encounter attraction)

 

[Tinkerbell1220]

This is coming from a huge AE fan and I dont like SGE as much but let me give you a few reasons why.

1. Weaker storyline- The whole ride's storyline could have been developed a lot better. The first 2 preshows before the ride itself were far too short and barely give you a chance to breathe. Also the animation is very blah, apparently they had to outsource the stuff to another studio, dont see why they couldnt have gotten the DTV Australia studio but eh whatever.

2. 2nd preshow- While this show did have some strong points it also took itself as a bit too goofy, it should have been a bit more serious. Not as serious as SIR's treatment of Skippy but it could have been done better.

3. Main Show- This is the best part of SGE although it is still a little too weak. I like some of the gags (including the chili dog bit, I used to work at the parks and people do indeed sneak their food in the ride.) The AA was the only part of SGE that I thought was vastly better than AE, the alien from AE didnt really do much in the tube. Also the ending was far too anticlimatic, they could have done a lot more with Stitch goofing around Tomorrowland.