Pixar, Disney Trade Barbs on Partnership

General Grizz

New Member
Original Poster
Pixar, Disney Trade Barbs on Partnership

By Peter Henderson and Bob Tourtellotte

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Talk about some animated finger pointing.

Pixar Animation Studios Inc. chief Steve Jobs (news - web sites) blasted his former film partner, The Walt Disney Co., on Wednesday saying recent Disney animated films had bombed at the box office and questioned Disney chief Michael Eisner's movie sense.

Disney fired back in its own statement late in the afternoon saying it was saddened by Jobs' statements, which it called a mischaracterization of their relationship.

Late last week, the pair of animated movie giants -- Pixar and Disney -- ended talks on renewing a long-running film pact that yielded a string of five movie hits dating back to 1995's "Toy Story" and peaking at last year's $850 million global box office wonder "Finding Nemo."

In a conference call with financial analysts and reporters, Jobs said he walked away from the negotiating table because Disney would not agree to give Pixar full ownership of "Incredibles" and "Cars," the last two movies in the companies' current contract.

In an attempt to anticipate investor concerns, Pixar Chief Financial Officer Ann Mather asked Jobs several key questions, including whether losing Disney's marketing prowess would hurt Pixar's future films. Jobs said he did not think so.

DISNEY SEQUELS MAKE JOBS "SICK"

"Not even Disney's marketing and brand could turn Disney's last two animated films, 'Treasure Planet' and Brother Bear" into successes. Both bombed at the box office," Jobs said.

Disney has retained the rights to make a sequel to "Toy Story," and could possibly make sequels of the other movies that resulted from their collaborations.

"We feel sick about Disney doing sequels because if you look at the quality of their sequels, like 'The Lion King 1-1/2,' 'Peter Pan' sequels and stuff, it is pretty embarrassing," Jobs said, adding there had been "little creative collaboration" with Disney on the Pixar films for years.

Jobs also read from a 2003 Los Angeles Times article citing people familiar with the matter as saying Disney Chief Executive and Chairman Michael Eisner told his board "not to expect a blockbuster" from "Nemo," and that quoted Eisner as saying Pixar, "may be headed for a reality check."

"We've been told the same story by several folks at Disney. As you know things turned out a little different," Jobs said.

During the call, Jobs praised Walt Disney Studios head ________ Cook, but did not speak of Eisner in the same way. He said he and other executives were "sad" to move on and that top Pixar executives love "the original spirit of Disney."

For its part, Disney released a statement saying "it is unfortunate Steve Jobs has grossly mischaracterized" the negotiations.

"It's also sad and unfortunate that he has resorted to insults and name-calling in the wake of the disagreement. We expected better of him," the Disney statement said.

====

This part made me proud:

"We feel sick about Disney doing sequels because if you look at the quality of their sequels, like 'The Lion King 1-1/2,' 'Peter Pan' sequels and stuff, it is pretty embarrassing," Jobs said, adding there had been "little creative collaboration" with Disney on the Pixar films for years.

Steve Jobs totally understands. Which one is doing successfully? The one that does one major release per year, at fully quality standards.

Go Steve Jobs! :D :sohappy:

HOWEVER. . . I certainly sense an excess in "name-calling." Depending on where Jobs goes in relation to Roy, we'll have to sit back and see what happens.
 

Woody13

New Member
I really disliked the idea that Disney was going to do "Return to Neverland". Like Grizz, I said to myself, "Don't touch the classics!". However, that Evil Eisner person decided to go ahead with this project, much to my dislike.

Well, to my surprise, they did an excellent job IMO. Disney more than doubled their money in the US theatrical release alone. The international release and DVD sales were just great!

Jobs should be embarrassed, not Disney. Oh yeah, the story was great too!:animwink:
 

General Grizz

New Member
Original Poster
I waited until a relative bought Peter Pan 2. I sat down, and while parts of it were entertaining, it was by no way a "Disney classic," like, say, Toy Story 2.

Oh wait. That's Steve Jobs.

I especially ADMIRED ( :rolleyes: ) the fact that "Do You Believe in Magic?" created the ending credits because Disney was too cheap to write its own song.

And when you get all of these sequels left in right, in theaters and on DVD, the public eventually adobts the current overall "Disney is standard" feeling.

And we wonder why "Brother Bear" didn't do well in theaters?

Thank films like Peter Pan 2.

Down, down, the rabbit hole Eisner falls. . .
 

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by General Grizz

Oh wait. That's Steve Jobs.

No..its his COMPANY. He has no hand in anything they create at all.

The one i feel worst for in this whole ordeal is lassater...cuz he's pretty much the one whos made pixar what it is.
 

