Cameron has given the OK ...

Magenta Panther

Well-Known Member
Urgh I'm sorry but this movie was a fad which is over with and forgotten by now. There are so many other immersive DISNEY themes they could go with o_O [/rant]

Ah, but don't you get it? Disney themes can't compete with Wizarding World! That's why Iger went outside of the studio to find ideas for an E-ticket attraction. That, and because he's stupid. :p
 

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
Urgh I'm sorry but this movie was a fad which is over with and forgotten by now.

drevil.jpg
 

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
Speaking of which:
robo_micket_small.jpg


Yep, this is Iger's Disney, folks, always on the cutting edge...

Man I wish American Disney had anything to do with this.

Disney Japan greenlights a ton of robot toys between this Disney Voltron, the Donald and Mickey Transformers and their Disney Channel mascot Drossel (a robotic teenage girl) and meanwhile, American Disney's idea of making Mickey cool for the kids is this crap.

 

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
I haven't seen anyone explicitly say it but I assume that based on the plans this is going to have a KUKA element, right? Like Sum Of All Thrills + Soarin = This ride....a kind of "stationary" loaded version of Forbidden Journey? Load times will have to be an issue but the use of that ride system might explain the separate ADA compliant theater.

Does anyone know for sure when the Universal/Raytheon exclusivity contract expires? 2016?
Also, does the contract cover construction or just operating rides featuring Kuka arms?
Are the particulars of the contract even public knowledge?
 

disneyflush

Well-Known Member
I spend a lot of time complaining to myself about how stale a vacation WDW has become so I'm pretty excited to have some movement toward making the place different in whatever degree it turns out to be.
 

cynic710

Well-Known Member
the next avatar is supposed to focus on marine life on pandora, could the c-ticket ride be a boat ride? it would be silly to think that with the river rapids already in the park we wouldnt get two rapids rides i suppose.

nonetheless, im on the side of excitment for this project. im no avatar fanoboi but i do appreciate visuals and what imangineers can do with such a creative canvas and world. i think the connection to the park will be slight but explained through love for the environment and the world you live on, pluse, the movie is basically pocahantas of the future.

why not get excited about this project? because its not a disney movie? the arguement was made already that some of the most beloved attractions at the park are not of the disney "world". such as star tours, indy, tower of terror, aerosmith, but yet all are some of our favorite rides. with the creative mind of cameron, a proven visual masterpiece in pandora and the possibilities that the creative people of disney imagineering there is no reason to believe that this will not be an amazing thing to experience for decades to come.
 

Atomicmickey

Well-Known Member
I actually do appreciate the fact that even Disney's more extreme rides don't
cross over into too much intensity. I think it's a line they do a great job straddling.
Mission Space, excepted, IMO. It's a safe thrill, and more family appropriate.

I don't think they want to compete with Six Flags, Universal on INTENSITY. Theming,
immersion, yes. Intensity, no.
 

doctornick

Well-Known Member
I actually do appreciate the fact that even Disney's more extreme rides don't
cross over into too much intensity. I think it's a line they do a great job straddling.
Mission Space, excepted, IMO. It's a safe thrill, and more family appropriate.

I don't think they want to compete with Six Flags, Universal on INTENSITY. Theming,
immersion, yes. Intensity, no.

Agreed. I think Disney does well in that their "thrill" rides are accessable to most people with normal tolerances. It's much more about the story and presentation than the killer G's throttling you from side to side. That makes it a much more inclusive theme park experience, which is what was the goal of DL to begin with.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
28 pages?

We call that a good start at Team Spirit. Hats off to the community.

I'm sorry, but I don't have time to go thru all of them. I did see one about Merfie running to Jason Garcia, what a waste that is.

But anyone who thinks Disney (or big forces in Disney) didn't want this released aren't reading along here and so many places on the Internet today. ... The pages, btw, didn't even have any security imbedded in them (as I'm sure at least one or two of you noticed).

Meanwhile, in what I'm sure is just a total coinkydink, this very site has news today of Disney's rehiring of the leader of the rockwork/enviormental design for the project.

I've figured out that the issue here with many (see Quickee thread regarding social media or CBJ thread regarding how and why that story was planted -- btw, that word does not mean CONSPIRACY, it just means how business is done at this level) that there just is a fundamental disconnect here and the fan community in general not understanding how companies like Disney operate. Or not wanting to understand, which is kind of understandable. ... But many are missing things in their obstinance and desire to be right even when they're not.

