MK Cars-Themed Attractions at Magic Kingdom

[eddie104]

@lentesta If you don’t mind me asking but are the plans for Piston Peak set in stone as of now ?

With all the changes with other upcoming lands(Monstropolis, Villains) I wonder if D’Amaro is reviewing the current project as is and wanting WDI to go back to the drawing board.

 

[Dranth]

When the underwhelming “Cars” ride opens in 3 years, I suspect many will be changing their tone on clones. It will be the TBA complaints all over again, except this time people will be able to compare it to an actual living example of the IP done right.

The new cars could be the biggest pile of trash that any entertainment company has ever produced and it still wouldn't change my mind on clones.

 

[lentesta]

@lentesta If you don’t mind me asking but are the plans for Piston Peak set in stone as of now ?

With all the changes with other upcoming lands(Monstropolis, Villains) I wonder if D’Amaro is reviewing the current project as is and wanting WDI to go back to the drawing board.

To the best of my knowledge, anything with concrete is moving forward more or less as we know it. We're all pretty sure there's a second ride in Piston Peak but those details are still unknown. (I said it's a 3x spinner based on a recent patent application from WDI folks who worked on Radiator Springs, but that's a guess.)

I believe the things we're talking about as being in a re-think phase (Villains Land, DCA's Pandora) are in the bidding phase or earlier. Villains has SFWMD permits, and I was told "it's a water permit not a marriage license."

With enough time and money you can change any project whenever you want. A pause before the end of bidding, and before the board of directors approves funding, I suppose, because you don't know a project's costs until bidding is in, is likely one of the last times you can change things without huge jumps in costs and delivery dates.

 

[eddie104]

To the best of my knowledge, anything with concrete is moving forward more or less as we know it. We're all pretty sure there's a second ride in Piston Peak but those details are still unknown. (I said it's a 3x spinner based on a recent patent application from WDI folks who worked on Radiator Springs, but that's a guess.)

I believe the things we're talking about as being in a re-think phase (Villains Land, DCA's Pandora) are in the bidding phase or earlier. Villains has SFWMD permits, and I was told "it's a water permit not a marriage license."

With enough time and money you can change any project whenever you want. A pause before the end of bidding, and before the board of directors approves funding, I suppose, because you don't know a project's costs until bidding is in, is likely one of the last times you can change things without huge jumps in costs and delivery dates.

Thank you for responding.

Personally I’m happy with the Piston Peak plans we have seen so far.

 

[lentesta]

Thank you for responding.

Personally I’m happy with the Piston Peak plans we have seen so far.

You're welcome.

I'll take an opportunity to point out the implicit thing in your question - because it's come up in emails and such - is that the IP and plans we're talking about for this Villains re-do are some of what's being discussed.

I think Drew's article noted there's an upcoming meeting to review alternatives. I'm sure I don't know all of them. The stuff we've talked about is one previous set of choices and one current set of choices, at this specific point in time.

 

[lazyboy97o]

To the best of my knowledge, anything with concrete is moving forward more or less as we know it. We're all pretty sure there's a second ride in Piston Peak but those details are still unknown. (I said it's a 3x spinner based on a recent patent application from WDI folks who worked on Radiator Springs, but that's a guess.)

I believe the things we're talking about as being in a re-think phase (Villains Land, DCA's Pandora) are in the bidding phase or earlier. Villains has SFWMD permits, and I was told "it's a water permit not a marriage license."

With enough time and money you can change any project whenever you want. A pause before the end of bidding, and before the board of directors approves funding, I suppose, because you don't know a project's costs until bidding is in, is likely one of the last times you can change things without huge jumps in costs and delivery dates.

Funding is approved after the Feasibility phase in which the completed Concept Design’s costs are estimated and reviewed. This is when things like Lightning Lane revenue and visitation impacts should all be reviewed and accepted. After the project is approved Disney then hires the architect and engineers of record so that it can move forward into Schematic Design, Design Development and finally Construction Documentation.

Disney doesn’t use traditional design-bid-build on these types of major attractions. They utilize integrated project delivery (IPD) which involves hiring the architect, engineers and contractor all at once and having them work together. The RFQ for Villains Land even listed it as a design-build project which is technically different in typically involving hiring only one legal entity, but still involves hiring the architect and contractor at the same time to completely deliver the project. The contractor is on board to provide early feedback on construct ability as well as pricing information as the design becomes more developed. They will also often use aspects of fast-track project delivery where construction begins before design is complete.

 

[Raineman]

We already have Radiator Springs, just go to DCA and visit it.

I for one am extremely happy they arent just building a clone again. Let the parks become more unique!

100% Agree, Why do we want a clone when they are trying to make something new???

Just curious how both of you feel about Indy replacing Dino in AK, because that is an instance where WDW is getting a clone, that is replacing a unique-to-WDW attraction.

 

[Movielover]

Just curious how both of you feel about Indy replacing Dino in AK, because that is an instance where WDW is getting a clone, that is replacing a unique-to-WDW attraction.

To be fair just going off the concept art alone I don't think our Indy will be a exact replica of whats in Disneyland. I'm sure there will be similarities obviously but I don't think we are getting Mara and the "don't look into the eyes of the statue" plot. Plus there will be no mummy room unless they add that part of the track back into the structure.