MouseRight

Active Member
I listened to the Jobs news conferences yesterday. As a businessman and accountant, I have participated in and listened to many of these. I gotta say that Jobs' tirade was the most unprofessional and childish behavior I have ever heard. I felt like I was in an elementary school and overheard a child telling his friend that "My dad is better than your dad" :hurl:

Totally inappropriate for a leader of one company to bash and criticize a leader of, and a, company the way he did. The bogus question and answer session between his CFO and Jobs was pathetic. The truth is, he didn't get the deal he wanted from Disney, his ego is hurt and, like a child, he is lashing out. This was a bad deal for Disney financially and creatively. Disney needs to re-focus its resources and creative energy (both traditional and digital animation) back into its own house. By not making a deal with Jobs, particularly one that woudl have lost the rights to the next 2 films, Disney can and will do exactly that.

He had some good arguments - Pixar doesn't need Disney's distribution and/or cretaive input - but the bashing of Disney and Eisner was totally inappropriate for the leader of a public company and a person who has been hailed as the greatest thing since sliced bread by many.

His behavior yesterday, has cemented my opinion that he is not the one to lead Disney if and when Eisner leaves.
 

GaryT977

New Member
It seems that Steve Jobs is one of those polarizing people, and as a result people pay more attention to how he says things than what he says.

From that article, I detected no name calling. He simply said that Eisner said Nemo was going to fail, and that he missed the original spirit of Disney.

I also agree with him that it's a shame Disney wouldn't give up the rights to make sequels to Pixar movies, especially since they had no creative input in making the originals. The idea of a Nemo 1-1/2 angers my blood, to be honest.

Disney is the loser in this little tussle, and it was Eisner's ego, not Job's, that is to blame.
 

Tim G

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by General Grizz
Pixar, Disney Trade Barbs on Partnership

By Peter Henderson and Bob Tourtellotte

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Talk about some animated finger pointing.

Can you provide an URL about the article you are quoting?
 

MouseRight

Active Member
Originally posted by GaryT977


Disney is the loser in this little tussle, and it was Eisner's ego, not Job's, that is to blame.

Let's get realistic. Both egos are invloved here. However, during this news conference it was Jobs' on full display and pitiful at that.

The article does not give the same spin as listening to the news conference. You realy get a sense of his childish remarks when you hear them instead of reading edited versions.

Wth respect to sequels, why was it okay for Jobs to do Toy Story 2, when he needed money but not okay now. Granted, I agree that Disney has gone too far with sequels, but Disney owns that right and shouldn't have to give it away to make Jobs and his shareholders happy. Do you think that a new distributor won't demand sequels from Pixar? Hollywood can't help themsleves. Don't kid yourself, Jobs will do sequels and why shouldn't Disney share in the profits from those.

Finally, I don't think Disney is the loser here. They have a few more years of distributig the last 2 films, keep all of the rights they already have, and have time to refocus their energy and resources. Pixar was a crutch that needs to be thrown away and which will let the patient stand on his own. It's time for Disney to take back the crown. I think they will do it, with or without Esiner.
 

GaryT977

New Member
Originally posted by MouseRight
Let's get realistic. Both egos are invloved here. However, during this news conference it was Jobs' on full display and pitiful at that.

We're just going to have to disagree on this one. I found nothing wrong with Jobs' speech, and I have a great deal of respect for people who say exactly what they think. I also think the response from Disney, calling Jobs a namecaller instead of responding to the points he made, is telling indeed.

Wth respect to sequels, why was it okay for Jobs to do Toy Story 2, when he needed money but not okay now. Granted, I agree that Disney has gone too far with sequels, but Disney owns that right and shouldn't have to give it away to make Jobs and his shareholders happy.

I should think the answer is obvious. Pixar created Toy Story, why shouldn't they make a sequel? Let's turn this around. If Pixar decided to make a sequel to, say Mary Poppins, would Disney have cause to complain?

The facts are that Disney made a ton of money simply by marketing and distributing Pixar's creations, and owns the copyrights to them, and instead of negotiating a new deal recognizing the contributions Pixar has made to the disney empire, they played hardball and lost. This, coupled with the cannabilation of the animation department, may be something Disney won't be able to recover from.

I know alot of people don't like Steve Jobs and can't see past that, but Pixar was getting a raw deal, and he was correct in trying to fix it. Eisner blew it, big time.
 

General Grizz

New Member
Original Poster
Originally posted by NowInc
No..its his COMPANY. He has no hand in anything they create at all.

The one i feel worst for in this whole ordeal is lassater...cuz he's pretty much the one whos made pixar what it is.

Pardon me for the labelling; I was going for the long-term approach of the company by doing well on greatly spaced films, max one release/year idea. . . not the creative talent in this case. :)
 

Woody13

New Member
Originally posted by MouseRight
http://corporate.pixar.com/medialist.cfm

Click on 4th Quarter 2003 Conference. Follow instructions. Once listening to the replay of the conference fast forward about 10 Minutes to hear Jobs.

Thanks for the link.:D You're right. You learn a lot more by listening to the conference rather than just reading a transcript. With that in mind, I am curious if you are going to attend any of the Disney investment analysts meetings during the next week?

A friend of mine from TD Waterhouse is at his meetings now at the Swan/Dolphin resorts. I'm going down this weekend in preparation for our conference on February 11 and 12. We've been told the "big cheese" and a bunch of other mousekateers will be there.
 