BTW, Flynnibus nailed the point of why you leak something early on ... but I don't know where that post is and don't have time to find it.

Now ... back to debating what kind of rides these will be.

Oh, and as Lee said, nothing here precludes another attraction from being added OUTSIDE this building or in a Phase II, although we all know that Phase II's never happen at Disney Parks.

Carry on ... look forward to another 54 pages by tomorrow!
 

Tom

Beta Return
I'm going to chime in again, if for no other reason than to clear up a few of the misnomers and misconceptions being batted around. Lee and others have done a nice job giving yes and no answers to specific details, but since these drawings have obviously saturated the web already, there are hundreds or thousands of people interpreting them improperly.

I'm not boasting, but since I draft, design and build commercial buildings for a living, I feel like topics like this are my one and only time to shine and call myself an "expert". I am by no means an insider. I just know exactly what I'm looking at when I see collections of documents like the ones people are seeing today.

Speaking of these drawings, those little color-coded plans are from an 8.5x11 document that the mechanical engineer produced, showing how many air conditioning units would be needed for the project. Those colored areas are actually HVAC zones, and mean nothing else. And the plans that those colors have been placed on are not exactly identical to the working drawings, but they do imply portions of the ride system, where the architectural ones do not.

There are also foundation and structural steel drawings. There are massive foundations with auger-cast piles under each of the four ride apparatuses. This tells me that the ride system is very similar to soarin, in that there is a massive undercarriage that holds up what will likely be a moving set of seats. Whether it just tilts like Soarin, or is on a series of hydraulic cylinders like Star Tours - I don't know.

With this said, I would like to offer some bullet point facts (and inferences) that should clear up some of the questions, and bad information being circulated:

  • As of this moment in time, the set of plans and narratives that contractors possess are limited only to this one large building, which contains what Disney is calling an E-Ticket and a C-Ticket. Those words are used throughout the entire set of documents.
  • The C-Ticket APPEARS to be a boat ride, given the meandering course of the ride path as it comes into and leaves the northeast corner of the main building. The vehicles look like boats as well. Calling it a C-Ticket on the plans doesn't give me warm fuzzies. They couldn't do anything less than a Pirates type attraction (which I consider to have extensive theming), but I'm wondering if they'd use their new boat maneuvering patent which allows them to turn a boat and aim guests like an Omnimover does. That would make a lot of sense if they're taking you on a tour through Pandora.
  • The E-Ticket has four isolated theaters, with four isolated ride systems. In no way, shape or form will guests move from one theater to another. They will operate exclusive of each other and there are four purely for the sake of crowd control and throughput. There is one queue that splits guests, via ramps, to one of 3 tiers of loading platforms in each theater. Very similar to soarin, except you board on 3 levels instead of one, and there are 4 theaters instead of 2.
  • There are comments in the narratives that explain to the contractors that the following components of this land will exist, but have not yet been drawn: E-Ticket Retail, QSR, Area Retail, Area Restrooms, Conditioned Queue for C-Ticket.
  • There is also a note in the narrative that the north face of the building will interface with rockscape. And given that the structural steel at the top of the 76' tall building is tapered inward, it becomes clear that this will resemble a mountain of some sort and will literally be covered in rockwork and other thematic elements.
  • The C-Ticket boat ride is only shown in part (a very small part of what can be assumed to be a much longer boat ride). The rest of the ride will likely be under the exterior part of the mountain (north face of building), since guests for the E-Ticket climb a ramp (with a 1:13 slope - making the entire queue wheelchair accessible) and enter the main show building at the 3rd floor, 23' above ground level.
  • The C-Ticket will have it's own queue, and the E-Ticket clearly has its own queue, and all theaters exit down stairways and usher guests back out a single exit point at the north face of the building. There is no cross connection between these two attractions. They are mutually exclusive, and one is not a pre-show for the other.
  • Again, the ride system for the E-Ticket is not clear at all. In the Mechanical Narrative, seats can be identified, but quantities are indiscernible. It is 100% clear that each theater will have 3 tiers of seating, each 12' apart, vertically. It is likely that the carriage may in fact travel up and down, but all guests are looking forward at one arced screen, like in Soarin.
  • The E-Ticket is most assuredly a 3D experience, simply because there are rooms on the floorplan labeled GLASSES STORAGE and GLASSES CLEANING. Kind of a dead giveaway.
  • There are many ride control rooms, a control tower, and several Electrical Rooms on the lower BOH (Back of House) levels. If they're going to use a Jim Cameron produced film using his Morpho technology, they will indeed have the massive electrical and telecommunication infrastructure to operate it.
  • This attraction/land will require a large Cast. There are multi-seat restrooms, a cast break room, and even a cast deployment room. The BOH floor in this building will likely be the home base for all Cast working this land.
  • And to reiterate, what is shown on these plans could be for literally anything. It could become a Little Mermaid attraction. It could become Avatar. It could become a giant flight simulation movie putting the guest in the role of a butterfly. It could be for something none of us have even dreamed of. Perhaps even concepts from Beastly Kingdom. Regardless of the rumors, insider information, renderings, talks of Cameron being in Anaheim - these drawings have absolutely NO firm reference to or promise of an Avatar land. I can't make that more clear. These plans have been so carefully prepared that this facility could have any video plopped into the projectors with a new ride vehicle program - and it becomes anything. And a boat ride.....in an Animal Park.....could be ANYTHING.
Everything I've said above is true and factual (except for my obvious editorials and assumptions, which I've called out). This is not opinion. This is fact based on my professional review of the plans, narratives, scopes of work, and other documents - as of this moment in time.

