DHS Disney Confirms Muppets Take Over Rock 'n' Roller Coaster at Hollywood Studios

[IMDREW]

Same. Paris shows how aesthetically/emotionally compelling a park can be when all the design principles are applied right practically everywhere. It's pretty much the standard by which all other theme park design can be judged.

All the more insane they let every single one of those principles fall in their second gate.

 

[neo999955]

I haven't been to a non-US Disney park yet, but how much re-theming did they do for Avengers Flight Force? I recognize this is still RnRC, so it won't be as expensive - but did they replace flats with just Marvel flats? Did they add anything more exciting to the ride itself or afterwards?

I would be pretty disappointed if there weren't some Muppets zaniness in the new version, even if it's some gags painted on wood.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

how much re-theming did they do for Avengers Flight Force?

Quite a bit. I honestly don’t remember that much but I remember being annoyed they didn’t show the pre-show, but being impressed with everything else haha.

But you have to remember… it’s not called Rock n Rollercoaster starring the Avengers. This is still rock n rollercoaster. Just minus Aerosmith and + muppets.

 

[Mr. Sullivan]

Can’t believe we did almost 4 pages of arguing about a car that most of us don’t even look at anymore when we walk to the ride

 

[HMF]

As I said, the potential for increased visual intrusion is about the car's new color scheme drawing the attention of guests who are walking towards Tower of Terror, thus damaging Tower of Terror's carefully-crafted approach experience (its "scene 1"). Hopefully this will not be the case, since the car is still set back, the archway is still the same, etc. That’s why I was asking what people who’ve seen it in person think about this aspect.

As for the emotional impact, etc., there is a lot of research and analysis indicating that an important part of Disney’s success has come from the emotional impact of there being fewer visual contradictions than in the outside world. This has been termed “the architecture of reassurance.” One does not have to be consciously aware of / introspective about this—indeed, almost nobody is. There’s a great deal of writing on this topic, from empirical studies on the emotional impacts of cohesive environments, to writing by people within Disney (e.g., Designing Disney by John Hench).

To be fair placing RNRC next to Tower was always a stupid move in my opinion the clashing themes aside, It was basically an invitation the more thrill ride -oriented guests to simply walk between the two not encouraging them to go deeper into the park, plus causing potential bottlenecks on busy days.

 

[HMF]

I'm not concerned with how it "clashes" with Tower of Terror because RnRc always has done that a little bit, but I do think that the arch, car, guitar, and overall plaza looked very "classic Hollywood" in a way that fit the park. I think the Muppet aesthetic changes to the exterior should be understated. If it just means new colors on the guitar and car, then it isn't a big deal I guess.

As I have said RNRC's giant guitar facade is the last remnant of Imagineering's "oversized object" phase of the late 90s and early 00s, most of which have been removed over the years famously to the delight of many of us on this board.

 

[HMF]

In my opinion, Paris has the best castle park in the world in terms of design. It’s just so gorgeous and thoughtfully designed!

and also, the world's worst second park though the others are quickly catching up.

 

[Tom Morrow]

One certainly should not walk around theme parks overthinking the transitions, etc. (unless you’re specifically there to study the design). When visiting, one just feels the consequences of all those careful design choices—the deep cohesion that makes it so pleasant.

But if one is interested in theme park design—like me and many others on these forums—these seemingly small design choices are extremely important. Collectively, they’re central to why the parks are so compelling, which means, conversely, that if there’s an increasing number of subpar design choices, the parks start to become significantly weaker over time (“declining by degrees” per Kevin Yee).

It’s perfectly reasonable for someone not to be interested in this subject, of course.

This. For a lot of us, seeing how well they achieve thematic immersion is part of the enjoyment. I understand that not everyone cares about it that deeply, but the parks once had that extra layer for those who wanted it.

Many of us have been visiting the Disney parks for long enough to have also seen them when they still painstakingly adhered to their original design philosophies regarding theming and immersion, with those things being one of the reasons we loved Disney's parks in the first place. To see them go from being meticulous about it to making it an afterthought is upsetting and that's why were vocal about it.

Just to clarify, I'm not against Muppet Rock 'n' Roller Coaster at all and I think it's one of the few quick changeouts they could do that wouldn't involve a lot of arguments over who the band should be. It's also better than turning into another Marvel thing or something and you know they thought about doing that.

This is the color of ROCK!!!

But this is a pop song!

 

[Tom Morrow]

I just saw a comment on Facebook about this that highlights what I'm saying when I say I would like them to not go overboard with Muppets thematic touches. I'm not arguing about the new paint scheme. Someone said they should put Muppet characters in the upside down car. No! That is too far.

 

[sedati]

Bio was nice enough to give us some context. I'd says that having the attraction so oddly tucked into a corner, some pop vibrancy is needed to draw attention that way especially as foliage was grown in over time. Honestly I find the Fantastic billboard more thematically out of place (at least when it was the digital one)

 

[eddie104]

Can’t believe we did almost 4 pages of arguing about a car that most of us don’t even look at anymore when we walk to the ride

I made a point in another thread that being pessimistic all the time doesn’t lead to actually enjoying anything Disney does anymore.

