MK Piston Peak and Villains Land Construction Thread

[Imagineer6]

I'm on the fence about whether these two rides, by themselves, are enough for those parents with small children. So we could see a break from "new lands are two rides, a restaurant, and gift shops."

Would a small offering similar to Storybook Circus around the train station in Villains Land be completely redundant? If you can squeeze in a flat ride, a barnstormer, and meet and greet, now you have a micro kids land inside the expansion. Or, perhaps a Na'vi River Journey style boat ride that is outdoors like Storybook Land Canal Boats.

 

[monothingie]

Good question.

I think the coaster is still in the mix. And I think the thing that looks like a train station is a train station.

I suspect - and I could be wrong here - that a lot of the new direction is like this:

- Previous concept had a coaster. New direction is to "plus it". So it's still a coaster.
- Previous concept had an indoor ride. New direction is to think bigger/better. So (and I'm spitballing here) perhaps WDI was thinking "Runaway Railway" and management is more like "Rise of the Resistance".
- Same thing for dining and entertainment.

I'm approaching this from two angles:

- What's gonna sell Lightning Lane Multi Pass and Single Pass?
- How are we making this friendly to parents with small children?

So given the above, the coaster concept probably ends up as a Tier 1 LLMP. (Depending on the ride opening cadence, it might be LLSP to start. But I get the sense that it's not the long-term LLSP.)

The indoor ride, if it's going to be re-imagined as "bigger/better" would be the LLSP.

I'm on the fence about whether these two rides, by themselves, are enough for those parents with small children. So we could see a break from "new lands are two rides, a restaurant, and gift shops."

 

[ctrlaltdel]

Good question.

I think the coaster is still in the mix. And I think the thing that looks like a train station is a train station.

I suspect - and I could be wrong here - that a lot of the new direction is like this:

- Previous concept had a coaster. New direction is to "plus it". So it's still a coaster.
- Previous concept had an indoor ride. New direction is to think bigger/better. So (and I'm spitballing here) perhaps WDI was thinking "Runaway Railway" and management is more like "Rise of the Resistance".
- Same thing for dining and entertainment.

I'm approaching this from two angles:

- What's gonna sell Lightning Lane Multi Pass and Single Pass?
- How are we making this friendly to parents with small children?

So given the above, the coaster concept probably ends up as a Tier 1 LLMP. (Depending on the ride opening cadence, it might be LLSP to start. But I get the sense that it's not the long-term LLSP.)

The indoor ride, if it's going to be re-imagined as "bigger/better" would be the LLSP.

I'm on the fence about whether these two rides, by themselves, are enough for those parents with small children. So we could see a break from "new lands are two rides, a restaurant, and gift shops."

That would be great. I am assuming WDI probably already had some "plus-up" ideas for both that got trimmed down in the actual proposal phase. 1-2 flat rides would be nice as well. Though less necessary in MK than in other WDW parks, it would set a nice precedent to add some more family-friendly capacity to these massive expansions.

 

[Coaster Lover]

Would a small offering similar to Storybook Circus around the train station in Villains Land be completely redundant? If you can squeeze in a flat ride, a barnstormer, and meet and greet, now you have a micro kids land inside the expansion. Or, perhaps a Na'vi River Journey style boat ride that is outdoors like Storybook Land Canal Boats.

Would love a completely indoor kids' area like Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea, but I don't think that's in the cards here...

 

[BigRed98]

Would love a completely indoor kids' area like Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea, but I don't think that's in the cards here...

It’s way too big of an area to fully enclose it but I would love an indoor section like Knockturn Alley but on a much grander stage.

 

[bmr1591]

I have no insider info, but NBC feels aesthetically disjointed from all other properties. I don't see them using it, even if it is popular.

 

[lentesta]

Would a small offering similar to Storybook Circus around the train station in Villains Land be completely redundant? If you can squeeze in a flat ride, a barnstormer, and meet and greet, now you have a micro kids land inside the expansion. Or, perhaps a Na'vi River Journey style boat ride that is outdoors like Storybook Land Canal Boats.

I'll be surprised if we don't get some sort of dedicated meet-and-greet area.

Remember that outdoor rides get shut down during thunderstorms. And those happen more often in Florida than California. Presumably the coaster is already outdoors. So they may not want 2 outdoor rides that get shut down for rain. Not only does it affect park ops, but if those are Lightning Lane attractions, those reservations turn into good-anywhere passes, which make things difficult throughout the rest of the park. (I'm reasonably confident there's a "What did we learn from Epic Universe?" convo at WDI.)

 

[monothingie]

I sure hope they're not "Rise of Skywalkering" this and doing this without a plan.

Seems like this could turn into a hot mess very fast if they don't get their stuff together...or par for the course with WDI.

 

[lazyboy97o]

It’s way too big of an area to fully enclose it but I would love an indoor section like Knockturn Alley but on a much grander stage.

They’re currently designing an entire indoor park…

 

[trainplane3]

I’m hearing the initial plans for Villains Land have been scrapped. Imagineers have been told to think of bigger, bolder ideas. Budget secondary.

Not sure if this is “new players, new game” re: Josh as CEO.

This lines up with what I heard about Josh. He took over and something got sent out. He seems to be bringing some kind of energy to the parks hasn't been seen in a while. He came in with plans for the parks, some of them could be considered epic. If what he wants gets done, who knows (we all know what happens when $ is brought in). But it has Josh directly pushing it so there's a chance.

