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About "Princesses"

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
This post is more a less a reflection on the consistent and thorough rejection of all things “Princess” related regarding Disney Parks and Disney broadly speaking. It is largely justified, but I thought it would make for a good discussion as to why.

For me the objection isn’t so much that Disney wants to create new experiences based on movies like The Little Mermaid and Beauty and the Beast, it’s that sometimes they’re designed to just support a product line that frankly has little to do with those movies, but instead supporting a highly gendered and poorly designed (from a visual standpoint) message that looks more like a knock-off brand’s imitation of those works. The Princesses in the product line have little to do with their movie counterparts. They’re re-designed in appearance, homogenized in personality and altogether altered to resemble Barbie more than their respective characters (see Cinderella in Sofia the First as an example), and it works at appealing to girls under 10, but it does little to make their source material appealing to anyone outside that group, and that’s a terrible shame given the original movies’ own merits and intentions. When the constant message surrounding those movies is what you see now at your local Toys R Us or Wal-Mart, it creates a perception that anything relating to these movies is unacceptable for anyone outside the limited demographic it’s designed to best capture. That’s terribly disappointing for me as someone who knows what these movies are actually like and who was responsible for making them.

I can certainly understand objections to more “princess stuff”. It can be thematically disruptive, creatively unexciting and downright ugly looking if it’s designed only to appeal to girls 3-10. Bibbiddi Bobbidi Boutique is a perfect example of this, and so is Princess Fairytale Hall to a large extent. Both are experiences that have limited appeal and are shamelessly designed to promote the vapid and materialistic values that modern “princess” culture in general, is (rightly) trashed for and not really what makes the characters and their stories enjoyable.

However, I would like to think that Disney fans who know (or are more likely to know) what these movies are really like, would not automatically dismiss an experience as “girly” just because its tied to one of ten titles in the Disney catalogue. When I look at the BatB area of New Fantasyland, I don’t see it as “girly”, just a section of the park with a BatB theme (yes even for EtwB, which I’d criticize as more “childish”, than “girly”). That’s just my opinion, but it comes from someone familiar with the source material who can interpret it as more “gender neutral” based on that. Similarly, if I find elements of the LM ride disappointing it’s because of the staging or quality of the scenes, not because the whole concept is tied to Ariel.

Now this post isn’t intended to bash those who enjoy things related to the Princesses, nor is it meant to encourage more awkward implementation of these characters and stories in a park like Animal Kingdom. All I’m saying (for those who want the short, short version) is that park experiences should not be criticized merely for being “Princess” related, but more for how they take that source material and implement and respresent it in a given setting.
 

Nemo14

Well-Known Member
that’s a terrible shame given the original movies’ own merits and intentions.

When the constant message surrounding those movies is what you see now at your local Toys R Us or Wal-Mart, it creates a perception that anything relating to these movies is unacceptable for anyone outside the limited demographic it’s designed to best capture.


park experiences should not be criticized merely for being “Princess” related, but more for how they take that source material and implement and respresent it in a given setting.

Very well said! My kids grew up in the "Little Mermaid/ Beauty and the Beast" era, and both my son and daughter enjoyed the movies very much, as did my husband and I. They were well-told stories with magnificent artwork, unforgetable music, universal humor, and most importantly a clear message. When my daughter left for college out of state, one of the first things she packed was her copy of the Little Mermaid, not because she aspired to be a princess, but that she "got" it, and so did we. Each of the "princesses" has a "story", and it really saddens me to see them reduced to just another Barbie-type heroine.

*steps off soapbox*
 

LVgoN2WDW

Active Member
230E595405DA20DCBBDAB4047B361B2310AE4B5D.jpg

What bothers me most is how bad some of the more computer animated princesses look on merchandise :([/IMG]
 

Britt

Well-Known Member
I love MY Disney princesses....the ones I grew up with. I really hate the "brand" they've become though. Disneys constant need to shove the brand at us at every turn. Same as Toy Story, Cars (really the only 2 boy themed movies there). It's everywhere, constantly, whether it fits or not.

I totally agree with the other poster....some people "get it"...we grew up on these movies and its not that we want to BE the princess...we just get the story.

Sometimes, princesses just DON'T fit, and yet they're stuffed in there anyway.
 

TinkerBelle8878

Well-Known Member
I think, at least to me, its the mass marketing of the 'Princess' brand. If it was the individual characters within the greater fairy tale world, with all their supporting characters and not as Barbieized, I'd have no issue with it. I suppose in a way like Once Upon A Time. They all coexist and they all know one another but they have their own things going on.

They always, at least as long as I can remember, had some kind of Barbieish toys sold of this character or that but not to this extent. I remember some late 80s Skipper did double duty as a Tinkerbell for example. I remember seeing her in the old Contemporary Fantasia gift shop. And my sister had what I figure was the Mattel Little mermaid 'Barbie'. Maybe because it was more centralized to the parks and that was usually where you found most of the dolls instead of every store that sells toys that has them now.

Maybe they saw that they couldn't let an opportunity to make more money pass them by?

Tinkerbell doesn't seem to have caught on in quite the same way, at least from what I've noticed. And I kind of love that Daisy is now in all the new Minnie toy line because she's so rarely used in stuff that its not overdone. Just for some reason the whole Princess thing annoys me. I like the movies and the characters but in this context...bring on Alice. At least she had an imagination.
 

bdearl41

Well-Known Member
While I credit Disney with the brilliant idea of marketing to every under 10 year old girl, I think the ploy is detrimental to the overall Disney brand and story, and will have a lasting effect upon the young generation. Now Disney is considered "babyish" and "silly" by a great deal of people who will now not introduce the product of these great movies and stories to their new children, thus reducing a future generation of developing a sentimental attachment to WDW as I have from my younger days. I loved Peter Pan, Aladdin, and Jungle Book as a child, and go back due to the great memories as a child.

