Swan and Dolphin Question

[abu21]

Hey, this is Steve's gf. I have been reading Michael Eisner's book, "Work In Progress". In one of the sections it goes into how the Swan and Dolphin came about (Eisner and Frank Wells commisioned Michael Graves for the architecture and design). The way I read this is that Disney was in charge of the operation of the hotels in the beginning. I was just wondering if this was correct and if it was, how did Westin and Sheraton become in charge of the operation? (It doesn't go into this in the book)


Thanks for any help you may be able to give!!!!!!


:wave:

 

[mkt]

The Swan and Dolphin are both on a 99 year lease from Disney, to Starwood (Sheraton).

ie- Disney actually owns them, but Starwood staffs, maintains, and operates them.

 

[abu21]

Thanks for answering my question, MKT!!

Here's another question-

Why is Disney leasing to Sheraton for 99 years? Disney obviously has the knowledge to run a successful hotel, so why would they have someone else run one of their hotels?

 

[JaynMACP96_97_9]

I don't know any details about this particular lease. But in general terms its cost effective as far as human resources and insurance goes.

When i was working the Friendships and had to known general things about the Swan & Dolphin for guest questions, we were told that they were owned by two separate hotel giants, so was that incorrect, or did Sheraton take control over both of them in the past 6 years?

All incoming employees at the two resorts still have to go through the same orientation at Disney University as regular Cast Members do.

I used to be an area manager with Hertz and had a few licensee locations in my area. They hired, and had to insure, their own staff. They paid up for the usage of our brand, which in most industries, makes or breaks you.

 

[abu21]

Thanks for the info... so I'm assuming that Sheraton gets a large cut of the revenue from the Swan and Dolphin? I can see the cost effective savings Disney would achieve by leasing these resorts, but wouldn't the amount of money coming in balance the cost savings of leasing them out? Questions, questions, questions... :lol:

 

[lamarvenoy]

When i was working the Friendships and had to known general things about the Swan & Dolphin for guest questions, we were told that they were owned by two separate hotel giants, so was that incorrect, or did Sheraton take control over both of them in the past 6 years?

Yup, Westin and Sheraton are now branches of the "Starwood" tree.

 

[DisneyJill]

Sheraton and Westin are both owned by Starwood, however, they operate the Dolphin and Swan, respectively. According to the Birnbaum's official guide, Swan is operated by Westin and the Dolphin is operated by Sheraton. There was a Radisson in Indianapolis that was two towers, and Westin/Sheraton took it over and each hotel operated a tower but shared a lobby and facilities. Kind of odd, but it seemed to work ok.

 

[niteobsrvr]

This issue is so much more complicated that what initially meets the eye.

The Walt Disney World Swan and Dolphin Hotels are owned by The Tishman Hotel and Realty Corporation ( an affiliate of Tishman Realty and Construction Co ) and Metropolitan Life Insurance Company.

The land under the hotels is owned by Disney.

The two resorts are managed by Starwood Resorts which currently owns several hotel brands including Westin and Sheraton.

Tishman Realty and Construction was the company charged with building Epcot Center. More info : Tishman

Tisman was granted rights to build hotels on Disney property in their agreement to Build Epcot. This agreement was made before Michael Eisner and Frank Wells took over the helm. Once they did take over, they felt Tishman had been given too much freedom. They also realized that Disney itself should be in the Hotel Buisness. The dispute that followed resulted in what you see today. Not to mention, the resolution also prevented Disney from building Convention Facilities on their property for 10 years.

This information was gleaned form several Websites including press releases from the appropriate business entities.

 

[Bagheera]

Was one of those web sites you reference a MousePlanet Mailbag column in which I addressed that subject?

Starwood does indeed manage both hotels. The hotels themselves are actually owned by the Tishman Hotel Corporation (in conjunction with Met Life), which had been granted the right to own and build all convention hotels on the Walt Disney World property for the next 10 years. This was granted because of Tishman Construction's role in the building of EPCOT Center. The hotels were originally supposed to be built in the Lake Buena Vista Hotel Plaza Boulevard area.