These next few years could be very exciting and I'm just talking about Florida.

Meanwhile I'm sitting here just saying "Please get SSE all shined up and let WDI call Tony back and run wild with no limits for Imagination".

 

[Coaster Lover]

I have no insider info, but NBC feels aesthetically disjointed from all other properties.

Agreed. I feel like the villlians used will be a (relatively) narrow collection of villians centered more or less exclusively on the Disney animated villlians from Snow White up until the Disney Renisance (no Star Wars, no Pixar (sorry Syndrome, Sid, and Ernesto), no NBC, no Fox Villians (sorry Mr. Burns), nothing from TV or spin offs (nothing from Decendants or Hocus Pocus). Gothel may be the one exception... (IMHO)

 

[DisneyDean97]

Good question.

I think the coaster is still in the mix. And I think the thing that looks like a train station is a train station.

I suspect - and I could be wrong here - that a lot of the new direction is like this:

- Previous concept had a coaster. New direction is to "plus it". So it's still a coaster.
- Previous concept had an indoor ride. New direction is to think bigger/better. So (and I'm spitballing here) perhaps WDI was thinking "Runaway Railway" and management is more like "Rise of the Resistance".
- Same thing for dining and entertainment.

I'm approaching this from two angles:

- What's gonna sell Lightning Lane Multi Pass and Single Pass?
- How are we making this friendly to parents with small children?

So given the above, the coaster concept probably ends up as a Tier 1 LLMP. (Depending on the ride opening cadence, it might be LLSP to start. But I get the sense that it's not the long-term LLSP.)

The indoor ride, if it's going to be re-imagined as "bigger/better" would be the LLSP.

I'm on the fence about whether these two rides, by themselves, are enough for those parents with small children. So we could see a break from "new lands are two rides, a restaurant, and gift shops."

Hopefully the "plussing" is, "no replace that screen with full figure AAs"... lol at least one could hope!

 

[Tha Realest]

A

I have no insider info, but NBC feels aesthetically disjointed from all other properties. I don't see them using it, even if it is popular.

that hasn’t stopped them from the Encanto x Indiana Jones mashup

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

I think this "scrapping" bodes well for the Land. I still think that Villains Land as a concept is a shaky premise—it should be a "dark" section of Fantasyland, not a standalone area. My hope is that whoever pushed for this change is prioritizing cohesiveness and wow-factor. Give me something like that Fire Mountain plan that had the coaster transform from sit-down to inverted. Make a Rise of the Resistance level attraction that makes sense story-wise and isn't just throwing random villains at us. Add a couple of immersive kid-friendly attractions, hopefully indoors.

They just need to keep that budget number high.

 

[britain]

Josh is gonna be all “I know how to turbocharge these parks and make them awesome” for the next 3-5 years. Then some financial crisis is gonna make him tighten up. So enjoy it while it lasts.

 

[BrianLo]

Josh is gonna be all “I know how to turbocharge these parks and make them awesome” for the next 3-5 years. Then some financial crisis is gonna make him tighten up. So enjoy it while it lasts.

His other positive attribute is coming off hopefully the worst travel related recession we’ll see in our lifetimes and having come off with the lesson they should have been spending during it.

 

[DrStarlander]

1-2 flat rides would be nice as well.

And not all flat rides need to be out there in the open, exposing their off-the-shelf familiarity to all walkers-by. Europa Park offers numerous examples where flat rides are concealed inside buildings behind themed facades, preserving the overall quality of the lands' immersiveness, while offering tons of things to do. And some great moments of discovery.

Would love a completely indoor kids' area like Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea

Again, Europa Park also offers some inspiration here, as the Minimoys Kingdom combines an indoor/outdoor dark-ride coaster with an enchanting indoor realm with flat rides. All in a tight 100,000 sq. ft. or so.

I still think that Villains Land as a concept is a shaky premise—it should be a "dark" section of Fantasyland

Yes, an off-shoot of Fantasyland would contextualize the bigger-picture tension so much better than getting to VL by way of Liberty Square, Cars/Piston Peak, and the Old West (and improve overall guest flow/flexibility). It's possible -- at a cost -- to connect FL to VL but I doubt it would happen unless they also wanted to create a new cast entry center (atrium cafe, offices, whatever) that a tunnel could traverse atop of. Sometimes killing two birds with one stone (or better, feeding two birds with one scone) makes unexpected things possible, financially.

 

[monothingie]

So what are we looking at now? 2035 opening?

 

[lentesta]

So what are we looking at now? 2035 opening?

I haven't heard from anyone on the project. I've heard that the re-do of New Fantasyland back in the day, added 12 months to the rollout. So ballpark-y, maybe that?

 

[monothingie]

I haven't heard from anyone on the project. I've heard that the re-do of New Fantasyland back in the day, added 12 months to the rollout. So ballpark-y, maybe that?

It makes me wonder.

1. Can WDI do this? No seriously, most of the recent product from WDI has been mid at best (and that's a stretch). Is there any talent left there to "plus" this...and it must have been bad with the original plan.

2. Revenge of the Bean Counters. Don't think for a second that budgets won't be trimmed.

3. A lot can happen in the next 5-9 years with TWDC. In 5 years TWDC is going on their 3rd CEO. Will Josh last? Will other corporate factors have an unforeseen impact?

4. They're basically ceding a second (third?) development cycle to USO. By this time they'll have phase 2 of EU done, will that make whatever is being done here irrelevant?