Lord knows, its not due to the rides being created currently, that I go back, but instead for pure sentimental reasons and decent food at the resorts. While the princess brand has made Disney a great deal of money in the present, I think it'll be detrimental in the future as the Disney is not capturing imagination anymore, but instead forcing an oppressive and sexist view of the "damsel in distress" role upon young girls, which simply just doesn't exemplify what women "role models" are currently.

Fortunately Disney provided us with the movie Brave. Here a strong young woman, rebelling against her being forced to marry and to be "saved" is the focal point, and can provide a good animated role model for young girls. Instead of waiting to be rescued, she takes matters into her own hands, and in the world we live in today, our young girls need this lesson much more than the "go to" be a good wife message the "princess" brand provides previous generations.

Now I may be being harsh, and yes Belle, Ariel, and Pocohantas (Mulan is not a princess) provide glimpses of this, showing some womanly independence, they still at the end of the day, are all trying to win the heart of the main male character (also see Rapunzel). Meridia in Brave does the exact opposite, and if we really want to empower women, and really touch everyone, with future Disney movies, this is a better model for future female characters to follow, as opposed to the old standard.
 

luv

Well-Known Member
I liked princesses a lot before we were princessed to death. I have no problem with the princesses or their movies.

But princesses are girly and do not appeal to many boys over the age of six. Some boys, sure. But there are a LOT of nine yo boys who would rather be punched than hang out waiting to meet a princess. I actually threaten my nephews with the princesses. If they don't stop being annoying, I will make them go meet a princess.

I like the new, girly part of the FLE (especially the UTS ride!) but I do see it as girly. This is an area that many eleven year old boys would endure rather than enjoy.
 

AndyS2992

Well-Known Member
I totally agree. However even though I know all about the origins of the Princess movies and don't see New Fantasyland as being 'girly' as such, I still would not step foot in Princess Fairytale Hall or ETwB as it does not appeal to me or my demographic of 20 year old males nor would it appeal to anyone else in my family.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I like the new, girly part of the FLE (especially the UTS ride!) but I do see it as girly. This is an area that many eleven year old boys would endure rather than enjoy.

I can see your point, but I would say this relates to my and bdearl41's point about the long-term damage of the princess brand. Perpetuate that "Princess" image and you'll alienate most anyone who isn't a young female, regardless of what the actual experience is, just becuase that movie is now linked to the brand.

I totally agree. However even though I know all about the origins of the Princess movies and don't see New Fantasyland as being 'girly' as such, I still would not step foot in Princess Fairytale Hall or ETwB as it does not appeal to me or my demographic of 20 year old males nor would it appeal to anyone else in my family.

And that's completely fine, in my original post I explain why those two "attractions" have limited appeal and that's a problem of its own.

Making toys for a limited demogrpahic works becuase of the high margin and volume you can sell. A theme park can't survive using the same design approach, so if Disney keeps building limited appeal attractions (and to give a "boys" example, Jack Sparrow) it may hurt them in the long run.
 

erasure fan1

Well-Known Member
While I credit Disney with the brilliant idea of marketing to every under 10 year old girl, I think the ploy is detrimental to the overall Disney brand and story, and will have a lasting effect upon the young generation. Now Disney is considered "babyish" and "silly" by a great deal of people who will now not introduce the product of these great movies and stories to their new children, thus reducing a future generation of developing a sentimental attachment to WDW as I have from my younger days.
Great point. That is about how it happened with my daughter. She loved the princesses, but now at 11 she thinks they are for little girls and really wants no part of them. I think that the same type of thing happened when Disney went crazy with all the generic direct to DVD movies. When you dumb down these things, all you do is tarnish the original in my opinion.
 

coleandrachel

Active Member
I totally agree. However even though I know all about the origins of the Princess movies and don't see New Fantasyland as being 'girly' as such, I still would not step foot in Princess Fairytale Hall or ETwB as it does not appeal to me or my demographic of 20 year old males nor would it appeal to anyone else in my family.

Wait til you have a little girl... lol :-)
 

SulleyanBoo

Well-Known Member
I personally like the demographic of The Disney Princesses but that is just my opinion. I totally get and agree with the fact of annoyance or dislike about The Disney Princesses being pushed in a light that they are not (such as baby princesses which never even happened in the movies, princess barbies, ect) But, I love most Disney Princess Merch at the parks and on The Disney Online store. I am very girly and very young at heart as well which might play a part in all of this. lol

But everyone has their own opinion and insight which is great! I think Disney does an excellent job of creating movies, story lines, characters merch ect that appeal to every style, age group, male and female.
 

KCheatle

Well-Known Member
When I went with only my daughter to WDW, I didn't mind the princess hype one bit. But, now that's she's getting older and I have my 2 yo son, I'm starting to realize how disproportionate the hype is between movies I would consider girl-oriented (princess movies) and movies I would consider boy-oriented (Toy Story and Cars). Yes, there's some things for "boys", and they've tried to even it out with the implementation of the Pirates League, but the New Fantasyland's focus on three princess movies and a princess meet and greet is somehwat disappointing to me now that my "princess" is growing out of that phase and my son is left with no comparable experience. I hope they do follow through on the Cars Land because that would help to even it out a bit. I know Disney is in a for-profit mindset and the princesses make $$, but it just seems grossly disproportionate.
 

Nemo14

Well-Known Member
Well, I think my objection to the "Disney Princess" line is the homogenization of the characters and what they are really about. Ariel does not equal Belle, Cinderella does not equal Snow White, etc, but the commercialization of them all has taken away their character, and left them as a bunch of bimbos who differ only in physical appearance.
 

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