Debunking "evil Disney" accusations

[Californian Elitist]

The Princess and the Frog is my family's favorite Disney movie.

But I do feel bad for Tiana that she had to be a frog for most of the movie.

I have a fantasy that Tiana gets to have a feature-length sequel movie...and this time they have her in a version of Princess and the Pea. That is a very basic story that Disney can take a lot of liberties with.

I picture Tiana going to visit wherever Naveen was from and getting a taste of palace life, and that's where the
"Princess and the Pea" story unfolds. I think Disney could have a lot of fun with Tiana in 1920s Europe and it would be a chance for her to be human through the whole movie.

I love the movie too but I'm upset she had to be a frog for the entire movie. If it had to be that way, they should have just come up with an original story.

I highly doubt she'll be getting a sequel, especially with all the attention Rapunzel is getting. I've accepted it.

 

[Avenger117]

Here's a video. It's in the beginning and the offenses continue through 3:08.


Yeah, the more I think about The Princess and the Frog, the more angry I get. Oh of course it's appropriate to make the villain black. I can let that pass, since I love Keith David and I even met him once.

I never saw Tiana at MK but she puts on a great show at DL. She evens sings and everything. The girl they got to play her sounds just like Anika Noni Rose, too.

That is actually pretty bad. wow, I guess its safe to say they won't be airing that on Disney channel anytime soon.

and yeah the girl that plays Tiana at MK is great. Shes a great singer and really pretty.

 

[Californian Elitist]

That is actually pretty bad. wow, I guess its safe to say they won't be airing that on Disney channel anytime soon.

and yeah the girl that plays Tiana at MK is great. Shes a great singer and really pretty.

It's terrible. They actually edited Sunflower's (the name of the slave centaur) part out of the movie. Not to mention they rarely show actual Disney movies on the Disney Channel anyway.

At least they got the face character for Tiana right.

 

[MarkTwain]

They were intended to sound like Beatles-esque hipsters of that era. That's what they sound like to me. If I'm correct, they were some of the last characters that Uncle Walt actually had input in designing himself. I clearly remember reading on several occasions that his intent was to make them a riff on the Beatles.

At one point, they wanted the Beatles to come in and voice them, but the Beatles were unavailable or something. Let me see if I can dig up a cite for that.

EDIT: There were several, but I like this one because it includes a quote from Lennon.

The Beatles’ manager had worked out an agreement with Walt Disney for the group to perform in the film, but this dream was shot down when he approached the group with the idea. John Lennon reportedly shouted, “There’s no way the Beatles are going to sing for Mickey ****-ing Mouse!” Nevertheless, the four vultures are still modeled after the Fab Four, and the final product retains the Liverpool accent and mop-top haircuts as an homage to the group.

 

[MarkTwain]

That is actually pretty bad. wow, I guess its safe to say they won't be airing that on Disney channel anytime soon.

and yeah the girl that plays Tiana at MK is great. Shes a great singer and really pretty.

Don't forget that Fantasia is one of the oldest movies in the Disney canon, and is a product of the time it was made. Being released in 1940, it came out only a year after Gone With the Wind, which received huge critical claim while having characters in pretty much the exact same role. The movie preceded desegregation by some two and a half decades, as well as such "oldies" as Casablanca and Singin' in the Rain. You have to think about it in context.

 

[Can we go yet?]

At one point, they wanted the Beatles to come in and voice them, but the Beatles were unavailable or something. Let me see if I can dig up a site for that.

EDIT: There were several, but I like this one because it includes a quote from Lennon.

Ok, John what the heck man?! I would have LOVED to see the Beatles in the movie. What's so wrong with lending your voice to Disney? Oh well.

 

[Beholder]

Ok, John what the heck man?! I would have LOVED to see the Beatles in the movie. What's so wrong with lending your voice to Disney? Oh well.

Anything counter-culture will always be "anti-establishment". Mickey Mouse is a symbol of a "safe" America. Besides, I'm sure there was also a practical motive behind the decision. Seen partnering with Disney may have hurt their image, lowered their "cool factor" a couple notches.

 

[acollins876]

Off topic but...to SMW (just saw your avatar) - COYS! 5 days!

as a jew, i can tell you that when i first heard about the anti-semitic stuff i certainly researched it as much as i could. never came across anything that seemed to be evidence-based. from what i read, he had numerous jews on staff and many people on record who vehemently deny the allegations.

 

[unkadug]

^Exactly. People were always putting Walt under the microscope, ready to pitch a fit if he even sneezed wrong, yet nobody remembers all the offensive cartoons from other companies. There was a Looney Tune called Coal Black And The Sebben Dwarfs, which is incredibly offensive. I refuse to post a link to this, but you can YouTube search if you don't believe me. While referring to a black Snow White as "Coal Black" is bad enough, it really is no different than the whole "skin white as snow" thing in retrospect, or "What made the red man red?" from Peter Pan. But what's worse about this WB cartoon is how it portrays the African American population as being dumb & illiterate ("Sebben" dwarfs?) Made me cringe.
Yet many still believe Looney Tunes were all good fun, while Disney was the racist.