Nothing has been filed with the drainage board. I don't believe any site development plans have been issued to anyone. All we know is that FotLK might move, and they flew one test balloon in the area where this would go. That's all we know, until Disney says otherwise, or they actually build it.

If anyone would like additional clarifications, or if I missed one of the misnomers going around, feel free to PM me.

The end.
 

drew81

Well-Known Member
Good point, whether one is into avatar or not it should at least be worthwhile. What about the statement over at wdwfanboys about VOTLM becoming Phineus and Ferb? Please tell this is not just another meetngreet as a replacement for that show?

I posted this some time ago. Mermaid will be replaced with a Phineas and Ferb show.
 

cynic710

Well-Known Member
I'm going to chime in again, if for no other reason than to clear up a few of the misnomers and misconceptions being batted around. Lee and others have done a nice job giving yes and no answers to specific details, but since these drawings have obviously saturated the web already, there are hundreds or thousands of people interpreting them improperly.

I'm not boasting, but since I draft, design and build commercial buildings for a living, I feel like topics like this are my one and only time to shine and call myself an "expert". I am by no means an insider. I just know exactly what I'm looking at when I see collections of documents like the ones people are seeing today.

Speaking of these drawings, the few sheets being posted on the web seem to have been acquired from sources completely separate from the venue through which my copy was delivered. Also, many of those out on the web have been photoshopped, had watermarks whited out, and are very low resolution.

The version I have on my computer is full-sized, original PDF files. The Architectural Plans are 48" wide by 36" tall blueprints - and I just printed a full size copy on our office plotter today. Those little color-coded plans are from an 8.5x11 document that the mechanical engineer produced, showing how many air conditioning units would be needed for the project. Those colored areas are actually HVAC zones, and mean nothing else. And the plans that those colors have been placed on are not exactly identical to the working drawings, but they do imply portions of the ride system, where the architectural ones do not.

There is also a complete set of foundation and structural steel drawings. There are massive foundations with 80' deep auger-cast piles under each of the four ride apparatuses. This tells me that the ride system is very similar to soarin, in that there is a massive undercarriage that holds up what will likely be a moving set of seats. Whether it just tilts like Soarin, or is on a series of hydraulic cylinders like Star Tours - I don't know. There flat out is NOT enough detail on these plans, no matter what anyone on here says. Period.

With this said, I would like to offer some bullet point facts (and inferences) that should clear up some of the questions, and bad information being circulated:

  • As of this moment in time, the set of plans and narratives that contractors possess are limited only to this one large building, which contains what Disney is calling an E-Ticket and a C-Ticket. Those words are used throughout the entire set of documents.

  • The C-Ticket APPEARS to be a boat ride, given the meandering course of the ride path as it comes into and leaves the northeast corner of the main building. The vehicles look like boats as well. Calling it a C-Ticket on the plans doesn't give me warm fuzzies. They couldn't do anything less than a Pirates type attraction (which I consider to have extensive theming), but I'm wondering if they'd use their new boat maneuvering patent which allows them to turn a boat and aim guests like an Omnimover does. That would make a lot of sense if they're taking you on a tour through Pandora.

