Autistic visitors can proceed with lawsuits against Disney - OC Register

[Darkbeer1]

https://www.ocregister.com/2018/08/20/autistic-visitors-can-proceed-with-lawsuits-against-disney/

>>
Visitors with severe autism can move ahead with their lawsuits claiming Disney’s U.S. parks, including Disneyland, didn’t do enough to accommodate their need for scheduled routines and no waits on its rides, according to a federal appeals court.


The 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals last week ruled that plaintiffs in 30 lawsuits can proceed in a lower court with their claims against Walt Disney Parks and Resorts, alleging violations of the Americans with Disabilities Act. People with severe autism often have difficulties with social interaction and communication and often adhere to rigid routines.


A district judge in Florida had ruled previously that Disney was accommodating the autistic visitors and dismissed the claims in 2016. The autistic visitors appealed to the court in Atlanta.

“Disneyland thinks everyone is trying to commit fraud,” said Mission Viejo mom Rebecca Goddard, who has two boys ages 9 and 11 on the autism spectrum. She’s been trying to decide whether the family should renew its annual passes given the difficulty involved in bringing her boys to the parks under the new rules. “Truthfully, in my opinion, Disney really doesn’t want us there anymore.”<<

>>In allowing the lawsuits to move forward, the appeals court said that the fact-finding coming out of the trials would help determine what is considered “necessary” to accommodate autistic visitors’ need for rigid routines and no waits. The judges said that Disney didn’t intentionally discriminate against the autistic visitors and that the question the district court will decide is whether Disney needs to modify its policies.<<

More in the article....

 

[Kram Sacul]

Huh?

 

[King Capybara 77]

The way I see it is that Disney is in the wrong whatever they do.

 

[drizgirl]

How can anyone, even parents of special needs kids, demand no waits? I think the current DAS system is more than fair.

Can you even imagine SWL functioning with a particular group of guests guaranteed re-rides with no wait?

 

[lazyboy97o]

It seems Disney’s big challenge will be demonstrating that the previous system was an unreasonable accommodation.

The plaintiffs desires do not seem reasonable so I doubt they would be forced. Sting operations would probably just be outright illegal, or at least to close to be of any value. A guaranteed wait of 15 minutes or less is not possible to meet.

 

[FerretAfros]

“Disneyland thinks everyone is trying to commit fraud,”

And they're right. While there are a lot of people who use the system for legitimate purposes, fraud under the guise of "reasonable accommodation" is rampant throughout society. Just look at all the airlines who have recently had to revise their service animal policies after widespread abuse by people who just want to carry their lapdog for free.

I believe that giving guests the flexibility to wait out the queue wherever they want (but keeping the wait time the same as the mainstream queue) is reasonable, but what do I know? I only work with ADA on a daily basis and have 2 copies of it on my desk at this very moment, and know that it's vague-at-best about these types of situations.

She’s been trying to decide whether the family should renew its annual passes given the difficulty involved in bringing her boys to the parks under the new rules.

The new rules went into effect in 2013, and she's still trying to decide whether to renew her APs? Whether she decided to renew or let them expire, she's already made that decision several times over by now.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

What happens when a ride closes for technical or weather related-issues? What about refurbishments?

Disney can't guarantee that every ride will even be open at the time the child wants to ride it.

 

[Californian Elitist]

I remember working Pan one day and a woman cake with her family through the exit, flashed her card, and tried to get everyone on a ship. I told her she would have to wait until I gave her and her family the okay to hop in a ship. She gave me an attitude and told me her card meant she and her family had to board as soon as possible. I reminded her that it was not possible for her to get on at the time, much to her dismay. After they got off the ride, she asked for my name because she had plans to “call her lawyer on me.” I gave her my full name without skipping a beat and almost asked if she wanted my address as well.

This lawsuit is ridiculous.

 

[NormC]

Disney made reasonable accommodations and that is all they are required to do. Case closed.

 

[asianway]

And they're right. While there are a lot of people who use the system for legitimate purposes, fraud under the guise of "reasonable accommodation" is rampant throughout society. Just look at all the airlines who have recently had to revise their service animal policies after widespread abuse by people who just want to carry their lapdog for free.

I believe that giving guests the flexibility to wait out the queue wherever they want (but keeping the wait time the same as the mainstream queue) is reasonable, but what do I know? I only work with ADA on a daily basis and have 2 copies of it on my desk at this very moment, and know that it's vague-at-best about these types of situations.

The new rules went into effect in 2013, and she's still trying to decide whether to renew her APs? Whether she decided to renew or let them expire, she's already made that decision several times over by now.

The precedent a ruling against Disney in this case would be staggering to many areas beyond theme parks. It would mean no one who claimed Autism, on their word, would ever need to wait in a line again.

 

[TROR]

I don't even understand why it's necessary for someone with autism to skip the line. I understand that people with severe cases of autism may be incredibly uncomfortable waiting in a line, but so are toddlers and we shouldn't just give families with toddlers front of the line passes. It's silly. Besides, if someone has such extreme cases of autism that they can't even function when waiting in a line, how are they supposed to function on Indiana Jones Adventure or Big Thunder Mountain?