Kind of ironic that Looney Tunes was produced by a very influential Jewish family.

 

[draybook]

At one point, they wanted the Beatles to come in and voice them, but the Beatles were unavailable or something. Let me see if I can dig up a cite for that.

EDIT: There were several, but I like this one because it includes a quote from Lennon.

Ironic, since the Beatles were "legally" disbanded on WDW property, according to legend.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

Alright some more good discussion here. I can see the fuss about Fantasia's scene. Honestly, never have seen the full movie. Now, I have to ask, what is the big deal with the beginning of Princess and the Frog? Just watched the first 5 minutes of it again, I am assuming it is because the black mother is a maid to a rich person? We see Cinderella and Snow White both scrubbing floors on their hands and knees at different times in the movie.

I think if we look hard enough we can find something wrong with every Disney movie ever made. Old Yeller? Ask PETA what they think, they might not like it. For that matter, Bambi. But my question is why do we fret over it all the time?

I don't know if people remember the Cosby Show when it first came out. For the first time this was a black family on television that wasn't like Sanford or the Jeffersons or Good Times (by the way very funny shows). It was a middle class black family where the father was a doctor. Almost like Leave it To Beaver in a way. Yet, there were people who didn't "buy" that a black family could be this way despite the fact it was a very good show with Bill Cosby, a very funny man.

I think we fall into a trap in our society. There is one group that will complain that certain groups of people aren't being represented but when they are they still are under attack because they are "acting" and "talking" like groups they are representing. I guess I never really follow that to a tee. It just doesn't cross my mind when I watch a movie. And I think the question we should ask is are we better doing it that way and just enjoying a movie for what it is?

 

[Bob Saget]

I still haven't gotten over how Disney negatively portrayed some of my favorite appliances in The Brave Little Toaster.

 

[Magenta Panther]

I have always believed that the moment Tiana got turned into a frog, PatF stopped dead in its tracks and never recovered. For one thing - frogs aren't cute. Secondly, she didn't LEARN anything from being turned into a frog. The whole setup was worse than Brother Bear. It just sucked. She was really a great character - I LOVE her song "Almost There" (although it ends way too soon - when she came up to the piano player in the end, I think that's when she really should have belted it out, given it a great rousing finish, instead of it petering out the way it did) - and I really cared about her ambitions and was rooting for her, but then the frog thing happens, and most of her charm is lost. She came off as kind of a nag in the swamp, and what a pity. PatF can only be described as being one of those well-meaning failures, I guess...

 

[Tim_4]

OP

You forgot to address:

The profit motive is evil and Disney should be a communist utopia where everything is free and nothing is ever broken.

 

[luv]

Okay, I don't specifically remember much about the Jungle Book monkeys. I only know the Ooh Be Do and Bare Necessities parts. I don't know (or care) if they "sound black" to some people, however "sounding black" may be defined...which is subjective at best.

I do know that I LOVE the Ooh Be Do song. I don't know the title (I Wanna Be Like You?), but I love the song.

 

[FettFan]

That would be pretty cool. Marvel has some neat black characters, it would be nice to see a couple of them represented.

The Falcon will be in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, played by Anthony Mackie.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/07/16/anthony-mackie-cast-as-falcon-in-captain-america-2

 

[Avenger117]

The Falcon will be in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, played by Anthony Mackie.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/07/16/anthony-mackie-cast-as-falcon-in-captain-america-2

I did see that, I'm interested in how they are going to handle the character. The Winter Soldier story line was really good, so I have high hopes.

 

[worldfanatic]

Ironic, since the Beatles were "legally" disbanded on WDW property, according to legend.

Yep, papers were signed at the Polynesian Resort if I remember correctly.

 

[HihisIsKari..]

I understand wanting to be represented correctly and not offensively but it happens and I think as fully grown adults no person-- black or white-- should make a big deal...unless it's really something crazy. I thought we were all humans not "black people and white people". JUST PEOPLE.

If someone could explain to me why it's terrible that Tiana was a frog for most of the movie, maybe I can understand why it's a big deal. To me it's just another movie where a character was turned into an animal. If it were a white girl who was turned into a frog or any other animal for most of the movie, no one would care. And nobody should care...either way.

I looked up Fantasia and yeah that was pretty bad but I'm not sure if that's something to really get upset about. People are always going to poke fun at each other (and that's with anything and everything people can pick out not just skin color). And yes, I know what's it like to be made fun of.

I think people like to say these dumb things about Walt and the Disney Company because they're bored and need something to do with their lives. Once people stop over analyzing these insignificant little things (yes, including skin color), it will not be such a problem because we are removing the need to make it a big deal.

BTW I highly doubt a small child watching these movies will pick up on the dumb subliminal messages so I have no idea why people would be angry over that in the first place.

 

[Tim_4]

The Winter Soldier story line was really good, so I have high hopes.

I doubt they can do it justice. Bucky was hardly in CA:TFA so I don't think the non-comic-book-reading audience will be impacted by the story line.