General Grizz

New Member
Original Poster
Re: Re: Pixar, Disney Trade Barbs on Partnership

Originally posted by Corrus
Grizz??

I know how much you hate Eisner, but would you be so kind that, if you quote articles, quote them well...

“We feel sick about Disney doing sequels,” Jobs said.

And not..
DISNEY SEQUELS MAKE JOBS "SICK"

Sorry, your taking things out of context...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4176887/

I did not take anything out of context. Everything about the "====" came from the online article.
 

Tim G

Well-Known Member
Re: Re: Re: Pixar, Disney Trade Barbs on Partnership

Originally posted by General Grizz
I did not take anything out of context. Everything about the "====" came from the online article.

Ok...
 

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by NowInc
The one i feel worst for in this whole ordeal is lassater...cuz he's pretty much the one whos made pixar what it is.


I totally agree. Fortunately, Lassater has gotten a good deal of credit for his work by the media but it is funny how you don’t really hear Steve say anything about him when he starts talking about *his* great company…

The worst part is that it doesn’t (at least on the outside) seem like John has the bad blood towards Disney the way Jobs does at all… I mean, he had a lot to do with them getting the Miyazaki library, didn’t he? That had nothing at all to do with Pixar and while I guess it could be said that orchestrating a deal with the Devil in order to get those films over here might have been worth it to him, I don’t think he would have endorsed and nurtured a deal between someone he respected and admired with a company that he didn’t trust and hated…

Maybe I’m totally off base?
 

Woody13

New Member
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Pixar, Disney Trade Barbs on Partnership

Originally posted by General Grizz
You're confusing me, Corrus, but I don't have the delete feature. :lol:

Corrus unfortunately confused the AP article that he saw with the original Reuters article that you posted. Honest mistake.:D
 

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by GaryT977
We're just going to have to disagree on this one. I found nothing wrong with Jobs' speech, and I have a great deal of respect for people who say exactly what they think. I also think the response from Disney, calling Jobs a namecaller instead of responding to the points he made, is telling indeed.

Well, there is a lot to be said for the leader of a large publicly traded corporation showing a little class when it comes to prepared speeches they make about corporate partners – especially ones they are still in business with.

I suppose that Disney could have gone on the defensive and argued points (weather they have room to argue or not, public relations teams are paid good money to create positive spin from nothing) but in such dealings, it is generally customary for fortune 500 companies to not sink to that level when partners or competitors talk out of line – Disney is not alone in this kind of stance which is generally regarded by analysts to be the right way to respond.

You may think what he said is fine. Had it been said over a beer in a bar to friends with someone from the media listening in from the next booth, I’d agree but not at a planned public speaking. Jobs is playing politics in trying to make his company look better by disparaging the guy on the other side of the table.

Pixar is a good creative company. Mr. Jobs’ comments were unnecessary, inappropriate and unfortunate because they may be satisfying to him but do nothing to benefit Pixart. I say unfortunate because I highly doubt they will go unnoticed by Pixar’s suitors or by financial analysts.. Jobs has a reputation of being irrational and uncouth. This kind of thing only confirms that in many peoples minds (my own included). It probably won’t hurt a deal but it sure invites hostility in future partnerships.

The worst part is that all these statements were premeditated for a mock question and answer session. He chose to take digs at Disney when there was absolutely no need to. It wasn’t an accident, it wasn’t off the cuff. It was a planned public slap.

You may respect him for what he said (which sounds rather bland when you hear him say it in a monotone, scripted manner) but I think it is a safe bet that most in the business world (Hollywood included) will not.

Originally posted by GaryT977
I should think the answer is obvious. Pixar created Toy Story, why shouldn't they make a sequel? Let's turn this around. If Pixar decided to make a sequel to, say Mary Poppins, would Disney have cause to complain?

I should think they would since Disney has the movie rights to Mary Poppins and Pixar does not – just like Disney has the rights to Toy Story and Pixar does not. Steve apparently didn’t feel too sick when he signed a contract agreeing to all of this.

Originally posted by GaryT977
I know alot of people don't like Steve Jobs and can't see past that, but Pixar was getting a raw deal, and he was correct in trying to fix it. Eisner blew it, big time.

I know (and work with) a lot of hard line Mac fans who love Jobs and can’t see past that. Pixar was getting the deal they agreed to raw or not. Nobody twisted their arm or took advantage of them. While I do not doubt that Eisner played a strong roll in the deal not going through, don’t see how you can base total blame on Eisner’s or more generally, Disney’s end… That is unless you are privy to information that the rest of us aren’t. If that is the case, perhaps you can shed more light on the situation for all of us here.

I say this because most of the negative comments about Eisner come from antidotal incidents where as most of Jobs’ come from his public behavior – recorded and available for the world to hear and see. Again, I’m not trying to suggest that Eisner was a positive influence in the situation by any means but to say that Jobs wasn’t a negative one would be like saying the bulldog next door has already attacked people and animals didn’t kill your cat.
 

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