After Michael Eisner and Frank Wells came on board in 1984, they quickly decided that Disney should control most of the hotel rooms on property themselves. They reached an agreement with Tishman to locate the hotels near Epcot, and to let him use the Disney name on the hotels. In exchange, Disney would get control over the design of the hotels, and Tishman would be forced to live by the same service standards as Disney provided in the parks. Of course, after Tishman's 10 year agreement exprired, Disney went ahead with the construction of convention facilities at the Boardwalk, the Yacht and Beach Clubs, the Contemporary Resort, and the Coronado Springs resort.

 

[josh_e_washie]

So why doesn't disney just buy the actual hotel buildings from Tishman? Does this also mean that Tishman has connections to EPCOT still? Also...doesn't Disney have Imagineering which does all of its design and construction? What's going on??!!!!

 

[niteobsrvr]

Originally posted by Bagheera
Was one of those web sites you reference a MousePlanet Mailbag column in which I addressed that subject?

Actually, I had performed some extensive research on this subject maybe two years ago or so to settle a dispute with someone else. Some of the source material I originally found is probalby long gone form the net by now. I did run across your reply to a reader last night while re-verifying some of the information. Other information was obtained directly from my contact in the marketing department at Starwood.

 

[niteobsrvr]

Originally posted by josh_e_washie
So why doesn't disney just buy the actual hotel buildings from Tishman? Does this also mean that Tishman has connections to EPCOT still?

You can't buy what isn't for sale.

Also...doesn't Disney have Imagineering which does all of its design and construction? What's going on??!!!!

Imagineers are designers with backgrounds in many disciplines who speacialize in creating themed entertainment/attractions/hotels. Many of them work on contracts with Disney and are not actually employed by the company as fulltime employees due to the nature of their projects.

The actual engineering of a venue may also be farmed out to an outside firm who will use Disney's artwork and concepts to complete the designs.

Disney also hires construction companies and project managers to handle the actual build-out of their designs.

 

[Yellow Shoes]

slight thread drfit.........

Swan/Dolphin trivia

the statues are on the wrong hotels

the dolphin should be on the building that has the waves painted on it

the swan should be on the building with the grass.

 

[RickEff]

Originally posted by Yellow Shoes
slight thread drfit.........

Swan/Dolphin trivia

the statues are on the wrong hotels

the dolphin should be on the building that has the waves painted on it

the swan should be on the building with the grass.

And the swan LOOKS like a swan. The dolphin looks like some prehistoric fish, IMO.:lol:

 

[mkt]

Originally posted by RickEff
The dolphin looks like some prehistoric fish

yes... that's because it's a Dolphin fish (aka- Mahi Mahi).. not the marine mammal... lol


plus, does the "Swan and Mahi-Mahi" sound right? lol. Sounds like bad Seafood Restaurant

 

[s25843]

Well the upside is that with All Westin Hotels you get the Heavenly Bed!!!!

 

[RickEff]

Originally posted by mkt
yes... that's because it's a Dolphin fish (aka- Mahi Mahi).. not the marine mammal... lol


plus, does the "Swan and Mahi-Mahi" sound right? lol. Sounds like bad Seafood Restaurant

Ick.

For the uneducated (apparently like me <g>) couldn't they have just made it a DOLPHIN DOLPHIN? :lol:

 

[surfsupdon]

Yea, it is not a "Flipper" Dolphin mammel but a fish. Yet real mahis are smooth and multi colored, greens, browns, greys, silvers, and if I am thinking correctly, the statues have rigid scales on them to show textures...or at least the "Dolphin" pictures do in brochures and on packets for the Resort, if not the actual statues themselves.

 

[Bagheera]

There are actually many varieties of dolphinfish, if I recall correctly from my research. Plus, the design was adapted from a Renaissance sculptor's original work. For more info on how Michael Graves came to design the hotel, and where he drew inspiration from, check out the book "Building a Dream: The Art of Disney Architecture" by Beth Dunlop.