  • The E-Ticket has four isolated theaters, with four isolated ride systems. In no way, shape or form will guests move from one theater to another. They will operate exclusive of each other and there are four purely for the sake of crowd control and throughput. There is one queue that splits guests, via ramps, to one of 3 tiers of loading platforms in each theater. Very similar to soarin, except you board on 3 levels instead of one, and there are 4 theaters instead of 2.

  • There are comments in the narratives that explain to the contractors that the following components of this land will exist, but have not yet been drawn: E-Ticket Retail, QSR, Area Retail, Area Restrooms, Conditioned Queue for C-Ticket.

  • There is also a note in the narrative that the north face of the building will interface with rockscape. And given that the structural steel at the top of the 76' tall building is tapered inward, it becomes clear that this will resemble a mountain of some sort and will literally be covered in rockwork and other thematic elements.

  • The C-Ticket boat ride is only shown in part (a very small part of what can be assumed to be a much longer boat ride). The rest of the ride will likely be under the exterior part of the mountain (north face of building), since guests for the E-Ticket climb a ramp (with a 1:13 slope - making the entire queue wheelchair accessible) and enter the main show building at the 3rd floor, 23' above ground level.

  • The C-Ticket will have it's own queue, and the E-Ticket clearly has its own queue, and all theaters exit down stairways and usher guests back out a single exit point at the north face of the building. There is no cross connection between these two attractions. They are mutually exclusive, and one is not a pre-show for the other.

  • Again, the ride system for the E-Ticket is not clear at all. In the Mechanical Narrative, seats can be identified, but quantities are indiscernible. It is 100% clear that each theater will have 3 tiers of seating, each 12' apart, vertically. It is likely that the carriage may in fact travel up and down, but all guests are looking forward at one arced screen, like in Soarin.

  • The E-Ticket is most assuredly a 3D experience, simply because there are rooms on the floorplan labeled GLASSES STORAGE and GLASSES CLEANING. Kind of a dead giveaway.

  • There are many ride control rooms, a control tower, and several Electrical Rooms on the lower BOH (Back of House) levels. If they're going to use a Jim Cameron produced film using his Morpho technology, they will indeed have the massive electrical and telecommunication infrastructure to operate it.

  • This attraction/land will require a large Cast. There are multi-seat restrooms, a cast break room, and even a cast deployment room. The BOH floor in this building will likely be the home base for all Cast working this land.

  • And to reiterate, what is shown on these plans could be for literally anything. It could become a Little Mermaid attraction. It could become Avatar. It could become a giant flight simulation movie putting the guest in the role of a butterfly. It could be for something none of us have even dreamed of. Perhaps even concepts from Beastly Kingdom. Regardless of the rumors, insider information, renderings, talks of Cameron being in Anaheim - these drawings have absolutely NO firm reference to or promise of an Avatar land. I can't make that more clear. These plans have been so carefully prepared that this facility could have any video plopped into the projectors with a new ride vehicle program - and it becomes anything. And a boat ride.....in an Animal Park.....could be ANYTHING.
Everything I've said above is true and factual (except for my obvious editorials and assumptions, which I've called out). This is not opinion. This is fact based on my professional review of the plans, narratives, scopes of work, and other documents - as of this moment in time.


Nothing has been filed with the drainage board. I don't believe any site development plans have been issued to anyone. All we know is that FotLK might move, and they flew one test balloon in the area where this would go. That's all we know, until Disney says otherwise, or they actually build it.

If anyone would like additional clarifications, or if I missed one of the misnomers going around, feel free to reply (or better yet, PM me). I will not disclose how I obtained the drawings, but I will make note that the construction industry can be tight knit. Florida and Indiana and California may be worlds apart geographically, but not in the electronic world.

The end.


somebody, pay the man, i feel smarter for reading this.
 

afar28

Well-Known Member
I didn't get to see it and I don't really wanna read thru most of the thread, so can someone give me a rundown on what it looked like? Or a link to te pic?
 

Beholder

Well-Known Member
It makes sense that the center piece in any Cameron related theme park endeavor would be, at it's core, a film. Throughout his career he's pushed the boundaries of filming technology and it seems to be his driving inspiration. Avatar is known best perhaps for it's cutting edge 3D and digital film process, so it's likely JC wanted to showcase any and all of his technology regarding movie making. May not be what we'd all want in regards to an attraction, but it could prove to be a surprisingly good experience.
 

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