It’s always nit picking minuscule details like the car paint apart. Granted the poster could’ve just said the paint job might look obnoxious versus the old one. That’s straight to the point instead inserting nonsensical details about theme park design into the discussion.

Also while Paris is an absolutely gorgeous park what does it have to do with the former RNRC at Hollywood Studios?

Like seriously we’re comparing a nondescript coaster to an entire…never mind.

 

[Marc Davis Fan]

I made a point in another thread that being pessimistic all the time doesn’t lead to actually enjoying anything Disney does anymore.

I think that’s right. We should be positive when there are grounds for being positive, and critical when there are grounds for being critical. In this case, as I’ve said, I’m cautiously optimistic.

…the poster could’ve just said the paint job might look obnoxious versus the old one. That’s straight to the point instead inserting nonsensical details about theme park design into the discussion.

Many of us are interested in theme park design, and that’s part of why we’re on the forums!

Also while Paris is an absolutely gorgeous park what does it have to do with the former RNRC at Hollywood Studios?

Like seriously we’re comparing a nondescript coaster to an entire…never mind.

I don’t think anyone was comparing Disneyland Paris to RnRC.

 

[Marc Davis Fan]

View attachment 911860
Bio was nice enough to give us some context. I'd says that having the attraction so oddly tucked into a corner, some pop vibrancy is needed to draw attention that way especially as foliage was grown in over time. Honestly I find the Fantastic billboard more thematically out of place (at least when it was the digital one)

I agree that the digital Fantasmic billboard was a significant visual intrusion. The physical one was designed to reduce the intrusion and be in the appropriate visual style.

That bio image shows the design thoughtfulness of RnRC’s original team. The archway is set back enough that it’s only visible in your periphery while walking towards Tower of Terror. The red line marks approximately when it’s in view:

…and then the color scheme was selected to blend in while viewed with your peripheral vision. And then when you walk back out from Tower of Terror, your attention is drawn towards it.

I remain (cautiously) optimistic that, because most of the color scheme is staying the same (that of the archway and guitar bridge), the car's color will not create enough peripheral visual noise to reduce Tower of Terror’s famous/celebrated approach experience (assuming they don’t add crazy stuff like characters in the car or a gigantic “Muppets” sign). But that’s the open question, and we'll only know for sure when we can see it all in person.

As an aside, I don’t think RnRC ever suffered from a lack of attention due to being too hidden (while CTX, in contrast, did seem to have that problem), so it didn’t need additional “pop” to stand out. But even if it did, that could certainly be accomplished with visually cohesive elements.

 

[Incomudro]

Can’t believe we did almost 4 pages of arguing about a car that most of us don’t even look at anymore when we walk to the ride

Where did you get the "most of us" statistic?

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

It’s always nit picking minuscule details like the car paint apart.

Some of us are fans of John Hench.

 

[eddie104]

I think that’s right. We should be positive when there are grounds for being positive, and critical when there are grounds for being critical. In this case, as I’ve said, I’m cautiously optimistic.


Many of us are interested in theme park design, and that’s part of why we’re on the forums!


I don’t think anyone was comparing Disneyland Paris to RnRC.

Paris was literally mentioned a page ago in relation to this upcoming attraction.

Yes many love Disney theme park philosophy when it comes to design but this coaster is not exactly the biggest example of that.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Paris was literally mentioned a page ago in relation to this upcoming attraction.

2 discussions about Paris happened.

1 about the incredible design and framing throughout the castle park. How it’s good to slow down and take in all the little details of transitions happen in that park.

2. Comparing the Avengers retheme of rock n roller coaster. That was a total retheme - not replacing Aerosmith for Avengers.

 

[Marc Davis Fan]

Paris was literally mentioned a page ago in relation to this upcoming attraction.

The park of Disneyland Paris was not compared to Rock n' Roller Coaster. (Edit: Thanks, @TrainsOfDisney, for taking the time to explain how Paris was actually referenced in their post above. In short, I mentioned that one isn’t expected to pay conscious attention to transitions, and @TrainsOfDisney replied that Paris’s are so impressive that they actually do pay attention to them when they visit there. This is hardly "comparing a nondescript roller coaster to an entire [theme park].")

Yes many love Disney theme park philosophy when it comes to design but this coaster is not exactly the biggest example of that.

The Sunset Boulevard area and Tower of Terror approach experience that we've been discussing are examples of great theme park design (in fact, some of the most highly regarded in the field). The meticulous efforts that the original RnRC team made to integrate its entrance without negatively affecting that area/approach is an example of theme park design principles at work. The impact of the current changes on all that is a highly-relevant discussion of theme park design...

I agree that RnRC as a whole is not an example of great theme park design!

 

[eddie104]

2 discussions about Paris happened.

1 about the incredible design and framing throughout the castle park. How it’s good to slow down and take in all the little details of transitions happen in that park.

2. Comparing the Avengers retheme of rock n roller coaster. That was a total retheme - not replacing Aerosmith for Avengers.

Why are we acting like that whole conversation wasn’t connected to the original discussion of RNRC?

Yes that was separate tangent but ultimately it was still pertaining to how Disney was gonna approach the Muppets transition.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Yes that was separate tangent but ultimately it was still pertaining to how Disney was gonna approach the Muppets transition.

Yes, it was an example of excellent transitions in a Disney theme park.