Animation Computer Programs

J

JLW11Hi

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I am currently browsing around for animation programs for the computer. I was wondering if anyone might be able suggest any certain programs?

I realize these babies cost a lot. I hear Flash is ok to start with at $500. What can you all do with the program? I can see myself more into hand drawing each frame and scanning them into the computer. Are there any specific programs out there that work good with this style of animating?

Thanks for any help!

(PS, if you request a program, give its price, too :) )
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Are you interested in 2D or 3D?

Flash is primarily a 2D animation program..and is mostly used for web based/interactive animations/presentations..

if its REAL cartoons you wanna make..yer gunna shell out a bit more cash..but in actuality..its worth it...

For example "toonz" (made by softimage) is by far one of the BEST 2D animation programs that I have had the pleasure to lay my hands on..but it has a yearly licence fee in the 4000 dollar range..

CTP is another one made by a company called "meteor" (i think)..which is also pretty good (CTP = Cartoons television program).

Both of the above mentioned programs have specific tools for taking and converting your hand drawn scanned frames to make em easier to work with..

Flash has a "trace bitmap" function thats a pain in the butt to work with, but hey..you get what you pay for..right?

..if its 3D you want..thats a whole other post ;)
 
J

JLW11Hi

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Thanks NowInc! Yep, Its 2D I'm pretty much interested in.

I lookes at the SoftImage website. Say I were to go ahead and be okay with paying 4000 per year for Toonz (which isnt the case :))...where would I go about purchasing the program? I didn't find anywhere to see about buying it on the website.

Do you know how much that CTP program costs? (and mabey a website?)

Ok, one last question (I mean it this time!)

Could you explain that Bitmap Trace thing? I think I'll go ahead and try Flash. I used the trial version a while back, but I never did any scanning. Me being a beginner, Flash looks like a good place to start.

Agin, thanks fur the info
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
hehe...ok..first ::

Toonz - http://www.softimage.com/Products/Other/Toonz/

USUALLY to buy a program like toonz, you go thru a local distributor...going directly thru the company 9 time out of 10 is impossible...

CTP - http://www.filmwareproducts.com/CTP/ is a place you can get it cheap (keep in mind that it comes in PARTS...as you can see)

As for trace bitmap in flash::

Its been a while..so bare with me...

First, lets say you do a series of 30 hand drawn fames (30 frames = 1 second for video)..you would scan them in order, and give them progressive file names (ex: pic001, pic002, pic003 etc )

You can make them any extension as long as they are black and white. (its not REQUIRED..but SOOOOOO much easier to keep em without color)

You would then go to flash, open a new animation, and import image sequance..choosing the first picture in the group.

All images will load up in order on the time line.

...this is where it gets interesting..

highlight all the frames on the timeline, go to "trace bitmap" (not exactly sure if its in file or edit..but its there)...fiddle with the options (it doesnt really matter, no matter wHAT setting you use, you have a LOT of work to do after this step), and let it work its magic..

you'll see that all your images are now "vectorized"...but are messy as hell. Now you get to go frame by frame and fix em so that they look right.

PERSONALLY..the way *I* would do it is to import all the images in the sequabce on one layer...LOCK that layer...make a new layer on TOP of that one..and manually trace it (using red or something so that its easy to distinguish..you can always change it later)
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
 
J

JLW11Hi

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Yeah, I kinda figured the process would be a bit tedious like that :)

Still, its better than nothin! Yeah, it'll be easier than the other attempts Ive made to make animations on the computer. I think I'll get the hang of it.

"PERSONALLY..the way *I* would do it is to import all the images in the sequabce on one layer...LOCK that layer...make a new layer on TOP of that one..and manually trace it (using red or something so that its easy to distinguish..you can always change it later)"

So by this you mean that when one layer is locked, you can put another over it, still see the image, but can trace over it on the computer without touching the original image? I think I understand.

Thanks again!
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by JLW11Hi


So by this you mean that when one layer is locked, you can put another over it, still see the image, but can trace over it on the computer without touching the original image? I think I understand.
Click to expand...

Yeah..pretty much :D Just make sure you use a color that contrasts that of the "bottom" image so that you can trace easier ;) I usually use red or pink...and use a hairline sized line as well..you can always change it later ;)
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
I guess I should also sorta explain that the reason those toonz and CTP programs cost so much, is well..because they are MADE for 2D animation, and as such have some great features::

Auto tracing (MUCH faster and more reliable than flash)
Auto shadows
TONS of coloring options
Lip Sync datasheets
Real Time Previews (flash is NEVER realtime when you playback)
Output to video

etc etc...