 

[TP2000]

The plaintiffs desires do not seem reasonable so I doubt they would be forced. Sting operations would probably just be outright illegal, or at least to close to be of any value. A guaranteed wait of 15 minutes or less is not possible to meet.

Exactly. And what happens in Star Wars Land where there is a half hour long mandatory training "pre-show" and long build up to the actual ride? The Autism AP family from Mission Viejo might be okay the first time they go on the Star Wars rides, but what about the 10th or 20th time a year later? They can't skip the pre-shows and zip right to the boarding area.

She also never seems to address waiting in lines for security checks, parking trams, entrance turnstiles, Main Street Starbucks, etc. It's only the rides she cares about, mysteriously.

Ms. Goddard's expectations of how a crowded theme park is supposed to work for her children seem very unrealistic. Let alone the DMV, the SoCal freeways, Target on a Sunday, airports, concerts, sports stadiums, etc., etc.

The new rules went into effect in 2013, and she's still trying to decide whether to renew her APs? Whether she decided to renew or let them expire, she's already made that decision several times over by now.

I know, that was my favorite part of her commentary! As if we are supposed to feel sorry for her because she might not renew her Disneyland AP's. Hysterically out of touch there in Mission Viejo.

 

[John park hopper]

I don't want to sound insensitive but :
"People with severe autism often have difficulties with social interaction and communication and often adhere to rigid routines".
May be they should not be going to a place that is crowded, all about visual and hearing stimulation, and not a place for rigid routines. WDW does more than enough to be accommodating

 

[SuddenStorm]

Disney made reasonable accommodations and that is all they are required to do. Case closed.

Exactly. Reasonable accomadation means that they're able to receive the same experience as a person not suffering from a disability.

It doesn't mean Disney provides you with a VIP front of the line pass for free, slowing down the ride's load times and decreasing the capacity and experience for everyone else.

 

[SuddenStorm]

The precedent a ruling against Disney in this case would be staggering to many areas beyond theme parks. It would mean no one who claimed Autism, on their word, would ever need to wait in a line again.

And when no one waits in a line... everyone does.

-Syndrome, The Incredibles 2004

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

"People with severe autism often have difficulties with social interaction and communication and often adhere to rigid routines."

Doesn't sound like any Disneyland visitor I know of.

 

[Orangeanna]

I have a 9 year old son with autism and other issues. He is legally disabled. We are passholders. I have never used the das card but I plan to. I'm tired of riding the same 3 rides we get on fastpass. His 7 year old sister has rights too. I'm more than happy to wait the same time as stand-by, I just can't wait in line. Riding repeatedly and waiting less than 15 minutes is unreasonable. Does Disney owe me when they shut a ride down for weather and my son has a meltdown? Obviously not. Walking right on is the dream but it's just not fair. If Disney loses this suit I fear for all honest people in the parks. How long will stand-by be when unscrupulous people claim they're disabled to bypass lines. A terrible idea.

 

[TP2000]

I have a 9 year old son with autism and other issues. He is legally disabled. We are passholders. I have never used the das card but I plan to. I'm tired of riding the same 3 rides we get on fastpass. His 7 year old sister has rights too. I'm more than happy to wait the same time as stand-by, I just can't wait in line. Riding repeatedly and waiting less than 15 minutes is unreasonable. Does Disney owe me when they shut a ride down for weather and my son has a meltdown? Obviously not. Walking right on is the dream but it's just not fair. If Disney loses this suit I fear for all honest people in the parks. How long will stand-by be when unscrupulous people claim they're disabled to bypass lines. A terrible idea.

You sound like a good person, but you are an aberration when it comes to waiting in line at Disneyland.

Disneyland has tried to offer accomodations. But when the law says you can't ask for medical proof, there is nothing stopping any AP from walking in to City Hall and saying "My child is autistic, I need the DAS card". And now on the average Sunday you've got thousands and thousands of people in the parks who have autistic kids, or social anxiety, or gastro-intestinal issues, or any number of vague medical issues that no one is allowed to question.

Can't wait in line? Don't go to Disneyland, it's had long lines since about 1958.

 

[Orangeanna]

You sound like a good person, but you are an aberration when it comes to waiting in line at Disneyland.

Disneyland has tried to offer accomodations. But when the law says you can't ask for medical proof, there is nothing stopping any AP from walking in to City Hall and saying "My child is autistic, I need the DAS card". And now on the average Sunday you've got thousands and thousands of people in the parks who have autistic kids, or social anxiety, or gastro-intestinal issues, or any number of vague medical issues that no one is allowed to question.

Can't wait in line? Don't go to Disneyland, it's had long lines since about 1958.

I wish they could ask for some kind of proof, I have it. But I understand why that would also be a nightmare. What is the answer? We've tried to just use fastpasses but rides break and some things are never available.

 

[John park hopper]

I wish they could ask for some kind of proof, I have it. But I understand why that would also be a nightmare. What is the answer? We've tried to just use fastpasses but rides break and some things are never available.

I agree with you there should be bonified proof for many issues. The way the system is set up it relies on people being honest, however there are far to many who simply are not honest and try to scam the system at the expense of those who are.