 

[lentesta]

Funding is approved after the Feasibility phase in which the completed Concept Design’s costs are estimated and reviewed. This is when things like Lightning Lane revenue and visitation impacts should all be reviewed and accepted. After the project is approved Disney then hires the architect and engineers of record so that it can move forward into Schematic Design, Design Development and finally Construction Documentation.

Disney doesn’t use traditional design-bid-build on these types of major attractions. They utilize integrated project delivery (IPD) which involves hiring the architect, engineers and contractor all at once and having them work together. The RFQ for Villains Land even listed it as a design-build project which is technically different in typically involving hiring only one legal entity, but still involves hiring the architect and contractor at the same time to completely deliver the project. The contractor is on board to provide early feedback on construct ability as well as pricing information as the design becomes more developed. They will also often use aspects of fast-track project delivery where construction begins before design is complete.

That is very useful and impressive information, @lazyboy97o.

Off the top of your head, what ballpark-estimate level of cost change would require running something up the flagpole again?

 

[Raineman]

To be fair just going off the concept art alone I don't think our Indy will be a exact replica of whats in Disneyland. I'm sure there will be similarities obviously but I don't think we are getting Mara and the "don't look into the eyes of the statue" plot. Plus there will be no mummy room unless they add that part of the track back into the structure.

I guess we'll have to wait and see, but the fact that the ride systems are the same, and have almost identical track layouts, leads me to think that there may not be many significant differences, but, time will tell.

 

[Movielover]

I guess we'll have to wait and see, but the fact that the ride systems are the same, and have the identical track layout, leads me to think that there may not be many significant differences, but, time will tell.

They in fact do not have identical track layouts. They are 90% the same but Dinosaur lacked the mummy room segment plus a few other minor adjustments in the track profile which is why I said they won't be a exact replica. Also just due to the age of the original attraction I suspect WDW's will have more in relation to Tokyo's version such as lacking the 3 door chamber at the start of the ride.

 

[eddie104]

Funding is approved after the Feasibility phase in which the completed Concept Design’s costs are estimated and reviewed. This is when things like Lightning Lane revenue and visitation impacts should all be reviewed and accepted. After the project is approved Disney then hires the architect and engineers of record so that it can move forward into Schematic Design, Design Development and finally Construction Documentation.

Disney doesn’t use traditional design-bid-build on these types of major attractions. They utilize integrated project delivery (IPD) which involves hiring the architect, engineers and contractor all at once and having them work together. The RFQ for Villains Land even listed it as a design-build project which is technically different in typically involving hiring only one legal entity, but still involves hiring the architect and contractor at the same time to completely deliver the project. The contractor is on board to provide early feedback on construct ability as well as pricing information as the design becomes more developed. They will also often use aspects of fast-track project delivery where construction begins before design is complete.

Always appreciate your vast knowledge on the processes used by Disney for project delivery.

You're welcome.

I'll take an opportunity to point out the implicit thing in your question - because it's come up in emails and such - is that the IP and plans we're talking about for this Villains re-do are some of what's being discussed.

I think Drew's article noted there's an upcoming meeting to review alternatives. I'm sure I don't know all of them. The stuff we've talked about is one previous set of choices and one current set of choices, at this specific point in time.

I feel like Maleficent and Hades are pretty much guaranteed as why would they have her castle as the centerpiece of this brand new land?

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

Just curious how both of you feel about Indy replacing Dino in AK, because that is an instance where WDW is getting a clone, that is replacing a unique-to-WDW attraction.

It is not a clone though, its a similar enough ride with an IP that is the same but the actual theming/animatronics/everything else important is new. I will say though that I did actually like Dinosaur and it was one of the closed rides that I would have liked to see updated instead of replaced, however I'm super into IJ sooo.

 

[Disstevefan1]

We already have Radiator Springs, just go to DCA and visit it.

I for one am extremely happy they arent just building a clone again. Let the parks become more unique!

Piston peak will be a unique “necessary downgrade” compared to Radiator Springs.

 

[Centauri Space Station]

The new cars could be the biggest pile of trash that any entertainment company has ever produced and it still wouldn't change my mind on clones.

Theres zero chance it will be worse than Cars road trip

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Theres zero chance it will be worse than Cars road trip

Speak for yourself! Catastrophe Canyon is everything!!!!!!

 

[Centauri Space Station]

Speak for yourself! Catastrophe Canyon is everything!!!!!!

It’s a cheap half baked cars version of a truck that’s burned alive

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

It’s a cheap half baked cars version of a truck that’s burned alive

A bit more horrific then I remember it!

 

[FigmentFan82]

Speak for yourself! Catastrophe Canyon is everything!!!!!!

I was lucky enough to visit DLP last year, and while I too have fond memories of Catastrophe Canyon and many of the old studio stuff from the original version of DHS, Cars Road trip, aside from the catastrophe part, is pretty meh. But again, it was great to experience that big finale section again.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Cars Road trip, aside from the catastrophe part, is pretty meh.

Oh I know - “pretty meh” indeed. I just love the canyon so much - I loved it as a kid and still think it’s the best version of an “earthquake / disaster” type attraction the theme parks ever did.

I’m sad that era seems to be over…. I love physical effects.