When in college I used Toonz, it was great! I havnt tried CTP (yet) but I have an upcoming project that would require some 2D work, depending on the clients willingness to up front me some cash to try CTP, i'll let you know how it is.
 
J

JLW11Hi

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Did you use Toonz as part of a course you were taking in college, or did you buy it on your own?

If I get into animation classes later in college, I'd have to look in on that.

When you say it doesn't play in realtime, does it play slow or something?
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by JLW11Hi
Did you use Toonz as part of a course you were taking in college, or did you buy it on your own?

If I get into animation classes later in college, I'd have to look in on that.

When you say it doesn't play in realtime, does it play slow or something?
Click to expand...


Sorry for not replying sooner, had a hectic day...

to answer your first question...yes..I first used toonz back in college (they were previously using flash and then moved to toonz..thankfully :) )

Second question:

Basically..when you playback in flash..its either FASTER than 30fps (video standard frames per second) or SLOWER (much slower)...so its not an accurate representation of the animation.
 
J

JLW11Hi

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
hey, no problem, Im just glad you're taking the time to answer all these questions I'm throwing at you!

I take it, then, that once you have the animation done, it goes at a normal speed? I guess I assumed you could adjust the frame rate of the animation.
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by JLW11Hi
hey, no problem, Im just glad you're taking the time to answer all these questions I'm throwing at you!

I take it, then, that once you have the animation done, it goes at a normal speed? I guess I assumed you could adjust the frame rate of the animation.
Click to expand...

Basically..once you get the animation done..you can adjust the speed accordingly..but its usually better to "pre-plan" these things before you start drawing frames...

Basically...lets say you have a 10 second animation for video..

video - 30 frames per second...which means 30 drawings..

so thats 300 frames/drawings

however...say you decide you want to make the animation LONGER..by 1 second...

Thats 30 more "frames" the computer is going to try and find that arent there..so it will look choppy..so chances are you will have to draw the "fill in" frames..

This really wont be a problem if you wanted to make it SHORTER..since it would just speed up the framerate and re-adjust itself..

...confused?

sorry ;)
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
..in case you are wondering why i keep saying 30 fps for VIDEO..its because that film has a different frame rate...

24 frames per second for film
30 frames for TV/Video/DVD etc...

..been like that for years...
 
J

JLW11Hi

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Ok, no, I'm not confused (yet!).

Thanks for all the info, thats all I think I need to know... untill I think of anything else, that is :D
 
B

Blizz

New Member
Well you also have to remeber that in Macromedia Flash MX it is defaulted to 12 FPS. So make sure to change that (sorry if I am stating the obvious).

I use Macromedia Freehand MX and Fireworks MX to create some of the figures, symbols, and objects and then use the tweening tools to do most of the work. Trace bitmap is a pain in my mind just because its so hard to get them to allign right and well i just find it a pain. While Flash is an inexpensive program (compaired to others) you get what you pay for. But if I were you I would not shell out the cash just for Flash MX, get Studio MX Plus. Its a bit more, but it is worth it in my mind for Fireworks and Dreamweaver and now Plus comes with Cold Fusion and the devNET templets.

I do however want toonz now, it looks like fun, but I dont have the 4000 a year to pay for it.
 
NowInc

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Blizz
Well you also have to remeber that in Macromedia Flash MX it is defaulted to 12 FPS. So make sure to change that (sorry if I am stating the obvious).

I use Macromedia Freehand MX and Fireworks MX to create some of the figures, symbols, and objects and then use the tweening tools to do most of the work. Trace bitmap is a pain in my mind just because its so hard to get them to allign right and well i just find it a pain. While Flash is an inexpensive program (compaired to others) you get what you pay for. But if I were you I would not shell out the cash just for Flash MX, get Studio MX Plus. Its a bit more, but it is worth it in my mind for Fireworks and Dreamweaver and now Plus comes with Cold Fusion and the devNET templets.

I do however want toonz now, it looks like fun, but I dont have the 4000 a year to pay for it.
Click to expand...

Toonz is great, no denying that...but my licence for that is due to expire in about a week and a half....which is why im thinking of moving to CTP to test it out ;)
 

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